do we learn to be alcoholics ?

[spirit pixie]

a million questions running through my head since finding this site...

so many of us come from an alcoholic family and i know there is a hereditary gene that makes one more susceptible to becoming an alcoholic/drug user etc

BUT

we learn from experience and have every opportunity to make our own choices

some are addictive workers, sportspeople, cleaners etc

if we can learn this addiction can we unlearn it without feeling like we are missing something ?

why is it so hard to make a good choice ? - its so logical

love pixie
x

[AAthlete]

do we learn to be alcoholics ?

spirit pixie;455950 wrote: ...if we can learn this addiction can we unlearn it without feeling like we are missing something ?

We absolutely can. We can throw this 'junk in the trunk' and head off down the highway without looking back.

Not always easy to do though. As I've said before, our drinking is normally a symptom of other things that have or are going wrong in our lives. We have chosen to deal with those problems with alcohol. Beating it takes a look of introspection and hard work, along with the willingness to accept all the good and bad things in our lives. But, I can promise you that the results are so worth it....

[A Work in Progress]

do we learn to be alcoholics ?

SP, the repeated use of substances that have a direct and immediate effect on the dopamine system in the brain creates long-term changes within both the dopamine (including the "reward system") system of the brain, and also other brain pathways and systems. These changes are responsible for the internally experienced (or subjective) sense of having cravings, or extremely strong desires, or what feels like a "need" to not only consume the substance, but to do so in large amounts, despite our full awareness that it is damaging for us to do so.

These neurological changes may or may not be reversible, more or less, over time. Certainly, we know that we CAN learn to refuse to give in to the compulsions or cravings and we know that this can strengthen certain inhibitory or "self-control" pathways in the brain. But it is unlikely that most of us will be able to safely "learn" to drink moderately, in part because the consumption of alcohol is itself a disinhibitor, or in other words, in partially disables the parts of the brain (within the frontal lobes) that we use to exercise good judgment and self-control.

That feeling of "missing something" is part of the whole spectrum of "craving" or abnormally strong desire for a drug of abuse (including alcohol).

Other very strong behavioral habits or compulsions... gambling, etc.... probably have similar but NOT identical mechanisms of action, and they are easier to learn to control because the act of gambling, or whatever it may be, does not in and of itself disable the frontal lobes.

wip

[Mackeral]

do we learn to be alcoholics ?

Hiya Pixie..

Just from my own exsperiance i think you do learn to become an alcaholic..For me..From parents and upbringing..But i think they learn from their parents too..
Even childrens birthdays were cause for a drink in our house..
Sunday was always the routine to start drinking about mid-day, thats just how its always been...When relatives turn up..(we might of seen them last week...They always turned into an almighty session..
Proberly goes hand in hand with the genes thing in my opinion..

How many athletes do you know who's children have followed in their footsteps..I could name quite a few..
Sadly kids look upto and immitate thier parents..

As for making the choice to be different...I think by the time you realise that its not all its cracked up to be...It has a certain amount of grip on you...Thinking like me...I love my mum and dad..Why is it so bad being like them...They're happy...But i dont think its what you see behind closed doors.."Not infront of the children"...even though im 32..That puts a false sense into it..As in...Lets put a happy face on for the kids..

To a lot of familys...Drinking is a taboo convesation..

[AAthlete]

do we learn to be alcoholics ?

Macks, you bring up a good point. I think that we, in some ways, learn how to respond and cope with things from watching our parents. My dad would always have beers at night to unwind from the day, and would always drink whenever they were with friends.

I, at least on some level, associated alcohol with all of that, and it wasn't a big leap for me to start abusing it when things started becoming unmanageable in my life.

[A Work in Progress]

do we learn to be alcoholics ?

Macks, AA, I totally agree that the psycho-social environment plays a very significant part in the pathways to alcoholism or addiction. The genetic factors are quite significant, as well... kids with a biological family history of alcoholism/addiction, but who were raised in non-alcoholic households, still tend to get addicted more often than kids who do not have that genetic "load"; also, kids who do not have a biological family history but who are adopted into alcoholic households tend NOT to become addicted...

It's a very complex mix of factors, some of them more influential in some of us, than in others!

[spirit pixie]

do we learn to be alcoholics ?

my mom never drank much apart from the odd cherry until my dad died, since she has also followed a fixed routine of a glass of wine at lunch - or two followed by nap, and certainly a couple in the evenings(when not working part time). i believe she was setting an example in contrast to his behaviour. Maybe she was secretly drinking - as in not in front of the kids? I have asked her and she said no. maybe she was just doing the opposite of anything my dad was doing?
but forefront in my mind is CHOICE... bad things happen - oh choose to drink...

[A Work in Progress]

do we learn to be alcoholics ?

SP, I agree, the question of "choice," or "freedom" is extremely important. I am strongly of the opinion that we can make choices (in our behavior, surroundings, diet, activities, and thinking patterns) that will, in turn help us to make the choice not to drink, even when our brains/minds are begging for, or demanding, a drink! And the more often we make that choice (NOT to drink, despite the temptation or cravings), the easier it gets.

[Boss.man]

do we learn to be alcoholics ?

spirit pixie;455950 wrote: if we can learn this addiction can we unlearn it without feeling like we are missing something ?

why is it so hard to make a good choice ? - its so logical

Pixie, the right answer is Yes. You have to realize there is a balance between feeling good temporarily with AL, and feeling good all the time. For most people, after drinking, the emotional down time starts exceeding the up time AL gives you. This leads to a cycle of depression and sadness that follows each drinking session. The depression is just as linked to AL as the "high" you get from drinking.

So can you "miss" being depressed, sad, hung over, barfing in the sink, hiding bottles, lying or other obsessive results from AL Dependence? Not a chance!

The reason it's so hard, is that AL gets an evil hold on your pleasure center. It takes time, effort and COMMITMENT to break the cycle, and get on the top side of things again. We're all on this journey. Let's go forward together.

[Determinator]

do we learn to be alcoholics ?

I'm convinced I have an extremely strong genetic affinity toward al dependance. the very first time I got drunk at age 9 it was like a switch went off in my brain. Like I'd discovered the wardrobe to Narnia.

why is it hard? boy that's a complex issue. but as others have eluded to here...we got into this mess gradually over time and that's how we will crawl out.

[A Work in Progress]

do we learn to be alcoholics ?

One of the very interesting research findings about alcoholics is that they (we) often have a very strong (and positive) memory of early experiences with alcohol. Like Det says, it may be that it felt "like a switch went off in my brain." That is VERY likely because there is a genetic defect that creates a vulnerability to addiction by causing some mis-alignments in one or more of the various dopamine receptors in the brain. That mis-alignment causes the receptors to be less responsive to ordinary pleasures (food, sex, various types of rewarding life events) and more responsive to chemical stimulation by way of alcohol or other drugs of abuse. So, when we drink, we feel a much greater dose of pleasant stimulation than others might feel. This causes us to use alcohol more, and pursue it more, which causes more neurological changes that make it even harder to quit using it...

I know that it was very clear to me, when I began drinking in high school, that I enjoyed alcohol much more than my friends did, and that I had much less control over my consumption than they did. They could, as we sometimes say, "take it or leave it." I felt as if I really needed it, or at least I very much wanted it. Much more than my friends did. This kind of experience is pretty persuasive evidence that there are differences in the brain structure between alcoholics and non-alcoholics, differences that exist even before we begin drinking. That may not be true for all addics/alcoholics, but it is very likely to be true for many or most of us.

That's one reason I am pessimistic about a return to "normal drinking" for most alcoholics. The underlying neurological vulnerability is VERY unlikely to ever go away, even if other neurological systems are normalized after long-term abstinence.

One way to express this, in very over-simplified terms, is this: if everyone liked alcohol as much as we do... everyone would become addicted.

[BecomingMeAtLast]

do we learn to be alcoholics ?

My father was an alcoholic and I was raised by Mom in mostly a non-drinking environment. I taught myself well how to become an alcoholic, beginning at 16. Apparently, I'm a great learner. Let's hope we can unlearn this crap! Genetics, yeah, they're there. It's only a piece of the crazy pie.
Be