Rational Recovery

[mama bear]

Just read about this online. What are your thoughts or opinions......it's very contradictory to what we belive here.......that you can cure yourself immediately by reconizing your Addictive Voice vs. your Real Voice....
just curious what others think

[Doggygirl]

Rational Recovery

I read the book a rather long time ago. So my thoughts are a bit rusty. I will start off by saying that it seems Rational Recovery has worked at least for some people, and therefore is a valuable recovery approach in my opinion. (IMO ANY recovery approach that helps somebody has value!)

* IMO It assumes we can sort of "logic" our way out of this problem which did not work for me. (doesn't mean it won't work for others)
* I'm not crazy at all about the vitriol the author demonstrates towards other recovery programs - AA in particular. While AA might not have helped him, it has certainly helped many others. I see no value in that sort of bashing.
* I DO think there is value in recognizing what is the addiction talking (i.e. "just one HAHAHAHA) v. the real voice (I cannot safely drink, ever). That knowledge alone was not enough to make me stop. That reconition does help me though.

Whatever works!

DG

[JimBeam911]

Rational Recovery

mama bear;811026 wrote: Just read about this online. What are your thoughts or opinions......it's very contradictory to what we belive here.......that you can cure yourself immediately by reconizing your Addictive Voice vs. your Real Voice....
just curious what others think

I wouldn't say it contradicts what people believe here. I've spoken with many members who agree with the Rational Recovery conception of addiction, whether they've actually visited the RR website or read the book. The reason many find RR unsettling is that it puts the full locus of responsibility on the drinker or drug user. There is no room permitted to blame genetics, depression, traumatic life experiences, etc.

I can't say that RR cured my addiction when I first became familiar with the program, but interestingly enough, when I've fallen off the wagon after significant AF periods it has always been for one of the "addictive voice excuses" identified in the RR book.

Whether you consider addiction primarily a psychological or biological phenomenon, we are still each individually responsible for managing our drinking. Assuming there is some truth to the genetic hypothesis of alcoholism, our genes were not involved in our initial decision to try alcohol. Nor are our genes responsible each and every time we pour ourselves a drink despite the full knowledge of how it will likely turn out. In a nutshell, our genetic make-up might make us metabolize alcohol differently, such that it is harder to become intoxicated and/or the buzz is more pleasurable for us, but this latter fact alone is never sufficient to actually cause us to pour the first drink. It's scary, but at root it is up to us.

[Chillgirl]

Rational Recovery

Hi Guys
I just started reading this book and its too early to say what i think but so far I do like a lot of the concepts. I attend AA which is a fantastic support organization which has worked for millions but personally I have a few difficulties with some of their beliefs and perhaps RR will make more sense to me.

When I quit AL i very much followed the "Allen Carr Easyway" method which so far has worked for me, when I finish reading RR i will check back in and let you know how i found it.

[dancelot]

Rational Recovery

Anything that works is OK by me - I take bits and pieces from lots of places. It's my sobriety so why not?
Personally I do believe in genetics for example, but I agree 100% it is about my decision whether to pick up that drink or not. I need to do whatever it takes not to - whether that is using logic, or prayer, or exercising. We just each have to find what works for us, and do it every time. I also never rule out any method or drug or whatever - I'm committed to sobriety, and if what I'm doing is not working and I'm giving it 100%, I'll look at something else.

One thing I love about MWO is we can put out different ideas, and always learn from each other. Just do something!

[mama bear]

Rational Recovery

I reallyliked Allen Carr's Easyway book,too.

[KTMrider]

Rational Recovery

reviving an old thread

I just had a "come to Jesus " with my wife AGAIN. I have been struggling with drinking many years. When I read the AVRT approach today it was sooo what I have been feeling. I want "me" back. Today is the start of taking myself back and defeating "it". I hope it works for me, I just need to start planning positive replacements to drinking.
This is my first post, and I will explore this forum a lot.

[Supercrew]

Rational Recovery

I didn't use AVRT, I made up my own program, but everything I have read about it makes alot of sense, and it is right in line with what I believe as far as recognizing the little voice and then not listening to it. It makes more sense to me than AA because it tells you you do have the power to not pick up the first drink. I have trouble agreeing with a program that tells you that you are powerless.

[Doggygirl]

Rational Recovery

:welcome: KTMrider. Finding other activites instead of drinking is IMO, a very important step on the road to recovery. It's a journey - that's for sure. Good for you taking the first step. One of the things I love most about this support site is that there are many different people employing many different recovery techniques, and finding what works for them. May you find your way out too!

DG

[Struggles 106]

Rational Recovery

Rational Recovery

As a lot of people trying to get sober I have checked out various methods, tools,etc including Rational Recovery. Whatever works is terrific, I like the concept of the addicitve voice,since we have all heard it before. There are a lot of ways to deal with it and if RR works for you then I say go for it.
Just as AA is not for me, if it works for you that's great. Like Super I'm not really big on the idea of being powerless.
I did find Jim Beam's comment interesting about each of us being responsible for "managing our drinking". I don't see it as managing. That implies to me some sort of control, as in moderation or something like that. Which dare I say it yet again? I think is impossible.
Also for AA the idea of 90 meetings in 90 days, which seemed to be held up as a requirement almost, some sort of acceptable beginnning, always seemed absurd to me. Even leaving out drinking and all it's repercussions I STILL would not have time to do to a meeting every day
to proclaim that I am an alcoholic etc etc. Though I admit I like hearing/reading about other's struggles with alcohol since it makes me feel that maybe I'm not the worst person in the world.

[nancy]

Rational Recovery

tone

The word Doggygirl used resonates with me on this one: vitriol. I really didn't like the author's angry tone of voice. I think it's a hard-edged approach overall. It may be more palatable to men or people who lke a strident/tough approach. But in my opinion, not for a sensitive woman.

[KTMrider]

Rational Recovery

I certainly agree there is a lot of negativity there. It kind of cracks me up the vigilance of bashing other processes. I guess what cuts to the chase for me, the first thing people jump to is counseling. It didnt work for me because I wasnt ready. I dont think anything works if you`re not ready, because its forced somehow. Now, I admit Im somewhat forcing myself to do this because of fear. Fear of losing my "friend". Thats sick! But,,,the RR point of its not "me" wanting it, its the beast. I love it!!! And thats why Im trying this. Its so simple. And, because I have been wanting to do this for many years, just havent had the guts to step up and do it.

[nancy]

Rational Recovery

the beast

The "Beast" concept didn't work for me. I think a lot of this is subjective. Whatever works!

[Supercrew]

Rational Recovery

I do like the idea of the voice, but not so big on naming it "the beast" because I think that gives it too much power, although if I am completely honest that voice was probably the worst beast I have ever dealt with. The reason why I also like the idea is because I can see this method being used in other aspects of my life.

When I drank yet I didn't really plan to or I promised not to, there was something in my head talking me into it, and I have seen the same thing occur when I over eat...I mean do I really want 3 pieces of coconut creme pie, or when I know I should be working but that little voice keeps me watching TV or messing around on Facebook?

The key to fixing issues like procrastination and over doing anything is recognizing when you know the reality of what you are doing is wrong and not good for you. The problem comes because our little voice thinks we will gain more pleasure or less pain from whatever that bad activity might be. The voice is completely gone for me when it comes to alcohol now because I convinced the voice that drinking was pain, but the little voice told me to eat too many goodies tonight at a holiday party, and I didn't keep it in check. I will have to go through the pain of extra workouts next week!!! But I think the key to living a balanced and successful life has to do with being able to tame that voice.

[DriftyAlison0]

Rational Recovery

I never read it, but I don't believe that anyone can cure themselves immediately. It takes time, some longer then others.