Newbies Nest

[LavenderBlue]

Morning Nest! Armed with my coffee, let's see if I can be coherant. :P

I also started associating AL with issues and bad memories, it really seems to help me. It makes sense, really - other than keeping my brain remembering why I don't want any, it's a great way to respond back to those "reward" thoughts or when my brain wants to be crabby that I can't drink. It's a lot easier to kick those thoughts out when I can respond with, "But it did all this BAD stuff to me, how is that a reward or something I should miss, brain?" I'm pretty sure I picked that one up by osmosis here in the Nest, making sure I remember that I *don't* drink the way my AL brain wants me to think I would, so the experience it's trying to tempt me with is a lie.

Rahul - There's been some great advice here, and I gotta agree with it. It's funny, because I know when I start feeling detached I always feel like that's where I'm stuck, but it's not really true when I can always reach out. When I really think about it, I usually realize that I've been keeping myself away from other people, so of course they aren't going to reach out to me when I'm acting like I want to be left alone. But the good news is once you see it, you can start doing something about it. Good luck your way, and I hope you find a good way to plug back in soon!

Ava - There is definitely some music that I'm careful about listening to; I haven't listened to my favorite local Irish band since I quit since I know I associate those memories with seeing them out at the pub. But there's a lot of other music that I don't associate with drinking, so thank you for reminding me to be grateful for that. I'm glad you got to a place where you could enjoy yours again! On anxiety, I used to have myself trained to respond to racing thoughts by thinking, "Bless and release." Thanks for that reminder since it's a good habit to be in. Even if I can't let things go right away just because I thought that, it's still helpful.

MossRose - That's brilliant that you joined the Meetup; yay you and hope you have a blast!

Kensho - I know I started out slamming the coffee; I've slowly been weaning myself off. I have my coffee in the morning, but I found a really yummy green tea with spearmint that I've been drinking during the day when I don't want my water. It still has some caffeine, but less than coffee. And I started picking up some of the herbal teas I used to love in the evening. I'll still treat myself with coffee after dinner sometimes, but I also started noticing that too much was making me jittery.

Aqua - I used to get migraines all the time, good luck with yours they are not fun! I haven't had one in months now, but I'll see what happens. It's usually stress or sinus stuff that set mine off, so some of it depends on the time of year and what's going on.

I've been a little restless and on edge this week, so I've been spending some time on our excercise bike in addition to walking. The preprogramed workouts are tough; which is good since they distract me and use up that energy. I'm not positive, but I think I may be spending too much time worried over other people's issues and not enough focused on me. I know that stresses me out since I can't fix things FOR other people so I start trying to be the perfect friend AND give perfect advice which is WAY more than I need to be stressing over. My friends mostly just want someone to listen, and if listening to some of them is too stressful it's ok to take a step back sometimes. It's really easy for me to pick up on other people's moods - like I can be having a great day, but if someone I care about is hurting it really gets to me. Compassion is a good thing, but I don't need to make myself miserable from someone else's issues.

[Hypernova]

Aqua, funny you should mention associating bad things with AL, that's just what I do. Every negative connotation I can I tack on to it. AL is the enemy and in no way do I support it. I don't buy it, I don't like posts on FB that show it, and I darn sure will not drink it! That stuff tried to kill me! (and still would IF I let it!). So I think it's a good thing....I wouldn't play with a rattlesnake and Im not going to play with AL.

Negative connotations I think this is a great idea to use. Imagine all the negatives associated with AL and drinking what's the upside? ~~ Here's another one to add to the list, just wish I had thought to post it on April 15.
Imagine 40%!!!!http://www.nationaljournal.com/congr...-soon-20140228 ~ I don't want to make this political and I get very aggravated at the Gov. and their profligate ways. So I grin and pay my taxes but I do not like to give them voluntarily one more dime than is necessary. Hidden or so called imbedded taxes are everywhere and yet we are broke. So I will choose to save and not hand over my hard earned money to Uncle Sam while he smiles and says have another. I'll pass for now and next time I think to buy a beer I will literally look at my money and think what wasteful things the Gov. would likely do if I handed over 40% of my money to them.

[Byrdlady]

Hyper, congrats on your 30 days!!! Your hat, my dear! :guy:
I'm so happy for you!

Interesting article about 40% of that money going to US. AL is big business!!!
Hope you are enjoying your big day!! B

[KENSHO]

Checking in. Terribly stressful week. I am craving a drink (but actually, I am craving sleep and a mental break). Funny how we teach ourselves to associate alcohol as a cure-all, when if we look a bit further, the answer is something simple like food, sleep, socialization, breathing or a good cry or laugh. Hmph - looking forward to a weekend!!

[available]

Hi nesters

I'm waiting in Bangkok to catch another plane to Phuket, I survived the flight, just but am coming down with something my boys had last week. Damn the coffee is shit on planes no wonder I only drank al lol! Not a craving or an urge or a desire! This is how I love life.

Ps mum driving me nuts but I'm tired and sick and she's deaf as a post

[Lavande]

Good evening Nesters,

Geez Ava, sure hope you get well soon & don't lose any of your vacation time. Say Hi to your Mum for me

Hypernova, Congrats on your 30 AF days, great!
I had no idea about the beer taxes - ridiculous!!

Kensho, hope you get lots of rest & get youself back into balance. We have a good thing going here, we don't want to mess up, right?

Overit, hope you are OK :hug:

Wishing everyone a safe & peaceful night in the nest!

Lav

[abcowboy]

Hello everyone! There’s been some talk on other threads as to why MWO seems to slow down from time to time. People are busy, have become complacent, have found another source of support, need face to face, or have become comfortable and firm in their sobriety. There could be many reasons other than relapse, although I fear relapse is a big contributor. For me, like the other old timers, when I feel comfortable and firm in my quit, then it’s time to give back, to help others enjoy the freedom that I feel.

I am not an addiction counselor, nor am I trained in any way to advise people how to beat their addiction. I am a fellow alcohol addict who woke on another Day One and decided I needed more than AA, so I began to look on the internet for more information about my situation. That search led me to MWO, where I have been an active participant for most of the past 3/4 year. I have been sober for most of that time, but not all of it. I have noticed a recurring pattern in my sober spells. I begin with very high resolve to beat this addiction, but over time that resolve declines, finding more reasons and excuses, leading inevitably to more drinking. I have noticed a similar pattern expressed by some other members who want to stay stopped, but who do not find it easy.

There are many members of the forum who have long term sobriety. I put them in two categories. The first is the group whose drinking led them to great personal tragedy; jail time, children taken away, loss of family, injured someone while drunk, injured themselves while drunk, lost job and living on streets, etc. Those people experienced a life altering event that filled them with unshakable resolve to remain sober. The second is the group who stopped their drinking before their personal lives came to tragedy. They realized their drinking was a problem, the negative consequences were piling up, so they stopped and stayed stopped. I want to be in that second group. I am terrified of ending up in that first group.

We both wake up on Day One overcome by the negative consequences of our drinking and highly resolved to quit this behavior and remain sober. We continue on this path for a while, let’s call it Path A, but at some point a change in direction comes. It might be a few days or a few weeks, but as sure as the sun rises, that change will come. The resolve to remain sober declines, ultimately leading to relapse. Judging from some of the posts I see, I was not alone in this pattern.
Yet for some, they experience a change in direction that actually elevates their resolve to remain sober. They do not drink again. Their path, let’s call it Path B, leads to happily ever after - or at least soberly ever after. Either way, it is the path I am now on.

So, ask yourself, "What makes the difference between traveling on Path A or Path B?" Here is my opinion. It is the CHOICES and ACTIONS before one hits that fork in the road that will have the greatest influence on which path is travelled. The path you choose is your decision and yours alone, no one can make it for you.

I am seeing a counsellor, and I believe it is going well. She is providing me with tools and strategies to maintain my resolve. I have a renewed faith in God and pray daily. So far it is working for me. There are other strategies working for members of that pre-tragedy group of recovering alcoholics. AA, AVRT, SMART, MWO, etc. I haven't tried all of them, only MWO and AA, and still borrow from AA as needed. Whatever works to keep me to Path B this time is what I’m sticking with! But one thing is for sure, I can’t do it alone. That is why I pray daily, I read and post on MWO daily, and I see my counsellor once a month. As Robert said about black boxes, if it isn’t broke, why fix it!

[Lavande]

Good morning Nesters, happy Saturday to all

I'm up early to prepare for another busy day with my busy 4 year old granddaughter. Life is good!!

Great post Cowboy, thanks!

SF, glad you are able to deal with others drinking around you. That just keep getting easier, believe me

Wishing everyone a great AF Saturday!!

Lav

[aquamarine]

Hi Everyone Day 10 for me. Cowboy that was an awesome post. That is exactly how my sobriety has gone over the years. I went almost a year AF some years ago mostly by coming here and then just as you describe slowly lost the resolve or the feeling of its importance and went back to drinking. I have had shorter periods of AF over the years with the same pattern. You're right the choices and actions before you get to that fork are essential. I think once you get to that fork it's too late. It's hard work.I think I repeatedly underestimate how much work and focus this takes. For myself I think I always eventually convince myself when I haven't drank for awhile that I can do it . I guess I convince myself I am not an alcoholic and that I can drink like everyone else. It's so incredibly stupid that I do this over and over. I truly admire everyone who has stayed AF for a really long period of time. I find it just incredulous and I respect it so much. I honestly don't have a deep rooted confidence in my ability to do this permanently- although I desperately want and need to. I wish I did. Thank you for your post Cowboy. It was a great start to my day.
Hope everyone has a peaceful joyful day!

[Byrdlady]

Good Morning, Neaster!
Cowboy, that was an awesome post. Tool Box worthy!! Tuck it in for us, would you?

Cliches are cliches for a reason. The one that rings true (one of many, actually) is 'Out of sight, out of mind'. Have you ever had a bad infection, gone to the Dr and gotten an antibiotic? As soon as we start to feel better, we stop taking it. The bottle ALWAYS says to complete the entire course of it, but why bother, right? Many times, the infection never completely goes away....and what's more, it now becomes resistant to the antibiotic. Every time the 'bug' gets a new opportunity to regrow, it becomes stronger and harder to kill. Alcoholism is just like a virus. Only in THIS case, you must keep up the treatment for life.
On the questionof 'Why is MWO is quiet?' I have observed that this usually doesnt represent everyone riding off happily into the sunset. Staying free of AL is HARD work and what do most people wamt to do when they work hard? They want to tell you about it! I had a week from hell and YES, I shared it here! When we are staying AF we come here for support and reinforcement that we are doing the right thing. Distancing yourself from your support is very risky. If you look at the stats, the percentage of folks achieving LONG term sobriety is low. Why? Because as we start to feel better we think we are cured and we distance ourselves from our support and the rest is available on the Relapse Thread. Getting sober is half of the battle....STAYING sober is the trick.
Are there people who stay sober without checking in daiky or even weekly? Im sure there are, but they are the exceptions (like we all think we are). That is certainly NOT what I have observed here at MWO. I understand that we all want to be NORMAL. Unfortunately, we are not. We have a disease that can go in remission only if we stay clear of the cause, but every one (friends, SO's, relatives) and every thing (tv, magazines) seems to be offering it to us on a silver platter as if it were the Sacriment. It IS hard to be different, but Id ratther be sober-different than a drunk. This takes maintenance, and I am willing to do whatever it takes to avoid Day1 again. This is a very small price to pay....For me anyway. The way I see it, I avoided rehab, I dont have to leave the house to go to a meeting, it's private and I can check in at my convenience....nothing too difficult about that.
The night I got down on my knees in my bathroom and prayed to God to help me out of this Alco-hell, I promised that if He helped me out, I would never go back. So far, so good. Dont be a statistic! Stay connected! You will never be sorry for being sober!
Hope evryone has a great day! Byrdie

[Dutch1988]

I really enjoyed your post abc, and can relate whole heartedly. In the past few weeks my brain has been telling me that logging on here is more a a pain than it truly is. I know this is strictly coming from a place of making it okay to drink, as this is really the only monitoring system I have. I don't do AA, I am not doing any other methods other than things I have found in the toolbox. I basically read everyone's posts in the nest and respond/reply when a nerve is hit, and hope people respond to me when I ask for help. That being said, I know I am coming up on the discipline aspect of this little journey. The excitement of starting has long past and I definitely need to hunker down and dig in my heels if this is going to be successful.

EDIT: I had to cut out short since I am at work, but had a lesson cancel so here I am. My ultrasound yesterday went very well, although my wife and I can't figure out why our baby would be one week behind(we know the day she ovulated and already factored in the number of days for travel and all that for the egg) I think we both feel better knowing it's healthy. I have a tournament I am competing in this afternoon for grappling. I have always gotten so nervous before these types of events, makes it very difficult to do my best when I am anxious and nervous for hours before I even have to compete. I tried taking something for my anxiety so at least now I don't have the runs, but still very nervous. My AL brain loves to take advantage of me at these things, telling myself that I could enjoy a nice relaxing drink afterwards no matter what happens, and that I made it 6 weeks without drinking so I must be okay. Pretty sure I know better by now. An excited prospect is this is the first tournament in a few years where I don't remember drinking the night before, and I am hoping this will help my cardio and endurance since in the past it has been a hindrance. I am really starting to realize that this is the only place I come and talk about what is really going on inside my head, perhaps I should work on that in my other relationships, since never talking about my own struggles to problems is just going to create a lot more stress and anxiety. Oh well, happy Saturday all!

[Hypernova]

I honestly don't have a deep rooted confidence in my ability to do this permanently- although I desperately want and need to. I wish I did. Thank you for your post Cowboy. It was a great start to my day.
Hope everyone has a peaceful joyful day!

First aquamarine 10 days is great and I find them to be very tough especially the first four/ keep up the good work!!! ~ Sorry to say I feel pretty much the same w/your feelings of any ability to do this permanently. Myself I am doing this ODAT now & expect (with work) that I may come to realize that I also need this desperately and will come to the want and need part before it leads to desperation. I am finding proactive is far superior to reactive and to make this leap concerning AL is going to take time. Being proactive I plan on visiting MWO daily, praying, removing myself from ANY situation that may trigger me and being vigilant of my mindset & of course for me I find exercise to be the single most proactive step I've found. On the reactive end well I just guess just being proactive will help me not to react when tempted to drink when I find myself in a poor/stressful situation or depressed mood. Mentally I picture myself sitting on my hands ~ can't do much with the hands including picking up a drink while sitting on them. :happy2: ~ Anyway have tons of chores to take care of that became thrown in the tomorrow I'll do it bin b/c of drinking/hangover/anxiety. So I am going to set a few tasks before myself today to accomplish and kindly not overburden myself w/ an impossible to do list that will as always lead to frustration and then feeling overwhelmed & accomplishing nada which leads to a desire to drink. So ODAT it is!
Cowboy I also really enjoyed your post. We do have a choice http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-TaedWmFV7v...s+Traveled.jpg.
Today I choose not to drink.

[LavenderBlue]

Kensho - It really is weird when you look at it. I've started noticing when people around me do the, "Man, I need a drink," thing, too - especially if it's after a "How are you feeling?" type question. It's meant to tell you their emotions, but that's not actually an emotion! Frustrated, sad, bored, lonely, THOSE are feelings. I know as well as anyone that it's a cultural shorthand, but when you think about it, what a sucky shorthand for actual feelings.

Abcowboy - What a lovely post, thank you so much for sharing that here! I'm not an old timer myself so I can't speak for them, but I think you're right about it being choices and actions. Everyone here has reasons they want AL out of their lives, everyone here has had trouble doing that or they wouldn't be here, and everyone here has ideas about why their drinking got so bad or why it's so hard for them...so the big difference is what everyone has chosen to DO about it. A lot of what I've learned here helped me stop seeing myself as "special" in ways that got in my way. I'm still special as a person, don't get me wrong, but seeing so many folks struggle made me realize my issues don't make me "special" and that's actually a GOOD thing. It means many other people have walked this path and found ways to get through, so I can, too. It's no longer, "I'm the ONLY ONE who's ever felt like this and since I can't stop I'll NEVER find a way." It's not easy, and it's a lot of work and maintenance, but I can see here that it can be done. And what's better is, I don't even have to figure out all of it myself, I can listen to the folks who have already been doing this for years and learn what's worked for them.

Aqua - Yay day 10! I don't know if it'll help you, but for me when I'm wondering if I'm "really" an alcoholic or not I usually decide to stop worrying about the answer. I know that I had a lot of issues with AL, I know my life was crappy while I was drinking, and I kow it was incredibly hard for me to stop; and looking at it that way, it makes sense for me to stop and stay stopped. If I started having issues everytime I ate an apple, I'd stop eating apples, you know? On my better days, I'm pretty sure it's just my pride and other things making me shy away from the label, but as long as I know the important thing is I can't drink anymore that's the part I need to refocus.

For some of the other tempting thoughts, a few folks here said something that really stuck with me a while ago. The idea was that someone who really doesn't have an issue with AL also wouldn't have an issue without it. They wouldn't be plotting and planning and arguing with themselves over if they could have just one or any of that; if they decided to quit they just would and that'd be it. So if I'm viewing drinking as this magic thing that I can save up sober points to have back...I'm NOT thinking like a normal drinker. And if I'm not thinking like a normal drinker, I'm still not a normal drinker (not that I expect to be, this is what I tell my AL brain) which means having even one is still a REALLY BAD IDEA. Maybe it helps that one of the things I hated about my drinking was the amount of control it had over my life, so when those thoughts come up and want to take control of me it hit red buttons and I don't want to go back to that.

Other than that, I had a pleasant night last night which was good. Just a good night virtually hanging out with some of my online friends. It's a good reminder to me that sometimes when I'm feeling "Bleh" it's good for me to have some social time and get out of my own head for a bit. Need to run errands today and hopefully do some cleaning around the house. A friend of mine is getting ready to do a charity garage sale and I've told her I'll give her some donations. It's double important to me because I said I'd do it last year...but between the drinking and everything else, I bailed on it. She was super understanding, but I still want to do better this time.

Take care all, hope you have a great AF MAE!

[Rahulthesweet]

Cowboy,

Great post. I have been one of those who plan on being long term sober and come in here to check out from time to time. I have not been posting much but MWO is slow ??!! Look at the quality of posts in last 24 hours.

Byrdlady is rocking .... Ava is traveling and still checking this place out and newbies nest is still filled with nubies and oldies ....

Byrdlady rightly said staying sober is the challenge and I believe that cannot be done without support. Support may be a lot of talkong to say a sponsors or a broad feeling in the mind that my support is out there in MWO (like the way I think)

I have been sober for one year plus. But I so remember the days you are describing. Failures, guilt and just unable tostop. Now sober the life is sooooo different. Some of the basic things we used to stress upon so much (like duty free AL) is sudden of least or no importance.

For me I have been always been an odd man out there ... For various reasons but now being sober I feel I am even odder ..

But then I am of those with "who gives a damn nature" do dont bother what other person is thinking when I am holding a glass of coke while they are sipping AL.

Like so great to waste on AL. ..

I am going to GOA tomorrow for a beach side wedding and 2 days of wedding I expect to see lots of folks drinking and going mad. But it does not bother me. I sometimes feel I was in that phase and now I have out grown that phase.

For me knowing hownthr brain and addiction works helped quite a lot. That's why I can NEVER have AL ... Not because I hate it or dispose it but its just not important to me me anymore ....

I wish I can be more active here and help lots of new bies ... I hope I too can we much more connected to so many fine folks here who helped me put during my time of need.

But one thing I realized is the most precious thing in life .... Time.

[Hanna]

Hi all

Some great posts here about "staying " sober, which is tough..very easy to get complacent. Hubby does not want to live with the uncertainty of whether I may drink again. Even IF I knew for sure, there is no way to give him assurance...and truth is...how CAN I be sure? I can't, not for sure. I can plan to be, focus on today, use my tools. That's all I can do. Ultimately, my gut tells me that will not be enough for him. I can only keep going forward and doing what I am doing. The last weeks have been beyond hard. Tonight is when the whole family is getting together to celebrate a few occasions, including hubby and my 19 th anniversary. Only my sister knows the deal. Gotta put my game face on, and SO don't want to.. Tough times.

Over it

I am thinking of you and what you are going through - sober, and trying to gain strength from that. I give you big hugs.

Well, guess that is it here. Great post cowboy