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    Tough Love...take it or leave it.

    Before I offend, I want to say that this post is only to try and help people and nothing more. But as some people do not like "tough love" some may not like what I have to say.

    I have been torn the last couple of months about responding to certain threads and posts because so many people are easily offended. Alcoholism makes us all extremely vulnerable. But it seems some people only want you to answer their cries for help only if you tell them what they want to hear. I think this sort of negativity is very unhealthy for all of us and it is a really bad example for any new members. And it's only because of this, that I have chosen to put this in a separate thread and not respond to a number of posts.

    Here it goes.....


    Getting sober takes work! I know most of you are thinking "no kidding". But I am dead serious. Too many people seem to be "disenchanted" that they are not sober even though they have been here awhile. I am really talking about people who want to drink, but want us to tell them it's ok over and over again. We are not helping them, we are not helping ourselves and more importantly this is not helping the new members.

    But please listen up only if you really want
    to be healthy and sober.....

    It takes work! A lot of work!! We are given the tools; meds, supps, books, cds but these are not magic
    . There is no magic pill or supps. They are only to help aide the process. They are not going to fix the problem for you
    . It takes work, commitment and determination. There is no room for "poor me" and excuses. If you can not see past your own dark self pity, than you will never be able to see the bright future that you can have if you really want it.

    If you don't change your own habits and actions, you will spend a lot more time struggling to find your way out. Nobody can do this for you.

    People slip after trying awhile. And many people slip more than once. But they pick themselves up and get back on the wagon! And we all can understand what they are going through. This is part of the recovery process for many. But the point is that they got back on the wagon.

    Only you can help you. If you don't want to put in the work, and I mean every single day, then no one here can help you.

    All I'm asking is for people to face reality. You can talk the talk, but now it's time to walk the walk.

    Love, Me
    :l
    Alcohol is simply the device between success and failure.

    #2
    Tough Love...take it or leave it.

    god damn.

    :applaud::applaud: i was waiting for something like this! Lets be thankful for Thankful's Post. I cannot agree with you more about what you have said. This board is not the same as of lately. And YES indeed sobriety is dead serious work! There isn't much more i am going to add before i get "WHACKED" in the head with a shovel! Thankful, i just want to say i am very proud of you to post this. Takes BALLS to tell it the way it really is..You can talk the talk, but now it's time to walk the walk. That means putting it all in to action and doing what we talk about on a daily basis? right? I don't how to respond to a post sometimes as i am unsure if the writer is truly interested in the subject of alcoholism? You cannot help if they are not honest. Its a waste of valuable time. As a reader i can see within a writing right away if it is genuine in need or not, i am getting much..much better. There are also some hateful people who are chasing gas driving themselves crazy. And there are the nice ones, you know who you are. Love to the good...please get help for the not so good. XXOO

    Comment


      #3
      Tough Love...take it or leave it.

      I want to respond ... but need to compose a great thought on it. having been a member of tough love via my daughter...

      and it is

      "walk the talk"

      I'm glad you feel you have found salvation thru tough love.
      Sunny Out Looks are Contagious!

      Comment


        #4
        Tough Love...take it or leave it.

        i couldn't sleep and woke up and checked in. well, i do find i come to mwo less and less and much of it is because i really don't think there is much i can add to these posts. there is a lot of what you speak that has nothing to do with the newbies. but i find how do i participate? well i can't add to the thread because it is like a broken record. i know where this person has been for months and months and i know where this will go. there is no change. so what to say? and then this game of how do i moderate for this type of individual who clearly can't. i know i couldn't. i just realized wow, 120 days just came and went while i write this. so, here to say that it takes work or in my case it takes not thinking about it or when i do not taking that first drink. this week even i thought of it as everyone looked like they are having such a good time but with 4 months. nope, not going to do that. and, i wonder at what point does one read all of their posts and realize they are just trading deck chairs on the titanic? how long do you want to play this game? how much of life are you willing to lose for this game called alcohol. is it worth everything that you are giving up and all that you don't even know you are giving up? is it worth your relationships? is it worth your self respect and self esteem? and why would i feel sorry for you? i feel compassion as to what the dance does but i can't feel much else when i know for me at least i got help and i have no more urge to drink. was it expensive yes. but was it worth my life? yes. how funny it is to me that people come to me and say well i have my doubts and blah blah blah. okay, that's fine but i have 4 months with freedom and no thoughts of alcohol cept an occasional humm. that is totally different from drinking myself stupid everyday which is what i once did. so some may choose to battle it out everyday and not drink, some may choose as i did to have it gone completely and recalibrate their system, some may find freedom in all the goods and also may find freedom in moderation. but true power freedom and peace of mind comes from living your life with integrity inside of giving your word to something and honoring it. that means " no matter what". and until you truly have that. you aren't free. as i said i have compassion for what the hell must be like to be on the continual hampster wheel. but i think a good dose of w.t.f. is in order when you look in the mirror. it's my life and only my life. and what the hell am i doing to myself and everyone around me. and no, it is not the bottles fault. it is entirely up to you to get the power you need over it or to remove it's hold on you completely.
        :welcome:

        Comment


          #5
          Tough Love...take it or leave it.

          To me it's not about 'tough' love but real love. If you care you have to let the addict come to their own solution. A detox centre I was in a few years back gave my then partner a handout on 'Tough Love'. It was then used against me when I relapsed. When I say used, I mean used - as in refusing to see me or have anything to do with me because I had drank and I had to suffer the consequences for a while. All that did was make me lonely, and want to drink even more. It just didn't get us anywhere.

          I am with someone different now and recently, before I got to the rehab where I got AF finally - he didn't use the 'Tough' approach, he just let me get on with my drinking. Ok occasionally he let me know what a pain I was drunk but knew he couldn't change this - only I could. Eventually I got myself in such a state something went, and finally I let go of alcohol. I don't believe that would have happened without the 'slack' I was cut that let me start to destroy myself.

          I prefer 'true' to 'tough' where love is concerned.

          Comment


            #6
            Tough Love...take it or leave it.

            I think it all depends on the individual at hand. Some people no matter how hard they hit bottom only relapse again if shown tough love, others thrive on it. You really have to evaluate the person at hand and try each approach to find out for them personally. On the internet it's a bit harder, all you really see is print; you can't see the persons bodily actions, their facial expressions... Myself personally, I respond to both. It all depends on the day. But, your post was excellent and I can see your point. Some people need that, and the hand holding is not helping them.

            Comment


              #7
              Tough Love...take it or leave it.

              UKBlonde,

              I am with you. If people had given me tough love or "take it or leave it," before I was truly ready mentally to quit, I would have left.

              And where would I be then?

              I'll leave the tough love and take the real love.

              All the "hard work" in the world did not get me sober. Sobriety is NOT hard work it is commitment and dedication that some of us take a long time to achieve despite our brains telling us otherwise.

              Thank God AA doesn't tell us to take it or leave it. Thank God Mags, Chief, Mary, Flip, Bear, Nibs, TNT, Hippie, Breez, More2, July, Tawny, Lucky, Lushy, Starlight, Janice, Satori, Wonder, BB, Kathy, Bird, LUV, Det, Dx, Neil, countless others too numerous to name and my hubby didn't say "take it or leave it."

              For all those out there who are struggling. Keep on trying. I, for one, don't mind putting out my hand when I know you are vacilating and equivocating and not ready to give up the drink. My hope is that one day you will be and we will all be here to cheer you on. I know that as long as you are thinking about it and considering it, at any time some little spark may ignite that will turn into a fire in your heart and mind and you will finally find freedom from this addiction.

              For those who have achieved sobriety and are fighting every day to maintain it, we know that we must stay vigilant and keep on the course. For those who have not achieved it yet, please know it will come if you keep thinking about it and trying. Kathy said it took her almost a year and look at her now!! She is a SOLAR ORBITER!! We watched Det triumph and struggle and triumph again (oh, I never once saw Dx say "take it or leave it." She waited with patience and love and worry and concern.) Bear was here for almost a year before his final binge. LUV fell after 7 months and is right back on the horse.

              All of us here are in various stages of recovery: years sober, months sober, days sober, minutes sober. Many here will slip, relapse and start again.

              I am here for all of you and I know that most of you are here for me.

              I thank God every day for that. You give me hope against the one option I never want to face: failure.

              Love,
              Cindi
              AF April 9, 2016

              Comment


                #8
                Tough Love...take it or leave it.

                Hey, folks. Thanks for the feedback. It's nice to see a difference of opionions without an all out brawl. I think it is very healthy to communicate when we at least can respect each other's opinion and have the courtesy to hear each other out.

                I do just want to make one clarification. The phrase "take it or leave it" only refers to my post. I'm not implying that anyone leave MWO! I would never, ever want someone to think this.

                If you only focus on the "take it or leave it" perhaps you missed the point of the post. There is a much bigger message trying to be conveyed.

                Anyone with a drinking problem, who really wants help (no matter what stage they are at) should absolutely be here getting it. I don't care if it takes them years. I don't care how many times someone slips when they keep trying! My point was people "really wanting the help". Let's face it, there are some who want to be told, "poor baby, it's ok you drank". And there are many of my posts that convey that to the people I feel really want the help and who are really trying. Those are the key words "who really want help" and "who are really trying". I know I am putting myself out there. This is just my opinion. I want so badly for this to be a healthy place for all.

                One of the huge reasons I posted this was the number of PMs I have received lately. People who hardly ever post, or new people wanting some help and they don't want to throw "their own pity parties and look like others" (not my words, btw). It's very disheartening to see attention taken away from people who desparately want and need to be consoled. There are so many new people who get maybe get 5 replies, while people continue to rally around others that get replies in the 20's and even 40's on a daily basis. Let's get serious about why we are here. It's a forum to help yourself get healthy and hopfully help others to do the same.

                I was very afraid that the wrong people would take offense to this, but I guess there was no way around that.

                Love, Me
                :l
                Alcohol is simply the device between success and failure.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Tough Love...take it or leave it.

                  You cannot help if they are not honest.
                  Excellant point Ripple. Well said.

                  Love, Me
                  :l
                  Alcohol is simply the device between success and failure.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Tough Love...take it or leave it.

                    all we need is love (and a lot of help and understandng)

                    :new:

                    Just like to say i agree with uk blonde and gia, we dont need some kind of bootcamp attitude we need sincerity, love and a lot of understanding!
                    :wave:

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Tough Love...take it or leave it.

                      Mystified ~ Welcome. You will find a lot of love, help and understanding here. No doubt about it.

                      Thank you very much for jumping right on with an opinion. I love when new people start posting right away. But my post refers to issues of the past few months. So please understand that I am not suggesting we run a bootcamp. lol You would have to have been around awhile to see where I and others are coming from.

                      I'm glad you are here seeking help. We are here for you, truly. And I don't bite. But I am honest if nothing else.

                      Good luck to you.

                      Love, Me
                      :l
                      Alcohol is simply the device between success and failure.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Tough Love...take it or leave it.

                        Thankful,

                        Thank you for this post. I have been here for a few months and occasionally I am struck by some of the posts. I know this is going to upset some...but I'm going to say it anyway...some seem like they are seeking attention rather than seeking help. I think it takes real friends to tell a person what she needs to hear rather than what she wants to hear.

                        I don't reply to a lot of posts merely b/c there are so many who are much further along this road than I am. All the tools are here, I cannot provide the commitment this journey requires.

                        Beck - (85 days sober)
                        Beck

                        Sometimes you get there in spite of your route, losing track of your life and what it's about, the road seems to know when to straighten right out...Mary Chapin Carpenter

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Tough Love...take it or leave it.

                          Thankful,
                          This is a wonderful thread. I MYSELF have thrown pity parties. Yes, some rotten things came my way over the past two years, BUT...rotten things happen and other people do not drink themselves in to a stuper. After getting some tough love, I did some real soul searching. I have been here for awhile and seen many people succeed and many fail. I was one of those people seeking attention. It is not OK to keep killing yourself and by drinking, that is what we are doing. It took a couple of GOOD, honest people to really say "girl, you are killing yourself", for me to wake-up. I am not CURED by any means, but I am trying! I hope and pray we all have many sober days! (but..the bottom line is...it is HARD darn work)
                          Forever loved, forever missed Papa Bear

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Tough Love...take it or leave it.

                            Hallelujah!!! Someone really get's it!!!

                            some seem like they are seeking attention rather than seeking help. I think it takes real friends to tell a person what she needs to hear rather than what she wants to hear.
                            Thank you, Beck.



                            Secondchance, I have to admit part of the reason for this post is because you and 2 other people who have already left are tired of this sort of thing. It saddens me beyond belief. But people must do what is best for them and if they no longer feel like this is a healthy place to be, than they should go in peace and be well.

                            Love, Me
                            :l
                            Alcohol is simply the device between success and failure.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Tough Love...take it or leave it.

                              I'm not going to comment on the initial part of the thread cos I am a bit of a fence sitter anyway and I can see the views in both 'sides' of this debate but I am bit puzzled sometimes when there are complaints about threads that people don't like to read because they are whiney, attention seeking, not trying etc. Is it a bit too simplistic to say, don't read them then?

                              I'm honestly not being as sarcastic as that sounds. It's a bit like tv. If you think there is a load of rubbish on.... apart from the history and nature programmes, then just watch the history and nature programmes. Switch the rest off. Stick with the posts from the people you consider truly inspirational and supportive. The posts that suit you and you want to read. There are no rules to say you must read and respond to every post or that you need to approve of every post or poster. In the same way we can pick and choose different tools, approaches and attitudes to deal with our problem with alcohol (the only reason surely we have all ended up here) we can also pick and choose what we read and who we respond to. Cherry pick the bits you want. Don't even bother with the bits you don't want. But don't leave or complain just cos others don't post what you want to read. Just ignore it.

                              And if somebody leaves here because they don't like what some people post then they cannot be of any help to anyone at all who comes on here. And presumably they must have had help in their early days in order to be strong and sober enough to leave. If they stay and just cut the crap out then they can still be here to help and payback some of the support they have received.

                              Overly simplistic and off the initial topic somewhat. I hope I haven't offended anyone.
                              I'll get my coat.........

                              Bessie xx

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