Facts and figures.

[Shaman]

Hi, folks. I'm trying to get as much info as possible about alcoholism. I'm especially interested in the real figures for success and relapse with, for instance, the AA. I've started a blog, partly about my story, but I also want to include a list of resources and facts. I've been through a load of treatments myself, so I know about a lot of what doesn't work for me, but getting hold of genuine figures about people like the AA isn't easy. If anyone can suggest any sources of information, I'd be very grateful.

Many thanks,
Steve.

[betty boop]

Facts and figures.

Hi Steve,

Sorry I can't help but just wanted to say :welcome: to the site.

I wanted to reply even though I can't help, because I know what it's like to post and not get a reply.

All the best with your project.

Paula xx

[Shaman]

Facts and figures.

Thanks, Paula, I'm actually intending to join in a bit more, rather than just requesting information. But right now I'm busy with seeking out facts. Many thanks for the welcome.

Steve.

[InnerStrength]

Facts and figures.

Hi Steve
Are you interested in AA? I think AA can really work for some people. It wasen't for me but it was for my mother. To be honest, I have read some not very positive success/failure rates for AA but I am reluctant to say what they are for fear of discouraging people....maybe I can send you a private message - but have you tried AA before? I am just reluctant to say the rates I have read because I know everyone is different and its amazing how well AA can work for some people! Are you just sort of researching generally?
Jen

[Shaman]

Facts and figures.

Hi, Jen, thanks for the reply. Yes, I have tried AA, and didn't find it worked for me. My concern is that many forms of treatment purport to be rather more successful than they really are, and that can lead to people placing undue trust in them and ending up disappointed. And 'disappointed' for an alcoholic is hardly a small thing - it can mean a lot more years of despair and loss, as we all know. I just want to arrive at some reasonable assessment of the relative success rate of various approaches, so that I and people like me can have some clear idea of where we really stand with regard to what treatments are available, and what we can expect from them. It's not easy. For instance, people who have found one approach successful will invariably say something like 'I tried lots of things, but the only one that worked was this one.' Yes, but all that means is that they didn't try anything else after the one that worked. Do you see what I mean? It becomes a lot of confusing anecdotal evidence, rather than a genuine assessment. By definition, the only treatment that worked for a person was the one that worked, and that will always have been the last one they tried.

I have no wish to discourage anyone at all, but I do think we all have a right to know what the real situation is. I don't know where you live, but here in the UK the state provision for alcoholics is pretty lamentable, although you don't find that out until you've been involved for quite a long time and find it actually has very little to offer. I've been through most available forms of treatment (those I could afford anyway), and I'm still only a short way into recovery for the thousandth time.

Anyway, if this is the wrong place to discuss such things, then I'll respect that. If you have any suggestions regarding the sort of information I'm after, then yes, I'd greatly appreciate a PM or an email.

Thanks again,
Steve.

[InnerStrength]

Facts and figures.

Hi Steve
I think everyone is definitely entitled to info thats for sure and I respect your view absolutely
I have READ before that the failure rate of a program like AA is generally about 95% - so about a 5% success rate.
I dont know how accurate this is - this is what I have read in a couple of places. However. I also know it can be VERY successful for some people. Ifyou can "get it" - get the Higher Power and the steps and work the program it can work.
I also read a study where some people tried qutting on their own with the use of vitamins, exercise etc and NO AA (I will have to look for this study) and their failure rate was lower - about 70% - so 30% were still sober in 5 years.) I know these dont sound like very promising stats, but that's just what I have read.
Jen

[YoungAtHeart]

Facts and figures.

I think a lot of it depends upon how READY you really are and how DETERMINED you reallly are. I think with things like drinking and smoking, many (but not all) people have a number of slips before getting it right. I know some people who have gotten it right the first time they tried, though. My former fiance is an AA success story. He quit in August of 2000, and, as far as I know never touched a drop again. I know several other people who successfully used AA to get sober who are not members of this forum.

[Shaman]

Facts and figures.

Hi, Jen, yes, 95% is the figure I've come across too, although it's nothing like the figures I've heard cited at AA meetings. On the subject of vitamin/exercise based treatments, I tried the 101 programme for a while, which is a supplement-based treatment. It was pretty expensive and very strict, and it didn't work for very long for me. But I did relate to the ideas behind it to do with many alcoholics becoming hypoglycaemic and disturbing their blood-sugar balance. I have typically tended to start drinking too much coffee, smoking too much etc when coming off drink - both of which give you a sugar spike. And of course alcohol is sugar. I'm finding avoiding nicotine, caffeine, and keeping the sugar to as minimum is working for me so far. Another big factor for me is trying to get enough sleep. If I get to running on adrenaline, it's a quick road back to drinking. Anyway, thanks for the replies - you seem to have come across the same figures as me regarding AA.

Steve.

[Shaman]

Facts and figures.

Hi, Young at Heart, yes, I suspect if you're really, really ready then most things may work. The problem is how bad it has to be before you're really ready, isn't it. Obviously, some people are never that ready. I've lost several friends to alcohol and drugs (I've even 'died' and been resuscitated myself - and I still wasn't ready), and there are others who I'm pretty sure aren't going to make it, and will just not get to that point in time. But all respect and best wishes to those for whom the AA did the job.

Steve.

[InnerStrength]

Facts and figures.

Yes Kathy I agree too - it very much depends on how 'ready' you are - and i also personally know 4 people that AA worked for....so despite the stats.....

[Guest]

Facts and figures.

I've been to 2 AA meeting over the last couple weeks myself. The first one was gret. Highly motivataional. It was a "lead" which in AA lingo means that a person tells their story. She hasn't had a drink in over 20 years!! Great and inspirational, but at the same time a bit hard for me to relate to. It was still a really good meeting.
The 2nd meeting just sucked. It was supposed to be a "big book" talk, but this woman raised her hand and started talking about her "serenity" had been disrupted, and she was worried about it getting to her sobriety next. She has a sister in law who is an alcoholic and got so drunk Christmas Eve that the family thought she was having a stroke and took her to the hospital. Now the family thinks that this AA lady who told the story should somehow take care of her and show her the way. The sister in law is not ready!! Yes, I feel for this woman, and am astonished that she has 5 years sober now. BUT the rest of the meeting was laden with each woman in the room giving their 2 cents about how the situation should be dealt with. "take care of yourself", "call your Higher Power and give these thoughts to It", "one day at a time". I was just annoyed. We didn't even open the dang book!
Sooo, I'm going to go to more AA meetings, and keep seeing my counselor. Every little pearl of wisdom has potential to help.
I have learned SO MUCH this past year... wow.
Safe keeping, Steve.

[Shaman]

Facts and figures.

Hey, Becca, I've been to lots of those Big Book meetings, and I've never seen the danged book get opened once! Seriously. I don't think there's anything written in that danged book! If you find out what it says inside, please come back and tell me.

[ihavebeenherkind]

Facts and figures.

This will give everyone alot of reading, I haven't read all of it, or even most of it, but I thought it was interesting. I don't want to AA bash, because I don't want to offend, it's not for me, but I support those who feel they have been helped by it!

Orange Papers

[Accountable for Me]

Facts and figures.

Ditto. I too in recent years been to quite a few meetings, and never have seen the book open. I did however receive mine at my first meeting as a gift of sobriety by the members. Apparently it was tradition, which I thought was sooooo sweet!

Funny thing is I never really got much out of AA. Just kind of felt like I was constantly reliving the nightmare, and kind felt stuck in limbo. Keep in mind that the meetings I attended were mainly older folk. (not to offend anyone, but I found it very sad..... that these people spent their whole lives with this problem and finally found some sort of refuge.) I am ultra sensitive, so I felt pretty depressed and felt no hope after attending. I couldn't really relate being the youngest person there. I am sure there are meetings here that consist of people my age, but I believe AA really isn't for me.

On the other hand, I did experience wonderful things at CA. (Coccaine Anonymous). I never have touched the stuff but met someone who was younger than I that attended the meetings. So a buddy of mine and I who have issues with alcohol went to many, many of these meetings. The meetings were so uplifting and buzzing with hope. Met some awesome people who were committed to being clean. Most of these people were relatively young, and found their refuge. I had a blast at these. I actually had found some hope. Any addiction is an addiction, so you can apply yours to theirs pretty much. When I stopped going (I moved out of province) I started to drink again... keep in mind this was a few years back, before things really spiralled right out of control... I don't know why I wrote this, but maybe someone might benefit from going to a CA or an NA meeting instead of an AA. They are all the same in regards to the 12 steps etc... just very different atmospheres, which I feel is super important in any recovery. For me, AA was way too mellow, and CA was buzzing with energy. And for me I wanted to be a part of something positive - like this place. I am not knocking AA, so please don't be offended. Just wasn't for me.

Becca, so glad that you are going to go back regardless of what your last meeting had to offer. That shows you how much will you do have!

[ihavebeenherkind]

Facts and figures.

Accountable for Me wrote: For me, AA was way too mellow, and CA was buzzing with energy.

Many years ago, I was dating a guy with a drug and alcohol problem, he had to do 90 meetings in 90 days for his rehab, so he went to both NA and AA meetings and I went with him when I could...and we DEFINATELY found the same phenomenon that you did!