"Read alcoholics don't have cravings" says AA frie

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Hi All,
Tried to post this before--something happened. My friend in AA who is 15 months sober after drinking two bottles of gin a day for many years tells me that "real alcoholics don't have cravings. They laugh at that idea." But why do they relapse sometimes and go back to drinking, I asked. She said it is because their emotional pain gets the better of them and then they know that alcohol is handy to make it all go away for the moment. As long as you keep yourself emotionally stable you are ok. It's not about cravings, she said. She says she has none. I would love Dr. Garcia and JB to comment on this as well as all the others. This surprised me to say the least.

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"Read alcoholics don't have cravings" says AA frie

Re: "Read alcoholics don't have cravings" says AA

:rolleyes
Ok Let's try turning this one around... if there was no such thing as cravings in this world... would there be alcoholics?

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"Read alcoholics don't have cravings" says AA frie

Re: "Read alcoholics don't have cravings" says AA

Judy,

I totally agree. That's why I was so surprised. I mean, don't people drink when they're celebrating as well as when they're miserable? Any excuse, right? That's addiction as I understand it and it starts with craving, that little voice that says, hey, let's have a nice drinkie. But she insists and claims that all the alcoholics she knows in AA say that it's not cravings. So go figure!

Ned

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"Read alcoholics don't have cravings" says AA frie

Re: "Read alcoholics don't have cravings" says AA

You are a true Sage, Jude. I bow to you.

Luv Hug, Chrysa

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"Read alcoholics don't have cravings" says AA frie

Re: "Read alcoholics don't have cravings" says AA

What is that joke ..."How do you tell who is lying at an AA meeting?" Ans: "Whoever has their mouth open!."

Jude --Is it OK if I call you Jude or not.? Tell the truf now! I just love that name -- you know --- "Hey Jude" ..back in my day..my favorite song..oh-oh told my age -but but...so ..so...so what...you'd be surprised

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"Read alcoholics don't have cravings" says AA frie

Re: "Read alcoholics don't have cravings" says AA

Hi Ivy,

I can see your friends point, although I've never heard that before. For me the physical cravings absolutely did subside after the initial withdrawal period. But you'd really have to define "craving" to get into the rest of it. I still have a desire to drink at times, and if you call desire a "craving" then yes, I still have cravings that are emotionally centered - we call them triggers around here I think. I'm not surprised that she has no physical cravings now that she's not drinking. That's the nature of our bodies (if not our minds) - we don't crave what we don't ingest.

Also, is your friend talking about sober alcoholics in AA, or "active" alcoholics? Who are the "real alcoholics" anyway? Only the people that don't have cravings? That will be good news to a lot of people here! I know for sure I had full on cravings everyday when I was dependent on alcohol - physical & emotional. But I don't mind at all not being a "real alcoholic"! :lol

There are other reasons why people relapse too, not only to escape emotional pain. I've read that a common reason in early sobriety is to find out if you can drink normally, to double check your alcoholic status I guess. Once you gain a sense of well being after a period of abstinence, apparently it's common to forget the reasons why you quit in the first place, so some people have to make sure they have a drinking problem before they continue with getting better.

Anyway, this seems like it may just be about semantics - craving, schmaving, right? We're all looking for a way to live well, with or without alcohol. AA doesn't have all the answers for everyone, they're just the most dominant voice out there right now. You don't have to agree with them. The important thing is to find what makes sense for you.

Peace,
Deirdre

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"Read alcoholics don't have cravings" says AA frie

Re: "Read alcoholics don't have cravings" says AA

Beautifully stated Deirdre.
Thanks, Miss Layla

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"Read alcoholics don't have cravings" says AA frie

Re: "Read alcoholics don't have cravings" says AA

Deirdre, I'd have to say, yep YEP, YEP! Pretty much says what I would've liked to, just not as patient ....thank you! :b
I'm a firm believer in people having their own opinion... but I do have a hard time with someone stating "yes/no... black/white:... craving/ no craving... alcoholic/not alcoholic... AA/ not AA, ..... And speaking in terms of absolutes... or for the whole group, sorry, I don't buy it. I have been(and still attend AA), from time to time, and I don't appreciate being told what "I feel or don't". I would say "nothin personal", but I guess it really kinda is...:rolleyes

"In dealing with other people remember the three C's: You didn't cause it, you can't control it, and you can't cure it."
Lorna P.

Today, I will allow others the dignity of living as they wish to live.

kinda appropriate quotations for my daily meditaions book! May 27 .... Peace & hugs, Judie

Oh yeh, Ivy I do drink when I'm happy, sad, anxious, nervous, delighted, bummed out, definately after a hard night @ work.... Go figur!!! Maybe someday, We'll get it straight!!
It's always good to question... rather than just wonder where else "I might have more booze hidden" (like the "olden dayz"), only 5 months ago! seems like a lifetime though!:b

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"Read alcoholics don't have cravings" says AA frie

Re: "Read alcoholics don't have cravings" says AA

Hi All,

I am not sure about "real alcoholics" and cravings, and Deirdre I think you are right, it depends on your definition of a craving. Yesterday I very easily could have drank after nine weeks of not drinking. I was upset true, so the the emotional aspect was most definitely present. However even though I have not had a drink in nine weeks I could swear there was more than an emotional component to what I was feeling.

But I agree, in the end, what does it really matter. It is all about finding what works best for you and what you can be happy living with, because at the end of the day, the only one looking you back in the mirror is YOU!

Donna

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"Read alcoholics don't have cravings" says AA frie

Re: "Read alcoholics don't have cravings" says AA

Well done Deirdre. Thank you.

PS. An old addiction counselor actually told me that joke.

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"Read alcoholics don't have cravings" says AA frie

Re: "Read alcoholics don't have cravings" says AA

I am too biased I think, My dad is a recovering alcohol of 21 years (well let's say 20 now because now he taken to taking nips of Nyquil even though he won't admit it). Anyway I was 17 when he started going to AA and there were no other optins at that time. He went to rehab for 30 days and the started going to AA meetingmaybe twice a day in the beginnig and while he was in rehab the family was going to Alanon meeting. pain in the ass for a 17 year old girl whose mom was just diagnosed with a brain tumour but that diagnoses made him go over the age (but he drank our entire lives and was quite abusive to us).

Over the course of the next several years I would attend his anniversary meetings, 90 days, one year 2 years, etc, he would get pins and angels and what not. He would tell his story (never th whole story) and everyone would say aww and you go Mike and this and that, the room was filled with cigarette smoke. The I'd hear frightening stories of other people, like nothing I've heard on here, and nothing someone my age should have been listening to frankly in a really gross room that smelled of 3 hour old coffee and was foogy with cigs.

Anyway we noticed a change in my dad but it wasn't a good one. He never came home, he just hung out with these people all the time, he bought a 10 speed and took up biking, was on the phone a lot . And we was still th same judgemental f-er he was before he was just "sober' and pissed that my mom was sick and that h had to deal with this situation so he escaped from it anyway. He became very selfish and I found it to be a very selfish program, it was all me me me I have to take care of myself first and my sobriety, meanwhile my mom is laid out on the sofa with a brain tumour and he is going out for bike rides with people we barely knew and I suspected he was cheating which is a big no no in AA ( think he past the no no stage in the AA handbook though). My mom grew more resentful of him and they had a huge fight and he became physical of her (which he never really did before he only did with us to my knowledge) and he spit in her face and hit her in her head, and this was a woman who lived in agony with horrible head pain so I came running out and she told me what happened and he left the room. he went into him and called him a bastard for doing that and then he clocked me in the eye and gave me a black eye. The next day my big brother called my father in the a.m. and told him that if he didn't leave willingly he make him leave for him, because the entire night before I kept telling him to get out and he kept telling me, "you don't tell ME what to do". That was the night my mom out I smoked (lol). Anyway this is why I hated AA. it had turned out all along my suspicions were true, he moved out and right into another AA woman's apt, and my mom died about a year later because he was too weak and selfish to stick it out and do it. I was 23 and had to work two jobs and about a month before she died I quit both of them because my older brother moved back in to help me. My oldest brother has not spoken to him since then (1992), I spoke to him about 4 years later and now we are estarnged again because of this Nyquil this which is a whole other story. This is why I hate AA.Sorry it was such a long story.
.

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"Read alcoholics don't have cravings" says AA frie

Re: "Read alcoholics don't have cravings" says AA

Patty,

I completely appreciate your story. I have no experience personally with AA (except one women's meeting I went to many years ago with someone. That was ok), but I have the feeling it is a me, me, me, thing as you said. My sobriety first and f... you. Although they are supposed to make amends aren't they? I guess some use it as an excuse as your dad did. Now I can understand your anger at him.

Let me share this: I said before I have a disabled son (though he's much better now). But when he was at his sickest, I could barely stand to live and that's when I began drinking. I went to an analyst/psychiatrist for two years. He taught me one thing that really saved my life: learn to separate or compartmentalize the bad thing in your life so that it doesn't become the snowball at the center and keep on picking up everything else, merging with it, until you have a big ball of bad. I was finally able to do that. I can enjoy the parts of my life to be enjoyed. I still like that bottle of wine, but I could have been far, far worse. I think now it is about changing my body/brain chemistry as they say here.

Thanks all for your wise comments. Yes, it is all about semantics. My AA friend who is a poor person living in a wealthy area keeps mentioning how wealthy her AA people are. Like who cares? But obviously she thinks this is a better class of drunk? To a degree I understand because where she was before they had a lot of court-mandated cases who were scary. Oh, well. I hope I can do it here, guys, and not have to go to that organization.

Ned/Ivy

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"Read alcoholics don't have cravings" says AA frie

Re: "Read alcoholics don't have cravings" says AA

Wow Patty, I knew, you had metioned a bit about your Father, before, but my God. That breaks my heart, reading your story. You must have an incredibly strong spirit...
Not that I don't appreciate my Family... but hearing something like that, sure can put things in perspective, as far as enjoying what we've got. Thank you.

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"Read alcoholics don't have cravings" says AA frie

Re: "Read alcoholics don't have cravings" says AA

Ned,
How did you learn to isolate the bad thing so it wasn't at the center any more. I think all of us could learn from this, would you mind sharing?

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"Read alcoholics don't have cravings" says AA frie

Re: "Read alcoholics don't have cravings" says AA

Somebody is out of their gourd here. I didn't start drinking because of cravings, but I can tell the world that I didn't stop because of cravings, yes, I said cravings and more cravings. If I didn't have these horrible cravings every time I have tried to quit on my own, I wouldn't be here today spilling my guts to everyone on this site, and RJ probably would never have written her book. E.