August Army Manoevres

[brit]

Re: August Army Manoevres

Thanks everyone for listening!
I am so relaxed now I am going to have an afternoon sleep.

[mollyka]

Re: August Army Manoevres

EVENING!!! FFS MrsA -- it's SUPPOSED to be all about 'me me me' for each and every one of us!!! How we deal with our problems - and at this time YOU have a problem and of course you must unload and discuss at your own speed and preference...I do it all the time..

I can HONESTLY say drink and the thought of it NEVER enters my brain these days - it's as irrelevant as a pink wellington boot.... BUT -- a friend of mine at work went to the All-Ireland hurling final yesterday and she was in a corporate box courtesy of her son-in-law's job or something and she was telling me how they had a sitting room behind the box with food and an open bar all afternoon - AND MY FIRST THOUGHT WAS...…………. 'what a waste' --- JAYSUS I'm not cured AT ALL AT ALL:culpability::nailbiting:

[JackieClaire]

Re: August Army Manoevres

Just put the kettle on.......cup of tea anyone?

Molls, you brought a memory back............not long after getting sober himself and I went to a posh 50th birthday party............she had real champagne..........I'm talking Bollinger here and people were leaving half glasses............wtf would they leave half and why didn't they drink more..........it was free FFS. Was still going through the poor me, mes at the time.

[brit]

Re: August Army Manoevres

Thanks for that Molly--never did have that sleep but feel relaxed. Molly are we ever "cured" I reckon my redrinking was self medicating to ensure I could stop all the chatter in my head and aid falling asleep. Worked for a bit when it was just 1 or 2 drinks but then it escalated as it does.
Talking of cures I never thought I could give up cigarettes but I do feel "cured" of that addiction. I want to feel the same about booze.
Mr A seems a bit better this evening and the Macmillan nurse reassured us so much today. For years I ran all my marathons for Macmillan and never really knew how we would need them one day.
Have a great evening folks

[brit]

Re: August Army Manoevres

x post Jackie! Can I have a cup of your Millicano?

[RunningCourage]

Re: August Army Manoevres

Good morning--only just woken up absolutely knackered yesterday. I did have a lovely nights sleep.
Just loving the posts here.
Having a tough time with Mr A/b and his cancer --Macmillan nurse just rang and sorted out appointments.
Signed up for mindfulness and off to a yoga class at 12.30. No running today as I am aware I push myself too far.
Sorry to be all me me me!

Now, as Doc Satzuma and AT Molls and Peapie have all alluded to - this place ought to be about me me me! Anyways, we're a nosey caring bunch of sods who genuinely want to hear and know about how you are, how Mr A(b) is and to send you all the positive vibes, words, thoughts etc.

Mindfulness sounds excellent. And I only wish there was a yoga class near me that WASN'T on during the school day... well there is one, on a Wednesday, but that's when I'm directing a show... ... Running - I should take your advice Whizzy and take more time off. Did not want to run this morning, though by the time i;d done a couple of miles and was in the woods, it didn't feel so bad...

Folks, trying to take my life in hand going forward... so have joined another forum. It's NOT an AL one. It's one for adults with histories of eating disorders and an approach to changing the neural wirings/mindsets that have become entrenched. It's actually fucking scary. Way scarier than giving up AL. But i've dipped my toe in and I need to try and give it a go.

Other than that, Monday's done... so may look at job application, or may just sit on my todd and watch trash on tv :haha:

[JackieClaire]

Re: August Army Manoevres

x post Jackie! Can I have a cup of your Millicano?

No, it'll keep you awake........ahh go just a little one...........cos I like you.

Good question that...........are we ever cured.......I'm pretty sure that some will drink heavily and beyond reason when there's been a major tragedy, life-changing circumstances, happy times like weddings or divorces .......that kind of stuff and the majority will go back to normal..........where as the likes of us just can't drink alcohol at all. And you know we're not loosing anything in the great scheme of things.

[starty]

Re: August Army Manoevres

Evening all. Mrs A, it is so important to make it about you at this time. I would imagine so much is about Mr A it is easy to forget you need care too. So chatter away, there is always some wise words from the ladies here

I would say we are never "cured". How can we be cured from something that can so easily change our mindset from bad to good (not talking here about the longer term aftermath) when we are going through a tough time. I think that for me anyway, each sober/clean day is a bonus and not something that I can ever categorically say will not darken my door again. I used to be certain I would never ever drink again and look where that got me

[mollyka]

Re: August Army Manoevres

Evening all. Mrs A, it is so important to make it about you at this time. I would imagine so much is about Mr A it is easy to forget you need care too. So chatter away, there is always some wise words from the ladies here

I would say we are never "cured". How can we be cured from something that can so easily change our mindset from bad to good (not talking here about the longer term aftermath) when we are going through a tough time. I think that for me anyway, each sober/clean day is a bonus and not something that I can ever categorically say will not darken my door again. I used to be certain I would never ever drink again and look where that got me

Cured -- no - we never can be.. I don't doubt that - in any way shape or form - and it makes me think about disease V learnt behaviour...… in fact I've been thinking about it since it was posted on Cowboys thread.. (I don't want to hi-jack that thread - was posting too much on it) - As I can't be 'cured' well then surely I have the equivalent of a disease (maybe that's the wrong word) - and I get Benjy's point that by calling it that it somehow gives the addict an 'out' - however - the difference imo is that we have the means to keep it away -- forever -- by not drinking.. - and then 'learnt behaviour' -- well yes - I do agree that the reward mechanism is put into overdrive when as addicts we drink - so it's the 'go to' thing when sad/happy/down/up etc... however - my problem with describing it as learnt behaviour is that the implication could be there (as we ALL know an addict will look for ANY out) is a way of unlearning addiction - or indeed 'learning' how to drink moderately - ??

I absolutely agree that everyone has the right to look at this how they see fit - and I amn't always the smartest cookie in the jar... but yeah - it just sort of 'jars' with me...

[NoSugar]

Re: August Army Manoevres

Hi, Molly. Any change to the brain is a learning process and addiction definitely changes the brain! From what I've read, we've forged that neural pathway to overdrink to the point of usually being permanent. So I don't think it is a way to give myself permission to drink. I just think it is a great way to encourage people that the situation isn't as hopeless as it often feels, they aren't diseased in the way we commonly define disease, they aren't bad, immoral people, and that by learning new things (not only meditation or new skills but also the types of things we learn from one another here), our brains can learn/be changed in ways so that we no longer need to use that addiction pathway. But the analogy about riding a bicycle is pretty apt, I think- once learned, you pretty much always know how to do it and even if you're not totally up to speed when you first get back on, the ability comes back very quickly. From the stories of relapse shared here, it sounds like that happens with drinking, too.

I've appreciated your posts on Cowboy's thread. I hope the active members can get it and keep it going.

[mollyka]

Re: August Army Manoevres

you know - I think we're probably really all saying the same things - just with different words... I don't disagree with a single thing you or Benjy are saying - it's the potential for mis-interpreting that I would have a worry - no - not a worry - that's too strong a word - but - caution...
I liken it to an incident I described before on here - it happened at an AA meeting - an old man stood up and spoke about how he had been given the 'cure' for alcoholism - he'd to wear a copper bracelet and stand up to his knee's in a muddy puddle and then he could drink - so many ears pricked up at that meeting....Or also the happiness I felt when I started reading Allen Carr's book 'The easy way to control alcohol' -- just that title told me I had control and power -

[NoSugar]

Re: August Army Manoevres

It very well could be a matter of semantics, Molly, and how different words make different people feel due to language, culture, experience, etc. Many people may feel reassured by a diagnosis of a specific disease that can be managed (not cured) using a specific protocol (not drinking). Others feel hopeless when they are told they have a disease that can never be cured. I find looking at addiction as a learning process that went haywire motivates me to learn better ways to deal with the things I had tried to improve or fix by drinking. It doesn't seem there is even agreement among the experts who study the matter and its likely there is no single cause or manifestation anyway.

I agree with you that each person should describe it in the way that is consistent with his or her experience and we shouldn't be divided by words. That would be as silly as arguing over what skip means :haha:!

[mollyka]

Re: August Army Manoevres

It very well could be a matter of semantics, Molly, and how different words make different people feel due to language, culture, experience, etc. Many people may feel reassured by a diagnosis of a specific disease that can be managed (not cured) using a specific protocol (not drinking). Others feel hopeless when they are told they have a disease that can never be cured. I find looking at addiction as a learning process that went haywire motivates me to learn better ways to deal with the things I had tried to improve or fix by drinking. It doesn't seem there is even agreement among the experts who study the matter and its likely there is no single cause or manifestation anyway.

I agree with you that each person should describe it in the way that is consistent with his or her experience and we shouldn't be divided by words. That would be as silly as arguing over what skip means :haha:!

Oh my WORD NS --- there is NOTHING silly about a skip:hahaha: They are blessings from heaven - they are sex on legs - they are truly divine!!!! My 'kids' always say I'm very hard to buy a present for - if one of them just got inspired and stuck a skip outside my front door for a week -- I LOVE getting rid of 'stuff' --- HATE stuff!

Only half joking ya know!!! Yes I agree - and after all - it is what it is.. I'm comfortable enough to know I'm an addict - I don't really care what the words are - but I do think that it's easy enough for all of us here to forget the confusion and the grasping at straws in early recovery - that's all!!

And now I think I may go to bed - like young Pea I also had a restless night last night so talk tomorrow all xx

[JackieClaire]

Re: August Army Manoevres

I was having a think about this alcoholism being classed as a disease this afternoon. I'm not sure when this classification happened but I'm wondering if it was at the beginnings of the great leaps in medicine were being made..........anti-biotics weren't that far away from being used by everyone.........already being used in certain conditions in the 20s.........now just a thought on my part............perhaps a cure/pill was being hoped for in the furure

Up until perhaps the late 60s depression was treated with tranquilizers ..........my mum had post-natal depression with my brother and was just given valium........nowadays a doctor is more likely to start with talking therapies, mild anti-depressants.



Just a couple of musings.

[JackieClaire]

Re: August Army Manoevres

I don't care whether its a skip or a dumpster.............just stick it out front and I'll have it filled in 20 minutes.