Is It Too Nice in Here?

[Supercrew]

Just curious to hear some of your thoughts regarding the MWO forum and the "no pressure" approach.

When I got sober I frequented another forum everyday from the day I quit until about 6 months ago.(about a year and 4 months). The forum is very recovery/AA oriented, and although they have many relapsers, seldom if ever will someone say it is OK to moderate or it's normal to keep on failing. When you post most people will try to push you to AA, and now they are more open to AVRT, but many preach the Big Book gospel, letting you know that AA is the only way.

I hated that line of thinking, and I looked for a more secular and logical approach to getting sober, and many times I was told that I would relapse because I wasn't doing it a specific way. I realize that in the beginning I was so hell bent on not having to do AA that I stayed sober out of spite to prove those people wrong who said AA was the only way, and I wanted to continue posting proudly and tell them I am doing it "MY WAY!"

Now I did it and lost the obsession and I will not drink again, so I got away from that forum, and I came here thinking this is a perfect forum, where you choose your own way with the support of others. But I find the place to be so nice that it sort of lacks in making people feel very accountable to "their way" whatever that might be. It almost seems that instead being called "My Way Out" a better name might be "If I can't find an easy way out I will continue trying to moderate unsuccessfully".

There really isn't an easy way out, and although I do real like this place as a support network, I just wonder if it were more focused on just not drinking today if it might not be a more effective tool.

I only relapsed once at the other forum, and I was ashamed to the point that I contemplated never going back, but I did, and they told me I needed AA, and I stuck with my way and learned to love sobriety and my recovery process.

So again I am just a sober visitor to this forum, hoping to help people find their way, and I really don't have a stake in whether it works for everyone, and I am sure it has helped many many people find their path to sobriety, but I will ask being that there really isn't any major pressure being put on people to get sober and it is an all accepting forum is it too nice to be as effective as it could. Or would people just leave and drink anyway if they felt pressured?

Just curious to hear your thoughts?

[fennel]

Is It Too Nice in Here?

I really like the non-judging approach. We all know what it's like to struggle- and we all know (as you have seen on the other forum) that lecturing and judging and haranguing really doesn't force people into sobriety. We get there on our own time, in our own way...and some of us never reach sobriety, sadly.

I don't see this site as an "easy" way out...I see it as a kind place to find our own way out.

[FlyAway]

Is It Too Nice in Here?

My thoughts are that different approaches work for different people. I think that when the majority of people come here they are probably hoping to gain control over their drinking and hope to one day be able to drink responsibly again. If someone like that entered a hard-nosed board they'd most likely turn around and walk out. And as you said, when you slipped you almost didn't go back to that other board. Many people slip here and are too embarrassed to come back. It would only be worse for me if the board were less accepting and I have to think that MWO has more people eventually return because they know that there won't be an ass-chewing, but understanding. If someone is struggling and trying to moderate and posting here, at least the idea is being worked in their mind that there is a problem. They would be forging friendships and fellowship and have an outlet to talk. There is such a huge stigma about alcohol addiction that many people do not discuss it with their spouses! I don't. It's never talked about. We are never made to feel it's okay to talk about. This is the only place I'm honest about this.

And finally since we're being honest, I'm shaking my head over you thinking that people here think this should be easy.

[fennel]

Is It Too Nice in Here?

Excellent post, FlyAway. I have made so many friends here, many of whom I have had the pleasure of meeting in person. I feel understood here in a way that nobody else in my life understands me.

When I came here, I had hopes of moderating...the book by Roberta Jewell is essentially a "How to" for moderation.

[Supercrew]

Is It Too Nice in Here?

FlyAway;1279304 wrote: My thoughts are that different approaches work for different people. I think that when the majority of people come here they are probably hoping to gain control over their drinking and hope to one day be able to drink responsibly again. If someone like that entered a hard-nosed board they'd most likely turn around and walk out. And as you said, when you slipped you almost didn't go back to that other board. Many people slip here and are too embarrassed to come back. It would only be worse for me if the board were less accepting and I have to think that MWO has more people eventually return because they know that there won't be an ass-chewing, but understanding. If someone is struggling and trying to moderate and posting here, at least the idea is being worked in their mind that there is a problem. They would be forging friendships and fellowship and have an outlet to talk. There is such a huge stigma about alcohol addiction that many people do not discuss it with their spouses! I don't. It's never talked about. We are never made to feel it's okay to talk about. This is the only place I'm honest about this.

And finally since we're being honest, I'm shaking my head over you thinking that people here think this should be easy.

I apologize if my "easy" comment was misconstrued. But being that there are many different choices here, regarding programs, and drugs, it seems people will try one thing not commit to it, and then try another path. Basically seeing if one drug or program makes the commitment to sobriety easier. Maybe one is easier for someone else as opposed to something they have already tried. I am not even saying that is wrong.....if it works for you and it is easier than the way I did it more power to you.

[LibraryGirl]

Is It Too Nice in Here?

I read this thread with interest, because sometimes I wonder too if people are let off too easily when they lapse or fail at sobriety...With that said, I don't want to be brow beaten if I make an error and come back and admit it. However, sometimes tough love is what someone is actually looking for. I applauded Lavande in another thread last week when she/he (I'm sorry i don't know) told someone they need to do the work and stop coming here to just talk about quitting. It seemed harsh in light of the usual pats on the back, and general understanding that most of us seem to get when we don't succeed, but necessary, IMHO.

No, I firmly do NOT believe ANYone here that has managed to get sober thinks it is easy. I don't think the OP meant that either. What I do think is that our society is so PC, sometimes we find it difficult to ask people to be accountable. If they could be accountable to themselves alone, they wouldn't need to be here.

These are just my thoughts...don't be hatin.

[Wally22]

Is It Too Nice in Here?

I think MWO is for everyone to find Their Way Out.
You would probably be surprised if you could see the content of some of the PM's. I think most people do their pushing in private rather that embarass someone publicly.
The fact that there are so many options offered, reflects all the different types of people here, with one thing in common. Sometimes it might take several paths before you find Your Way Out.
I find the empathy and support a welcome refuge in a world which often seems so hostile to those of us who have difficulty with alcohol.
Just my opinion.

[sunshine_gg]

Is It Too Nice in Here?

Well said, Wally.

There are abstinence threads here where the tone is somewhat different.. a little 'harsher', if you will. But I agree with Wally, that often the really serious talk happens via PM. Let's not forget, either, how quickly one will get attacked when truly stating his/her honest opinion.

For me, personally, I will often say something like "I'm sorry you chose to drink" to those who lapse over and over again and leave it at that. There is no point in beating each other up and the ones who are sincerely looking for a way to quit will get there eventually. At least, that's the hope.

As for the aid of meds... I doubt that any of us think there is such a thing as a 'magic pill' where all is well again with no effort on our part. I sure as hell don't. The first and last decision to pick up/not pick up that drink will always lay with us.

[mylife]

Is It Too Nice in Here?

Hi Supercrew - my throughts are that there are lots of people with long term sobriety who struggled in the beginning and may have relapsed several times before obtaining their long term sobriety. If this site were not as accepting as it is perhaps they might not have come back and finally achieved sobriety? Just a thought.

I agree it's not something to be taken lightly, however. It's a very tough committment that needs to come from within.

[Lavande]

Is It Too Nice in Here?

In response to Library Girl's post......
I had a few people give me a gentle push/nudge in the right direction three years ago when I started here & am grateful. I could have spent this time fence-sitting instead of moving ahead with my life

Supercrew, this forum has helped so many of us. There is no one right way for all!
I'm not sure why you question the effectiveness of this community. Finding like-minded, caring & supportive people was & remains helpful to me.

[SKendall]

Is It Too Nice in Here?

Hi Supercrew, good point.

Roberta Jewell wrote this book as an alternative to A.A. Her exhaustive research delved into which medicines could help. Many don't feel comfortable with AA, it just rubs them the wrong way. A rehab center is an excellent alternative but also very expensive and leaves a paper trail which future employers can sometimes access.

When I joined, Roberta had never given up her research and continued to post any newsworthy items. From the beginning of time no one has come up with medical cure. I'm not ignoring baclofen by any means and is extremely effective for many people. But the medical community hasn't bought into it yet.

What happened with this forum, it not only grew and grew in size, but so did our humanitarian values toward each other.

We all know what alcohol can do, a whole lot of shame and guilt pervades and paralyses us. We hold out our non-judgmental hands to newcomers knowing this and encourage them with miraculous results. Shaming anyone just doesn't work. It's a useless emotion just like guilt. We share our knowledge and experience, also make new friends and many here are personal friends now too. We invest emotionally in people who are serious and observe the benefits of that investment in people making a healthy recovery. There is a thread to literally anything that stems from not just alcohol, but growing and maturing in the human element.

Personally, I couldn't have received such comfort in friends and family of normal drinkers. We get it.

As a result, it is life-saving and judging from the numbers very successful

[brittzak]

Is It Too Nice in Here?

Many here attend AA, church, come here, etc...sometimes it takes a little of it all, sometimes it doesn't. I have recevied some tough love here, but i am the type that needs that. It hurts others. We kinda learn what works for each other and try to help.

[red67]

Is It Too Nice in Here?

Great thread SS. I have been thinking the same thing since i got sober, but in saying that i am the kind of person who needs someone to be honest with me and push my past my comfort zone. I could not have gotten sober without some strong support. By that i mean people who kept me accountable. Over the past ten years of my daily drinking hell at no point did i even make one day AL free. The day i decided to quit for real, i knew it had to be forever with NO execptions. The days i felt weak i depended on the people around me and here, i just knew i could not fail and if i did i dont think i would be able to start this journey again.

For those who relapse and come back here, i give you tons of credit. That takes a lot of determination. In the end we are each responsible for our own sobriety no matter how soft or hard other are on us.

I guess what i am saying is although i need tough love (and i like you Supercrew am extremely stubborn and will do stuff just to prove people wrong - i too was told AA is the only way to get sober and i hated that), some others need a kinder gentler approach.

With all that said, i love this place! Never have i found a place that made me feel so comfortable to do this my way.

I will be 1 year sober this Saturday and I thank God everyday for the strength He gave me to finally do this and for helping me find this place.

[Mohun]

Is It Too Nice in Here?

I think the MWO approach has worked for me. I tried quitting twice before and made it to 4 months both times. I thought I was ok and started drinking again. This is my 3rd attempt and it has been 17 months since I have had a drink (third time lucky?).

The first two times I fell/slipped/drank I was very leery about coming back here as I didn't like failing. It is only because I saw how others were treated when they came back that I felt that I could come back as well.

If I saw other people receiving harsh/tougher treatment, I am not sure I would have come back. We all know how tough beating this is and it is difficult to "walk a mile in someone else's shoes". So I think it best not to judge and just offer a hand and support when I can.

Peace.

[fennel]

Is It Too Nice in Here?

sunshine_gg;1279328 wrote: Well said, Wally.

There are abstinence threads here where the tone is somewhat different.. a little 'harsher', if you will. But I agree with Wally, that often the really serious talk happens via PM. Let's not forget, either, how quickly one will get attacked when truly stating his/her honest opinion.

Particularly when those "opinions" are unkind or nasty.