Newbies Nest

[KENSHO]

Hi Okoren. Good to see you.

Made it through 14 days. It was much harder than I expected. Feeling down tonight; just wanting a drink to "fix" it. But I know this drill. Feeling like such a fool right now. Trying not to overthink.

[Guitarista]

Congratulations on 14 days Kensho. Fab stuff friend. Keep it going.

1 day, 3 days, 14, 16, 18 days booze free ALL are extremely huge achievements. It might seem like nothing, and it might seem like early days, but this really means something! It is a personal statement to ourselves that we are taking action right here, right now to live and be happy. Bravo you Mile stoners!


Think I'm gonna dance now...... :dancin:

[Dutch1988]

Okoren the fact that you came right back here and didn't disappear for weeks drinking says a lot about you. I know we are not supposed to take breaking an AF streak lightly but you jumped right back in, good for you! if nothing else you've shown me that drinking for a year and having a beer doesn't mean I have to give up my AF lifestyle, I can make a mistake and still jump back in. Just tonight I was talking to my wife about drinking at dinner and she went from you weren't that bad 3 months ago to you probably had a problem. Just her saying that reaffirmed my resolve but she also pointed out I have always been awful when folks tell me not to do something, and she didn't want to stoke that fire. Don't know why you drank but when you figure it out come here and enlighten us, you might save someone's ass.

[Mr Vervill]

Wow, many things hit me hard tonight.

Dutch, way to be there for others.

Eloise, such a sad situation for those folks

Byrdie your niece seems to have it together, must have a great mentor!

Kensho, great on 2 weeks!

Okoren, Wow, I never expected a fall from you. You've been such a positive force around here. Maybe the bike ride in France brought about the romantic/nostalgic memories of AL. I know it would for me. My two brothers and I once biked across Austria, stopping off at mom & pop wineries, and spending nights at local brew pubs. I know knoe if I were to do that trip today, I'd be so tempted to fall. As you analyze what caused you to fail, I can't help but think this is part of the problem. I KNOW it would be huge for me. Despite have so few drinks, things could have easily gone haywire. (again, at least for me). That said, I'd like to here more about the ride!

ABC,
(apologizes to all, I have not yet figured out how to due quotes, Can someone PM on the method?)

ABC=(As the old saying goes “you get out what you put in” and for me that is especially true with MWO. You can come here and just read, absorb all that is talked about, and you will get some benefit from the stories shared and advice given. But it’s when you start to contribute, to get involved, when the real benefit of online recovery shines through! You see, by helping and supporting others, you are helping and supporting yourself, and that’s what service is all about, helping each other help themselves!
And you think you have nothing to contribute, your story isn’t as bad, or it’s just the same as everyone else’s. That may be true as well, but here you have a place to unload those burdens, and by talking about them, you are one step closer to laying them to rest.)

The purpose of this quote is, that I just watched a segment on the local news about a woman who killed herself, and a fund raiser to help her family.
She was a local cross-fit trainer, and had hundreds of clients and followers. Despite the huge support system she seemed to have, she obviously felt she had no one to reach out to.
Hundreds of people in the area, and around the world, reached out to help. All too late.

The real point, for me,is, despite the small MWO community, several hundred active members, and as few as 20 on any given day, I am so grateful for each and every one of you who come here every day to support others in their fight.

Thank You!
Today I am grateful for all of you.

[Pavati]

Hi, All:

I agree, Ok, it was courageous of you to come right back and start posting again. It will be interesting to hear your reflection of what happened. Stories like yours are what keep me coming here to check in with my sober community regularly - I am afraid I don't really know how close to that cliff I truly am. Thanks for your honesty, and I am very glad you came back.

When I was new and an old timer relapsed it always REALLY shook me up. I figured someone who had a year sober would be "safe." And then I got depressed about the chances of relapsing, and how often I see it happen.

A wise nest BYRD told me - just because it happened to them doesn't mean it has to happen to you. Take someone else's relapse and use it to bolster your own resolve. Or some such words. Point being, I know some of you must be confused by Ok's drinking. Even to the thoughts - well, he had a few and is back... STOP RIGHT THERE! See that relapse in retrospect thread. Talk to a sponsor. Do what it takes to keep YOUR sober plan in place.

I guess that was a lot of me saying what to do. What I really mean is that is what I do when that happens. I know I am closer to that cliff than I think, and I am holding on to the railing for dear life.

Good night folks. I had a really great long weekend - so much laughing and fun, excellent sleep, good friends and family. All with NO booze. It IS possible.

xo
Pav

[Guitarista]

I would add that whilst it's a really positive move for someone (Okeron or anyone) who has relapsed after some sizable AF time to post again right away, this is a dangerous time for the relapser. The chemical reaction/pathways with booze and our mind/body has been reawakened. Along with the depressant effect of the chemical reaction (booze with our brain chemistry), often comes the psychological effect of shame and lowered self worth, maybe throw in some guilt and regret.

These factors can be enough to tip us over back into old drinking routines if we aren't careful. For me, I would need to be careful with my thoughts and actions in the hours days and weeks to come, until the physical and psychological hangover is gone. It's not always as easy as just getting back on the wagon. Maybe our motivation or intensity of the reason/s for quitting is different to what it once was. Just my experience and thoughts for what it's worth.

Rawk on Nesters!

[Lavande]

Good Tuesday morning Nesters,

Glad you came back to the Nest Okoren! Glue yourself in & get solid in your quit once again,

G, I would say we all need to be careful with our thoughts & actions
For me, one negative thought leads to another & another & the next thing I know I am on my way to depression city. I learned my lesson a long time ago & will never let negative thinking in the driver's seat again.

Greetings to all & sending wishes for a great AF day!

Lav

[Guitarista]

G, I would say we all need to be careful with our thoughts & actions
For me, one negative thought leads to another & another & the next thing I know I am on my way to depression city. I learned my lesson a long time ago & will never let negative thinking in the driver's seat again.

And I bet your exercise regime is an important factor Lav. It sure is for me. I know I need to lace up the running shoes and get my funky ass out the door early to start my day. I always feel good when I get back home. If I lounge around tooooo much without direction, my mind has a fairly even chance to go to it's default 'miserable fcker' setting!

Have a bewdy Nesters.

[Matt M.]

Good Morning
Not much going on with me, just work, kid sports and a little Dove hunting.

Okoren- This one will definitely sting a bit, but good for you on coming back.
The Power of this thing I call a disease, never ceases to amaze me. Cunning, baffling and fucking powerful.
I appreciate you sharing because Reading stories of relapse scares me some, but really strengthens my commitment to this journey, especially relapses after a year AF...

Hope everyone has a great day!
Stay Hard!

[Byrdlady]

Good Morning, Nesters!
Pav, you picked up on the same thing I did!
Dutch, for every 1 strong, dedicated person who jumps right back up into the saddle and STAYS there for good there are about 50 who don't. If there is one thing I have learned on these forums and the school I attend (Hard Knocks U), is that addiction doesn't take vacation. Seriously, this must be looked at just like a peanut allergy. You don't see those folks having a few every so often! It's life threatening for them, AND for us. It takes NO TIME to be right back where we started and worse! If we could all just 'have a few' after an extended period of time AF then what would all the fuss be? We can't do that because our brains are wired to want MORE of this thing. Feeding your addiction is NEVER GOOD. Starving it is the only way I have ever seen to get out of this mess! Don't lose your quit for anything or anybody! It's NOT worth it. I have never heard anyone say that it was!!! EVER!

Yesterday after my niece left, I was reading around a bit on MWO and I ran across a post from a fairly long timer who is on the meds threads. In summary, he wrote "I came, I saw, I conquered". He said he would be off now to live his life as a normal person. He's cured! Hello, LIFE! Hummm. I have never taken any of the meds, and believe it or not, I TRY NOT TO COMMENT on things on which I have no firsthand knowledge. I stay out of 'how to raise kids' conversations, I don't comment on sports stuff and I never took any meds to control Alcoholism. But I DO know Alcoholism very well. He and I grew up together. I have seen folks make this declaration time and time again. I could go over there and tell him what I've seen, but as we all know, when it comes to AL, all bets are off. People DO want to find their own way out, but if history is any indication, it takes ongoing support. We can wish and hope and BELIEVE we are normal people but we have a disease and that disease requires treatment....ALL WAYS. This is my belief, so I'm not trying to sell it to anyone, I am talking out loud here. If his 'problem' required the drastic measures of the high powered meds to get 'under control' then I have to wonder how long he will survive in nature with a culture that pushes it at every turn? This takes SUPPORT. Why? We are saying NO to a substance that MOST everyone else says YES to! Most people have the ability to quit when they choose....I do not. This happens on a daily, almost hourly basis in our society! Being bombarded with that many messages to go ahead and have a drink are bound to get thru IF WE DONT HAVE OUR ARMOR IN PLACE. Yes, going out and living life sounds wonderful. NOT coming to this site and talking about AL all the time would free up some time to maybe sit and watch tv another 30 minutes. While I'm dreaming the impossible dream, I mays well throw in wishing to be rich and thin, too! My life is what it is....and I'm an alcoholic and I need support. I am LUCKY that mine in online, for me to use when and how I want to! Nobody dictates it to me and I never have to leave the house. In my book, I'm pretty lucky to have this free and powerful resource. I wish that guy a lot of luck. He will need it.

Wishing everyone a peaceful day!!! Byrdie

[Starfish1]

Wow, gang. These experiences and posts are so powerful, again, I am almost speechless.

First of all, Okoren, I am SO glad you came back so quickly. You will not regret that decision. Please stick close to the nest. Any time I have relapsed and chosen NOT to use MWO to get myself back in order, it has been a huge mistake. I have failed every time. Like Ava says, it is MY AA. And Byrdie just pointed out some of the great flexibility we have using the site. We are here for one another any time of the day or night and with all our accumulated experience someone usually has some insight or recommendation for any situation.

Guys, I am about to close in on 30 days AGAIN (hip hip hooray). I have been fighting this battle HARD for the last 10 years. I have relapsed at any milestone you can imagine. I have relapses after 1 day (a bajillion times), after 3 days, after 3 weeks, after 3 months, after 3 years...it's all the same. One drink and you're a goner.

After reading posts here for the past 28 days, there is one thing I am happy to see- I am not alone in this kind of struggle. I was once like Pav and thought, if you have made it a certain length of time, you are safe. We are never safe, as Byrdie said.

I am much more vigilant (and more experienced) now than I have ever been, because I know what can happen. I am finding it very useful, this time, to use the peanut allergy analogy. If I were allergic to peanuts, I would never consider eating them. I consider myself allergic to alcohol and stay away from it. Why would I want to make myself sick and potentially kill myself ingesting something that is so bad for me? I don't. I also compare it to a diabetic eating sugar. If I were diabetic and went to a wedding, I wouldn't eat a big ole piece of wedding cake, just because it was a celebration and I "deserved" to join in the festivities. Would I? No sir! I gotta take care of ME!!!

My signature line used to be "I am only one drink away from never being sober again." I have seen that phrase repeated here on MWO several times over the past several weeks. I think I will adopt that as my line again. It is so true.

So glad to see such great nesters here, young and old alike. I think this is a great group. Thanks for all!

[KENSHO]

The chemical reaction/pathways with booze and our mind/body has been reawakened. Along with the depressant effect of the chemical reaction (booze with our brain chemistry), often comes the psychological effect of shame and lowered self worth, maybe throw in some guilt and regret.

Boy can I vouch for this GMAN. I had very little alcohol at first when I relapsed after 60 days AF, and the pathway reawakened with a vengeance. The trap seems to be that after some AF time, we are used to no alcohol, and it doesn't seem to taste good, and having only one seemed possible to me. I was lured into believing that this meant I could moderate. But unfortunately, the pathway became a raging interstate, and my cravings during this last week have been enough to show me that those first seemingly innocent "don't even want 'em" drinks are very, very dangerous. I'm paying for that now.

Of course, had I not believed I was "different" than, oh.. most everyone here, I would have read the relapse thread and various other cautionary tales and understood that it really DOES only take one drink - one SIP! - to get us back on the highway to hell.

It's NOT WORTH THAT FIRST DRINK! I finally understand that if you made it to this site, you have the type of problem that will likely not just poof and disappear with a few days AF. Good God, I only had 60 days AF - and I thought I was cured. I am NOT cured - I will NEVER be cured, I will ALWAYS go back to destructive drinking. And I'm not just repeating common phrases, I believe these words because I tried to be "different" and moderate - and I failed. My time is much better spent figuring out how to integrate NO alcohol into my life, than trying to fight it.

I really, really appreciate the honesty and patience of those here. Thank you so much for the support.

[LavenderBlue]

Good morning Nest! I worked through the holiday weekend, so this is my day off to relax with my coffee!

Some very powerful stuff going on over here, I love reading everyone's thoughts.

Okoren, I remember you and am so glad you came back. It's tough when what you shouldn't have is so easy to get - I STILL sometimes want to grab a pack of smokes at the gas station, and that's not "supposed" to be a lifelong thing like alcohol addiction! That said, it can be done and we're all here to support you, and help you plan to succeed.

Pav & Bydie, you must be rubbing off on me, because I also had those same thoughts while reading. One of the reasons we're so happy to see Okoren is that so many people don't come back after they've slipped, sometimes not for years and sometimes never. And I don't just mean come back to this site, the harsh reality is many people start up again and never even try to quit again.

My thinking is that it's important to keep both things in mind. If you have slipped, and are now back, then use that to plan your success this time and be proud of yourself for coming back. Like G is saying, beating up on yourself is a lot more harmful than taking a deep breathe and committing yourself to not making the same mistakes again. And one slip doesn't even mean you have to give up on finding a sober and happy life. BUT if you're on here and haven't, this is the time to remember how serious it can be and that it's something that really can happen to anyone.

I guess for me, the "it'll be ok if I slip" thoughts aren't helpful for me right now, it makes me feel like in the back of my head I'm still planning to drink someday, you know? It's not about making anyone feel bad about slipping, but it's also not about anyone feeling like that's an ok option in the future. Something like that, anyway!

Congrats on all the milestones going on, it's so awesome to see people succeeding! Every day sober is its own miracle, and all of us only build those up one at a time. I remember my dad (a recovered alcoholic, AA worked for him) used to tell me he tries to just do "the next right thing." It's a powerful thought when you really look at it - if you're worried or unsure or overwhelmed, just focus on the next right thing. Then the next one after that.

[okoren1]

Boy, it was frightening.

By the time I got around to having that 4th or 5th beer over a couple of weeks, I could see the old pattern already starting to commence… thinking about the next time I might have another. Amazing how fast things could start to unwind.

Most of the days on the trip, after a hard ride I would have a Coke or maybe an Orangina. They did the trick- quenched my thirst and helped boost much needed blood sugar. But the beer was different. I didn’t think or plan for my next Coke or Orangina, but I started to for a beer. Just amazing. This echo’s what Kensho recently posted.

On the positive side, I am anticipating this time (in starting this new quit) will be different vs. when I quit in August, 2014.

First, I don’t have any real urges or cravings for AL. On this cycling trip, there was PLENTY of wine drinking going on during dinner amongst the other riders, and fortunately I wasn’t even mildly tempted (even though I may have had a beer in the afternoon) so, the strong urge for AL wasn’t there.

Second, since I hadn’t previously been drinking, there was no “fog of AL” to work through. AL use is now, not part of my day to day life pattern- not something I think about.

Third, I now know I can successfully not drink for an extended period of time. The phrase used here is: building strong AF muscles, which progressively occurs after a long duration of not drinking.

Therefore, I am suspecting that this relapse had more to do with mental and/or spiritual matters. More to unpack.

[LavenderBlue]

Boy can I vouch for this GMAN. I had very little alcohol at first when I relapsed after 60 days AF, and the pathway reawakened with a vengeance. The trap seems to be that after some AF time, we are used to no alcohol, and it doesn't seem to taste good, and having only one seemed possible to me. I was lured into believing that this meant I could moderate. But unfortunately, the pathway became a raging interstate, and my cravings during this last week have been enough to show me that those first seemingly innocent "don't even want 'em" drinks are very, very dangerous. I'm paying for that now.

I totally get those thoughts, "I've been sober this long, I'm sure I can handle it!" Other than the great reminders from everyone that this is a disease, and addiction, pick your words but it's not something that just goes away...I also focused on something else. If I REALLY didn't have a problem with AL, I should be fine not having any, right? Anyone I know without a problem, stopping entirely would not rock their world. So the very fact that I even want to try again, despite the very good chance it won't work, tells me that yep indeed that problem still exists for me and I'm better off not having any!

Only two cents, I'm really not trying to make you feel bad, just sharing what helped me with the group, so to speak.