Newbies Nest

[Starfish1]

It's a process, Kensho, and we have all had to learn a lot in order to make progress. You are making progress now by thinking about the choices you have been making and the consequences.

I know folks here on the site have different ideas and opinions of what alcoholism really is. I choose to believe it is a disease. It's very difficult for me not to blame myself for the fix I've gotten myself into, but you know, people can't help being sick. What they can help is ignoring their illness and getting sicker and sicker. We deserve better than that.

You just admitted, in your post, that you are addicted and you said that you have been "working hard" to become un-addicted. In my opinion, if this is a disease, then, no matter how hard we work, we can't become un-addicted any more than a diabetic can work hard to become un-diabetic or a person with a peanut allergy can work really hard to overcome that. It's really simple when you think that way. The only thing we can do is avoid what exacerbates our illness, whether it is sugar, or peanuts or alcohol.

Kensho, by giving up the notion that you can control your impulses over alcohol, you are not admitting defeat at all. You are showing courage and strength and you are WINNING, not losing a thing.

Yes, you need to give up the battle and be kind to yourself. And I bet your marriage will not only survive, but thrive. I can't imagine anything differently, and surely your children will benefit.

Good luck!

[NoSugar]

I have a lot of trouble stating I am an “alcoholic” - because of the lack of repercussions and lack of overall quantity I drink, but I can definitely admit I am addicted, and that my behavior related to AL is not healthy or normal. Likely, I’m at the beginning end of a very bad future if I keep alcohol in it.

Kensho, I have never referred to myself as an alcoholic. If its connotation fit with its denotation (a person addicted to intoxicating drinks), I'd be fine with it. But, it's a loaded term and I don't accept all that goes with the word.

This seems to be a theme in most of your posts:

because of the lack of repercussions and lack of overall quantity I drink

In my opinion, this is your ego talking. As I've written to you before, those characteristics aren't relevant to experiencing or overcoming addiction. They also are a means to separate yourself from "them" and by them, I mean the rest of us here who regardless of quantity or outcome drink/drank "too much", whatever that means for each person.

I did the distancing thing when I first joined MWO and thought I'd be able to get some information and support here but for the most part, I would think, organize, and control my way out given that that has worked for me for essentially everything else in my life. I didn't let go of the fact that I didn't drink as much as many people here, I only drank wine, and I had no external repercussions. That thinking tethered me to addiction.

I read a post by Mollyka about ego (I wish I knew where it was). It finally dawned on me that I wasn't the only well-educated, normally self-controlled, apparently successful person here and that I wasn't the only one who didn't live in the gutter like a "real alcoholic". Molly's post helped me put my inflated ego aside and simply do what the people here were doing. I wasn't smarter, better, or less addicted than any of them. They had something to teach me and they were freely offering it. It would have been so foolish to reject it.

Most of us who are fortunate enough have access to the internet aren't so much different than you. In broad terms, we are socioeconomically equal. We're similarly educated and all have enough money to support an expensive addiction. There are others who in terms of addiction are just like us but don't have a support group so readily available. We're not better than them either, just luckier.

This is one of the most interesting and interested, thoughtful, well-rounded, and funny groups of people I've ever met. It's okay to belong here.

NS

[Eloise]

Yup, it is okay to belong here NS!

[Marylou123]

NS -- I would click the "Love this post" button if there was one.

[Matt M.]

Kensho- Thanks for coming back and being honest, I commend you for that. Star and NS really nailed it with their responses. A few things I would like to share..

I want to be honest and share what happened on Sat. night. I posted about drinking thoughts. I arrived at the restaurant, and ordered soda water. Halfway though the meal, I thought, what could be wrong with just one wine? And I had one wine. Once I had half of it, I wished I hadn't - as if it did nothing positive for me. I thought, how stupid - you “indulged” and don’t even like the result. Yet when I got home, right before bed nonetheless, I snuck into the freezer for a shot. What?!?

I know I sound like a confused broken record. The fact that I snuck more at home, right before bed, is not normal thinking. I have a lot of trouble stating I am an “alcoholic” - because of the lack of repercussions and lack of overall quantity I drink, but I can definitely admit I am addicted, and that my behavior related to AL is not healthy or normal. Likely, I’m at the beginning end of a very bad future if I keep alcohol in it.

Alcoholic Smalcoholic, to me its semantics, a title, a name for what I consider a disease.
Recently I posted some readings from The Big Book Of AA---The Doctor's Opinion
http://www.aa-israel.org/pages/problem.htm A great short read ( I dont preach AA yet I find many things in the big book helpful) 2 things that are discussed are Manifestation of Allergy and Phenomenon of craving...
These doctors believe We have a physical allergy to Alcohol. The definition for the word "allergy" is, "Excess sensitiveness to certain substances which are harmless to most persons."
the point here being, It does not make a damn how many we drink, its the FIRST introduction of that substance in our bodies, when this happens things begin to change and the Phenomenon of craving kicks into Overdrive. Yet only to US.....The peanut allergy analogy is a great one. I've physically seen with my own eyes people in anaphylactic shock from peanuts. They were close to death, with some outstanding paramedic skills by " you know who" they lived. You can bet your ass they didn't walk out of ICU and go buy some peanut oil, thinking well its not actual "peanuts" its oil, so it should be OK right? Nope they are back in the hospital....

I guess the only thing I can do is stop. There is no “just one” for me over time, and that is what I need to remember. I really believed my alcohol abuse was a thing of the past - but my brain needs none in order to not need more and more. I get that - just sucks to admit. Life will be full and functional without alcohol - there’s no reason to hang on to it now. I will have to deal with not feeling as connected with my husband and his family - without alcohol. That will be hard. And I shutter thinking about it now. I’m not sure my marriage can weather me not drinking. But I’ve always been brave - and now it is time to be brave.

Help me with this one~ Either your saying your family will disown you because you no longer drink (which I doubt) or If you can't drink then by God no one else will either, and if they do your out?
Don't get me wrong we all have pressures from friends and family , but to say life will be full and functional without Alcohol BUT my marriage will fail is a recipe for disaster IMO

I am not Superwoman, no matter how hard I try to be - I am an alcohol addict and that is one of the dark marks to my personality. And that’s OK, it would be helpful for me to recognize more of my limitations. The really bad thing would be to continue to ignore AL, and abuse it and struggle with it. I grew up in an environment that taught me that as a woman, “I could BE anything and DO anything if I set my mind to it and worked hard”. Unfortunately, I can’t seem be un-addicted to alcohol, so “working hard” to be so is getting me nowhere. I’ve viewed it as a challenge, like if I work hard enough at it, I can accomplish un-addiction. Isn’t that stupid?? And my first thought is to say that I should “admit defeat” against AL - but that is thinking as though I’ve failed. Perhaps I need to view alcohol as a part of me that I just shouldn't fight. Perhaps I need to fight less in general and be more kind to myself, ALL the parts of myself.

A tough one for me, to say I've been beat. I'm a Type A, self proclaimed Macho Firefighter ☺ nothing will defeat me! I can honestly say I was defeated at trying to moderate my drinking. On the flip side I am winning by not letting that cockwad take another day from me!

I'm pulling for you Thank you for sharing your feelings
Stay Hard FFS!

[LilBit]

Most of us who are fortunate enough have access to the internet aren't so much different than you. In broad terms, we are socioeconomically equal. We're similarly educated and all have enough money to support an expensive addiction. There are others who in terms of addiction are just like us but don't have a support group so readily available. We're not better than them either, just luckier.

This is one of the most interesting and interested, thoughtful, well-rounded, and funny groups of people I've ever met. It's okay to belong here.

NS

Here, here, NS! Well said. And I must go on record as saying that I only drank boxed wine a few times to avoid having to deal with so many bottles. I'm joking there, but there was actually a time when I convinced myself that I really didn't have a problem because I only drank fine wines.

To all the recent posters, it's so nice to read back through the thread a few days and have absolutely nothing to add because everything was so well addressed. I'll just post a completely unrelated-to-anything photo instead.

[Guitarista]

Yo y'all!

I am loving one of Matt's mantra's. 'My darkest days are my greatest allie' or words to that effect. And congrat's on 1 year Matt!

Great posts as usual Nesters. It sure is ok to belong here! It's an honour. Have a gr8 week. G

[Pavati]

Hi, All:

No Sugar, BRILLIANCE as usual. I felt the same way, and now I feel the same way.

Kensho - admitting to having a problem feels scary, but once you TRULY accept that you can't drink, you'll find lightness and freedom. The Bubble Hour has a good episode on Accepting Acceptance. You and your husband's family will adjust. Both my family and my husband's family drink a lot, and drinking is an integral part of many family functions. Last year I went to a family reunion and not until Sunday afternoon did people realize I hadn't been drinking. I always had a cup in my hand, was always laughing and having fun - no one suspected I could behave crazy and silly as always without booze. It was a shock to us all. You'll get there, I know you will. Thanks for your honesty and vulnerability in sharing that experience with us.

I am off to a meeting at my kid's school tonight. I am sure I will see parents who have already had at least one after-work drink. Thank goodness that won't be me!

xo
Pav

[Pavati]

x post, G. Hiya.

[Guitarista]

Likely, I’m at the beginning end of a very bad future if I keep alcohol in it.

And my first thought is to say that I should “admit defeat” against AL - but that is thinking as though I’ve failed. Perhaps I need to view alcohol as a part of me that I just shouldn't fight. Perhaps I need to fight less in general and be more kind to myself, ALL the parts of myself.

No failure friend.

What about thinking of it as 'surrender'? Sort of like....'ok, this is something I cannot control when it's in my system, and well........that's ok. It is a constant barrier to my overall happiness, so having acknowledged that through exhaustive trial and error, I will just let it go and move on'

Good to see you Kensho.

Hiya Pavi!

[LavenderBlue]

Quit wining, good going on Day 2!

Kensho, thinking we can get past AL addiction if we just work hard enough brought a lot of us here, it's definitely not just you. And as many many other folks have mentioned, many of us are also used to being able to fight through things. It's hard to admit that what you're doing isn't working, and you have to try something completely different. The good news is you're right - even though we can't work had enough to "handle" the addiction, we CAN make a different choice. we can choose to put all that energy towards something we CAN do, which is quitting. I probably sound like a cheerleader here, I just remember how tiring it was fighting with myself every day, especially when I never seemed to "win." I don't think choosing to stop drinking means AL won, it means the opposite! You're choosing to walk away from something that's killing you, even though it's hard to do. That's a win in my book, like walking away from an abusive relationship doesn't mean you've failed at the relationship (even though it can feel that way), it means you're making the better and healthier choice for yourself by leaving.

That's about all I got tonight, Nest - super tired! Take care all!

[All done drinking]

G man - we've been here a long time. Glad to see you back.

The thrill is gone...

Addy (All Done Drinking...Yes)

[Quit wining]

Day 2 was a lot tougher, physically and mentally than I expected but my day remained AF!

Hope everyone has a good night in the nest.

[KENSHO]

Thank you to everyone for listening and responding, and for the encouragement - Starfish, Pav, Guitarista, LavB. A lot of lessons in those texts for me. I have read and re-read.

MATT: I like peanuts, but I would have no problem never ingesting another one if it made me want five more and then made me sick and sluggish and (insert list here). To clarify on the marriage part...When I wasn't drinking before, I felt I was growing and learning better ways of coping. My husband wasn't. That made me feel distance, and made me see him in a different light. No more beer goggles!

NS: I printed your post. I don't know what to say except that it hit me hard and I really appreciate you taking the time to write those particular words. No one here had to respond, but people did. Thank you for the kindness.

I do know that I can spin this thing any way I choose to by what I focus on. I can talk myself into anything - even more so when alcohol is helping. But the facts are that I used to hide empty bottles in my fabric bags. I used to crack wine bottles on the way home with my kids in the back seat. (ashamed). I used to obsess about when and how the next drink would come. And I was meaner, less nurturing, a terrible listener, and hid my alcohol breath. True, I was able to have a few drinks without really craving them - and not wanting more - after some AF time. But once I believed I could live that way, all bets were off and things began to progress to problem drinking again. DAMN! I am the type to just keep trying to make it work! And it is tempting - but I think that's probably the addiction talking.

For now, I will focus on getting to my birthday (30-ish days) - because I remember how much more perspective I had after some solid AF time. We are headed with friends (sort of - closer friends of my husband) for the weekend in the mountains. Relatives of theirs have a cabin. Three nights. They drink a LOT. I'm not looking forward to it, but I need to go into it with a positive attitude.

[Guitarista]

Hi, All:

No Sugar, BRILLIANCE as usual. I felt the same way, and now I feel the same way.

Kensho - admitting to having a problem feels scary, but once you TRULY accept that you can't drink, you'll find lightness and freedom. The Bubble Hour has a good episode on Accepting Acceptance.

xo
Pav

Just listened to this episode Pav. It's a beauty. Thanks for sharing it. I can strongly recommend it to everyone, particularly if you are struggling with accepting you have a drinking problem. The show also touches on ego with this quote.....'The global conspiracy against you has been cancelled due to lack of interest'. lol.

All the best for the weekend trip Kensho. I would pass on it if it were me at this stage, but you've probably got the tools to get you through. Take care. :egad:

Have a safe, sober and magical week all. G