United Nations of MWO

[Pavati]

Re: United Nations of MWO

Hi, All--

Interesting! I thought that in in-person meeting would be good for me. A way to develop sober friendships, and to keep myself accountable. However, I am SO private about this, partly because of my public job, that I really don't want to do that here in my small town. How have you AA attenders tackled that? You probably don't give a toot about what others think like I do. I really don't want the whole town up in my business, especially since drinking is such a part of the culture here. I thought AA was dogmatic - the 12 steps or no go - so it is good to hear that you can take what you need and leave the rest. Maybe one of these days... I always thought I'd go out of town at some point.

I know for sure that an online forum helped me get sober well before I would have been ready to join an in-person meeting. I am so grateful to have developed these "relationships" here, and to have a place to go any time of day or night. Thanks for sharing your stories!

Pav

[Guitarista]

Re: United Nations of MWO

Pav, in Oz my AA meetings experience is similar to Jackie's. I agree with everyone's comments above. You really can take what u need and leave the rest.

I'm a spe...sporu.....sporadic AA goer too, and I've never felt pressure to do the 12 steps, get a sponsor, or even speak. You may well be asked to share at any given meeting but you don't have to. I will say, hello all (if i like maybe 'i'm G and i'm an alcoholic'), no thanks i'm just here to listen, thankyou. And they move on to someone else. No pressure. I feel a warmth and connection everytime i walk into the rooms, even if i don't talk to anyone for that hour i'm there. I might even stay for a half hour. Whatever. The sense of connection and community is real and large for me. You will always be made to feel welcome. An out of town meeting could be interesting. :happy2:

[abcowboy]

I need to come to grips with this guilt thing about what I put people through while I was drinking and trying to make amends for them. I know I've been doing a lot of things that don't really sit well with me, that don't make me happy, but I do them I think because of the guilt I still carry over my being a drunk. Did any of you feel the same way? And sometimes when I do stand up for what I think, I get the usual "well it wasn't easy living with an alcoholic" reply. Maybe I'm making more out of this than there really is, maybe I'm just being selfish, and maybe it's time to go see my counsellor again...

[NoraC]

Re: United Nations of MWO

I think a counselor might help. Much of my problem was because of my guilt. After I had been sober for about 3 months, I let go of the guilt. It was such a huge load off of my heart. I did awful things. It is past. Can't be changed. A new life now.
But, one thing.......it should NEVER be thrown back at you. And you should have that conversation. That is over. No fair to continue throwing it in your face after all this time. :heartbeat:

[Slo]

Re: United Nations of MWO

I too am very disturbed that someone is saying to you “Well, it wasn’t easy living with an alcoholic either” whenever you try to stand up for yourself. That sounds like emotional blackmail! And like they are manipulating you because they can, because they know you feel guilty.

And I guess I just don’t feel that guilty about becoming alcoholic (despite doing some terrible things), because I was just, like many others, drinking a legal “adult” beverage that is heavily promoted & encouraged in our culture. Unfortunately I was one of the ones that got addicted to it.

So, your counselor maybe can help you with losing the guilt so they can’t push your buttons anymore.

[NoraC]

Re: United Nations of MWO

I need to come to grips with this guilt thing about what I put people through while I was drinking and trying to make amends for them. I know I've been doing a lot of things that don't really sit well with me, that don't make me happy, but I do them I think because of the guilt I still carry over my being a drunk. Did any of you feel the same way? And sometimes when I do stand up for what I think, I get the usual "well it wasn't easy living with an alcoholic" reply. Maybe I'm making more out of this than there really is, maybe I'm just being selfish, and maybe it's time to go see my counsellor again...

I was trying to type on my phone earlier and I'm not good at it. But, I wanted to come back and comment more.

I really believe that we carry a lot of guilt. And, I think that the guilt weighs us down and holds us back. And, I do think that if you do come to grips with it, you will feel better.

The morning after my last drink (nightmare), my husband sat down and told me.....that was in the past...it's a clean slate. (This is after literally hitting his head against the door in frustration/despair over me the night before)
He has never brought up my drinking except in a positive way ever since. Just an occasional comment - oh, I'm glad we don't drink.
Please tell Bubba or whoever - that you have a clean slate. It is in the past and it can't be changed but you don't need to keep hearing about it. :hug:

[abcowboy]

The thing is, sometimes I'm okay with that type of comment, I need to be reminded on occasion of what I put my loved ones through, it strengthens my resolve to stay sober. And other times I'm resentful of those comments, makes no sense to me...except when I feel they are said to intentionally make me feel guilty...

There are by far more times when I get nothing but praise and admiration for being able to quit, so I'll keep those moments in mind and not dwell on the others...

[Jude58]

Re: United Nations of MWO

[MENTION=21602]abcowboy[/MENTION], none of us ever asked to become alcoholics, and that's one of the ways that I try to deal with the guilt over past mistakes. People who don't drink, or can easily control their drinking, don't seem to get this. Alcoholics are often seen as weak willed or lazy, and the people who judge say, "Gee, all that they have to do is say no to drinking." Simple right? Ha! A lot of folks have no idea of the struggles that us recovering alkies face on a daily basis. The guilt from our past behavior is ever present, and often resurfaces when we least expect it. Don't let anyone put a damper on your sobriety; our mistakes are in the past, where they should remain. Maybe you don't need to apologize to every person that you treated badly due to your drinking. Quitting the booze and becoming the person that you are today, should be amends enough, and if some people think that it's not enough, so be it. Not your problem, and you need to let it go. You have had a very tough year and are under a lot of stress. Lately, you have given up so much of yourself to help others, and yes, I think that it's about time to get some counseling and talk about everything else that's going on in your life. You are feeling guilt over past mistakes made by a different version of the man that you are today.

[Pavati]

Re: United Nations of MWO

Hi, Cowboy--

I agree that counseling never hurt - consider it a tune up.

Lavande always recommends a book called Radical Forgiveness to Newbies. I haven't read it, but I know that part of the premise is how to forgive yourself. That should help with the guilt. Maybe try that? Forgiveness is not forgetting.

I also agree that those comments can't help and sound on the surface manipulative. Maybe counseling together?


Pav

[NoSugar]

Re: United Nations of MWO

This is much easier said than done [MENTION=21602]abcowboy[/MENTION], but it helps to realize that no one can make you feel guilty . They can say all sorts of things in an effort to hurt you but you don't have to accept it. If you are satisfied with how you are acting and treating others now, you have every reason to feel good about yourself and not to carry the baggage of a man who doesn't exist anymore. I agree with others that a conversation with the people who seem to want you to feel guilty for the past is in order and perhaps having that facilitated by a counselor would be really helpful.

You have a lovely husband, [MENTION=9757]NoraC[/MENTION], for having suggested immediately that you start fresh. He understands the power of forgiveness.

[JackieClaire]

Re: United Nations of MWO

I'll answer your post fully when I get to a proper keyboard. I just wanted to say I understand. We make amends each day by living sober. Talking therapies is a good idea.
Anyway just wanted to say I can relate and it will get better. I promise.....and I don't do promises lightly.

[abcowboy]

I wasn't really sure I should have brought this up in here, but I'm glad I did! Thank y'all for the comments and help, I think you saved me a trip back to my counsellor!

All of you reminded me that I was bringing this guilt down on myself, the man that did all those guilty things died almost 4 years ago. And you're right [MENTION=18725]NoSugar[/MENTION], no one can make me feel guilty, I'm the only one who can do that to myself. It's funny how we can forget some of the tools we used in the past, but you reminded me to corral those guilty thoughts, because that's all they are, thoughts...

Well, if you were still drinking [MENTION=7008]JackieClaire[/MENTION], I wouldn't put much worth in that promise lol. But I know that what you say is true, time does heal a lot of things!

The bottom line is thank you everyone! That's why I stay an active member here, the help and support we give each other is priceless!

[Pavati]

Re: United Nations of MWO

I posed this question in the nest, but I'll ask it here, too.

Does anyone still cook with wine? If not, what have you found that gives that rich, tart flavor in dishes like stew, or sauces?

[satz123]

Re: United Nations of MWO

I posed this question in the nest, but I'll ask it here, too.

Does anyone still cook with wine? If not, what have you found that gives that rich, tart flavor in dishes like stew, or sauces?

Of course I cook with wine Pav .... there is no alcohol left when boiled in a stew or sauce.

[JackieClaire]

Re: United Nations of MWO

I posed this question in the nest, but I'll ask it here, too.

Does anyone still cook with wine? If not, what have you found that gives that rich, tart flavor in dishes like stew, or sauces?

I don't and won't but Satz is right.......... it burns off. And here's the big but what about the leftover wine? The wine can't be kept for the next time it fades after a week or so........that's the wine snob in me.......used to work for a wine merchant. Gets expensive.

11 Non-Alcoholic Substitutes for Wine (Both Red and White)

I have had problems making French onion soup as that needs a large slosh of brandy in it near the end. Luckily at the place where I volunteer our chef is in recovery and he reccomends Marmite to give it the bite. Haven't tried it yet so I'll give you a heads up what its like.



[MENTION=21602]abcowboy[/MENTION]...........I haven't forgotten about you