Powerless vs Power

[AAthlete]

The statement "I am powerless over alcohol" has been bandied about many times on this site, with some people saying yes they are and others saying no (sometimes very definitively) they are certainly not. The phrase usually conjure up images on AA and, at least to me, is often misunderstood or applied too broadly.

I looked up the definition of powerless in Mirram-Webster's Online Dictionary and it defines it as:

1 : devoid of strength or resources
2 : lacking the authority or capacity to act

If I take the first definition and apply it to my alcoholic problem and I admit that I am powerless of alcohol, then I am saying that I am devoid of the strength or resources needed to combat my drinking problem on my own. Before I go on let me clarify that admitting we are powerless over alcohol is not a lifelong commitment - it simply means at this moment in time we don't have the needed resources to address a specific problem by ourselves.

So, let's say that were were to admit it, then what is the answer to not having power? It is to become empowered - but the question is how? In AA people admit they are powerless, and then come to believe that a higher power can restore them to sanity. That power in AA is God, but a higher power can be anything! So, let's look at the definition of a higher power for a second. A higher power is a power that is greater than us, but realize that it doesn't have to be any type of deity. If I am suffering from cancer don't I turn to a group of doctors and nurses to solve a problem that I cannot solve myself? Isn't that by definition then a power greater than me?

Well, isn't that what we are doing here? Didn't we admit to ourselves (at least on some level) that we don't have the power to beat this problem all by ourselves and so we joined MWO? We are turning to a collective power that is greater than we are individually to get better. The wonderful thing about it is that we can gain power we are seeking to beat our problem right here, by relying on the wisdom of others to help us through the difficulties we are facing. Additionally, once we found that power and become stronger we can then share it with others who may be suffering.

So, you may or may not agree with being powerless - and that is your choice. But, don't automatically assume that looking for power means turning to God for answers or surrendering your spirit for the rest of your life. We are simply admitting to ourselves and others that we can't do this alone.....

AAthlete

[Evie.Lou]

Powerless vs Power

I learned a long time ago that AL is way stronger than me, if I let him inside...If I keep myself EMPOWERED enough to keep the door closed, I WIN...

[bestlifeldms]

Powerless vs Power

Athlete,

Rejecting the "I am powerless" concept - at face value, is probably what delayed me attaining sobriety for years. One very strong-willed and stubborn woman- am I. I would not admit that I could not control my drinking. "I can do this, I can moderate or I can quite" were the words I uttered as unfulfilled promises to my loved ones and myself, for years. I had not failed at anything, I had put my mind to, in my life. Why this? How? Not possible. We all know the outcome. It wasn't until I "surrendered" - my interpretation - and admitted that I cannot drink alcohol like other people can, I cannot drink. That is when I became successful with sobriety. That, to me, is a form of the "I am powerless" concept to which you speak. That is what it took for me. Not only was I weary from the battles, internally and externally, but I just didn't want alcohol to be my legacy. There is so much more, that I am about, that I want to offer...

Thank you for your clarification!

[retteacher]

Powerless vs Power

I too am powerless over AL. Once I've taken that first sip, I've given in to the power of AL. I absolutely believe I'm powerless over AL. In order to regain sanity, I must depend on a HP to keep me from taking that first, crucial sip. I've tried this on my own. It didn't work for me. I absolutely need MWO to help me w/this addiction. That's what I have: an addicition.

Thank you for sharing this info. I go to 12 step meetings once/twice per week. I find them important to my recovery. However, my membership in the HP of MWO has been necessary for me to stop the drinking. Reading about & sharing about drinking is what I need.

Thank you, Mary

[retteacher]

Powerless vs Power

I too said:
"I can do this on my own."

It didn't happen for more than a few days at a time. I then went back to drinking w/a vengeance. The addicition was stronger than I was. I needed the support of a group (MWO) in order for me to stop the madness.

[Sheepish]

Powerless vs Power

AAthlete
I truly appreciate your posts
-Sheep

[A Work in Progress]

Powerless vs Power

You make some very good points, AAth. The way that we interpret "powerlessness" and "higher power" make a big difference as to how helpful (or not) these ideas might be. This is one of the ways in which AA resembles a religion: it puts out some dogma, but the dogma is interpreted in various ways by its members. Without the capacity to interpret the dogma to fit individual needs, ideas, world-views, and situations, religions would quickly die out.

Interestingly, most people who quit smoking, or who recover from other compulsive and/or addictive behaviors (eating disorders, OCD), do so without adopting belief systems about powerlessness and higher powers.

But, for many people, the AA dogma about powerlessness and surrendering to a higher power has been PART of a treatment package (the AA or 12-step approach, which is multi-modal, making it difficult to discern which aspects of it are most effective, and which are not as effective) that has been helpful. For many others, it has not been helpful at all, short-term OR long-term. The statistics as to effectiveness, such as they are (this data is difficult to capture, or measure) are not encouraging.

Some have suggested that "powerlessness" as a concept is more helpful for men (and nearly all the original members of AA were men) than for women, because men are accustomed, by way of cultural conditioning, to consider themselves as relatively powerful deciders of their own destinies.... much more so than women.

Because of my professional training, I have an understanding of addictive/compulsive behaviors that has helped me to find ways to work with my own thoughts, feelings, and impulses, to stop drinking. One of the MAJOR supportive elements among those "ways" is the group here at MWO, which helps to remind me of WHY I don't drink any more (that is, it helps me to keep healthy mental habits). Writing posts to newcomers, and posts like this, helps me to keep my mind on track. Reading about the terrible situations of others who do drink... and reading posts written by those who do NOT drink, despite terrible situations... all of that helps me to keep a strong motivation to maintain my freedom from alcohol.

But I don't find it helpful to refer to this or any other group as a "higher power." It is something that helps me, just as exercise and meditation and good nutrition help me... And it helps me to understand that there is an aspect of me that has the strength, wisdom, and power (or ability) to maintain my freedom from alcohol.

Also: I really am not particularly opposed to religion, but I know that many people are, and they are (perhaps unnecessarily) turned off by the AA or 12-step approach. That's another reason that I am enthusiastic about finding and promoting approaches to solving the "addiction" problem that do not rely on some of the AA dogma.

There was a good self-help book that came out, years ago (when I was a member of AA) called, I think: Many Roads, One Journey. Or something like that. It was a helpful reminder that (as the name "My Way Out" implies) there are a lot of effective approaches to getting free from addictive/compulsive behaviors. And that's a very, very good thing!

wip

[Determinator]

Powerless vs Power

great thread AAth, thank you.

just a quick observation on the specter of al. When this toxic alkaloid enters our vascular system and brain it is no longer a separate thing. It now becomes part of us and has the resources of our entire brain to use self destructively. How can we be in power of a mind under that kind of attack?
Even the strongest army on Earth would be crippled if one of it's own generals was in league with the enemy.

For folks like us, al is a psychic parasite. You cannot reason with a parasite, it only wants to eat and multiply like all simple organisms.

[nancy]

Powerless vs Power

I guess once again I am with Work in Progress on this one.
Maybe the powerlessness concept does work for some people and maybe it is more appealing to men. I think in general that AA is more appropriate for men.

For me, I really don't want to be looking for external sources. I want to look inward for strength. I think for some people, powerlessness was what got us into the mess in the first place, looking for a substance to make us feel better, believing we don't have control over compulsions. So if that is the case, we should develop our own power inside, realizing that this is a choice and realizing that we don't have to always have an external thing telling us what to do or making us feel worthwhile.

I also don't like the concept of the Beast because it externalizes something that is actually within us. We need to create harmony inside, accepting the things we don't like, in order to gain power and peace.

I do think an argument could be made for the powerlessness concept though, as we can see by some of the responses.

[A Work in Progress]

Powerless vs Power

Det, Nancy, the argument or interpretation in favor of the "powerlessness" concept that makes the most sense (and is most helpful) to me is related to what Det said. Unlike using tobacco, or engaging in other compulsive/addictive behaviors, consuming alcohol directly acts on our brains (frontal lobes) in such a way that our judgment and our capacity to regulate our own behavior (especially to inhibit impulsivity) is quickly diminished. In THAT sense, it is entirely accurate to say that the act of consuming a single drink of alcohol can make us relatively powerless to make good decisions (especially, decisions about having a second, or third, or nineteenth drink), for so long as the alcohol is in our bodies.

That being said, other aspects of "powerlessness," particularly the requirement in AA to surrender one's will to a "higher power," is not at all related to the above, and many people do not find it helpful.

Every time I become aware of an impulse or desire to drink (or a "craving"), and I refuse to give in to that thought or impulse, I am strengthening the brain circuitry that runs between my frontal lobes and my midbrain, quieting the clamoring that is set up within the parts of the brain that are accustomed to getting dosed with alcohol, and accustomed to responding to alcohol-related cues by drinking. That is the anatomic and physiological aspect of the "inner strength" that I think Nancy is referring to. There's more to it than that, though, and the "more" includes that very "will," or commitment to be healthy and whole, that AA dogma seems to want me to "surrender."

wip

[cymru]

Powerless vs Power

Some great things to ponder tonight there peeps. Thanks

[nancy]

Powerless vs Power

Yes, this is a good one!

So to WIP, if it's a physiological problem, why is it that sometimes a single drink can trigger a binge and other times, many other times, it doesn't? What is the physical explanation for that? Let's say you have a two month period and you drink three times a week and of all those times, you only binge twice?

This is something that comes up a lot with those trying to moderate.

[Mags]

Powerless vs Power

Very thoughtful thread as always from you AA. You are such an asset to all of us here. Thanks for being here and sharing your wonderful insights with us.

As you know, I'm a terrible alkie who has been AF for several years now. So I may speak from some experience. I reject the concept of powerlessness over alcohol. I understand very well that it may feel that way in the early days of quitting. But with time, you grow within yourself and learn to live your own life without alcohol. With time, you understand that you have the power over alcohol - it does NOT have the power over you. WIP and Nancy are right, if I understand what they are saying.

The power is within ourselves all the time and not with some external thing. We all have to remember that. We are the only ones who have power over what we do and what choices we make on a minute by minute basis. YOU are the only one that decides if you are going to take that drink or not. Alcohol does not decide that for you. You are not powerless.

I also did the AA thing for a while. It didn't speak to me at all. "I am powerless over alcohol" Don't tell me that. That's not what I want to hear and that is just not who I am.

Thank goodness for me I found MWO. I found my power was truly in myself but also in great support and friendship. I can come here anytime I need to and share my problems and not have to drink about them. My power now is in numbers. In the large and wonderful number of people who have decided to gather here and meet as friends.

Nobody - not one single person on the website - is powerless over alcohol. Together we are a force.

Thanks AA

[A Work in Progress]

Powerless vs Power

That's a GREAT question, Nancy, and it brings up the complexity of this whole phenomenon, involving not only the fairly simple (at least as an overview) physiological mechanisms, but also the psychological and environmental aspects of all this. For example: the physiological changes that take place when I have two drinks of Scotch are exactly the same, regardless of whether I drink them at home, or at a work-related event at which my job is on the line. But the psychological (and environmental) factors are entirely different, depending on the setting and the situation and what is going on in my mind. Typically, I can control my drinking at the work-related party, wait till I go home, and then drink a whole LOT more. Whereas, at home, I will just cut loose and drink, and have the "feeling" that it is a behavior that is outside my capacity to control.

Remember that our thoughts, attitudes, and expectations are reflected within (take place within) our brains, our very physiology, along with the changes that take place due to the presence of alcohol. This is why the "mental game" is so crucially important in recovering from addictive/compulsive behaviors.

This is also why "mindfulness" practice is so helpful; it gives us a discipline that teaches us to regularly bring into awareness the thoughts that often go on outside our awareness, cuing and preparing our brains for a relapse or a binge.

So, I would think that consistently successful moderate drinking, for those who have a history of serious alcohol abuse, depends a lot on the "mental game" (monitoring thoughts, daydreams, attitudes, expectations, stress levels, triggers), and also a lot on control over the environment within which one chooses to drink. All of those factors interact with the strictly alcohol-related physiological factors that are taking place in our brains.

wip

[tlrgs]

Powerless vs Power

very well put AA