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**Guest** · June 24, 2007, 11:47 PM

How to effectively moderate????

Hi 4everakid,
I don`t think there is such a thing as "a trick" to moderation. I think we`ve all just got to find the strategy that will work for us as individuals.

Personally, I think I could probably have managed to struggle to notch up the initial recommended 30 days of ABS,(albeit with a few tantrums along the way!!!!), but would have been literally desperate for a drink, and therefore likely to overdo it on Day 31.

I decided to start to moderate without doing the 30 day ABS, and have had 2 successful wks., save for 1 slip. I am quite hopeful that I will manage to maintain my goal, but am very aware that it is early days for me.

Just thought I`d tell you how I`ve approached moderation.

Best wishes,

Starlight Impress

**rachel28** · June 25, 2007, 01:15 AM

How to effectively moderate????

story sounds familiar, only well done 4 21 days , i havent been 1 day in last 2 yrs YET! have u found over the years there is no real point between tipsy and drunk to black out, with me i never seeem to be drunk just when i wake up in morning i know when i hit bein drunk as i cant remember a bloody detail, i would love to b able to get tipsy, have fun an stop, and enjoy the feeling of being tipsy and giggly, not raging drunk with no memory of what kind a night i had, theres years of my life that r complete blanks, those memories will never come back, like u its scary, maybe its a good job i cant remember, if u find a way to turn the ber valve off let me know ey !!!! i hardly ever go out cos of this problem, im safer locked in doors !!

**beatle** · June 25, 2007, 04:27 AM

How to effectively moderate????

I know how it is. Everytime I try mods, it works for a few days (with constant vigilance) and then one day, when my guard is a little down, I mess it all up. It's like that rational part of the brain goes on vacation and my only thought is how to get more alcohol into me. That's why I think I have to be AF-- or at least accept that if I drink I'm going to lose control and hate myself for it later.

On the other hand, since I have proven I CAN moderate for a few days, I hold out hope that someday I will be able to do it as part of my life-- just not right now.

4ever-- have you tried the meds? I haven't got Topamax yet (don't know if it's available in my country-- will ask doctor next week) and not sure about using it due to side effects but am thinking I should give it a try since it helps so many people. I'm also waiting to get the kudzu and L-glutamin. Do you use them?

In the MWO book, Roberta says it became easy for her to moderate after only a few days of the program. She still drank but had no compulsion to drink more than a couple glasses of wine. She felt truly liberated and continues to drink moderately with ease. I wonder if we can achieve that if we implement the full program. I, for example, am doing well with the supps (mostly vitamins and minerals-- many of the others are not available where I live) but have not done the hypnotherapy CDs yet and don't exercise either, not to mention not taking any medication at all. My goal is to get it all together and implement the whole program. Then maybe it will be easier, more natural, to be moderate (even though I really want to be AF for a while-- partly to give my body a good rest, partly to get used to functioning that way).

What do you think?

**chilli** · June 25, 2007, 05:05 AM

How to effectively moderate????

I too have trouble with moderation, keep trying but same as you dont seem to now when i am pissed and when to stop, them wake up asking my kids questions how bad was i? did i ring anyone? etc i dont go out so dont have to worry about getting home, i just worry about what iam doing to my kids. I like you hate the thought of for ever af but i guess thats were the one day at a time comes from. I have the starter kit have been taking the supps regular but having trouble doing the cds regularly, and i dont have the meds, a little scared to try top as need to be on the ball at work. I guess we just keep trying and hopefully it will sink in one day.
chill

**thought2much** · June 25, 2007, 06:10 AM

How to effectively moderate????

I can relate to your situation. I have had some absolute shockers.

One monring I woke up in this apartment. There were a few other guys and girls asleep on the floor as well. I didnt know anyone in the room. I didnt know where I was either so I woke up someone and asked for the address. I then rang my friend and asked him to come and pick me up.

I had to ask him to bring some clothes as my clothes were all torn up. I was basically standing in my underwear and a torn shirt.... Cant remember how that happened.... but I think I must have been wrestling someone.

My friend came and when we went out the front of the apartment my car was parked out front. I then had a vague recollection of driving from the party I was at to the apartment with about 10 drunk people crammed in my car. I remembered that I was slugging a bottle of bourbon while driving and I was driving insanely fast.

It is the countless nights like these that I will now use to shame myself into not drinking. I have story upon story. I used to think they were funny, now I think they are depressing. 20 years of embarrassing myself.

I cant moderate..... well I can sometimes.... but other times I cant. I cant control when I can and when I cant so I have decided AF is the goal for me.

I will drink a social drink occassionally in the future, but only in situations where I know I wont over drink. Maybe a romantic dinner with my wife where we share a bottle of wine.... I dont know.... I will wait and see when I am ready.

**Cinders** · June 25, 2007, 09:14 PM

How to effectively moderate????

Nope

4Ever,

If we had any tricks, we wouldn't be here.

You, me, my daugher, all the people on this website have all be very lucky NOT to have been killed, raped, robbed, or worse, been responsible for killing or hurting someone else because of our drunkeness.

I, too, can relate to the, once I start wanting to "drink, drink, drink" like mad. I think we call it ALCOHOLISM.

Not making a joke. It is a tough disease.

I am SOOOOO proud of you for how far you have come and how much effort you have put into making your life better. ESPECIALLY considering that you are alone in a different country with no family and only a few friend around.

You are doing great but never take your eyes off the real issue. WE CAN'T EVER LOSE CONTROL. It is dangerous. We could end up hurt, or worse, hurting someone else.

There are others who can moderate, but this girl here can't, that is for darn sure. If I can figure out how, I will be the first to let you know!!!

Cindi

**4everakid** · June 26, 2007, 10:24 AM

How to effectively moderate????

Hi everyone, thanks for the replies

I am a little afraid now, it seems like with the inability to control the inner urges, it seems like I am left with AF. Okay, thats great, but my greatest fear is labelling myself an alcoholic. I come from an alcohol family, and it is funny, because as mentioned in so many other posts, they are the ones to point fingers. Once labelled, it is like the scarlet letter (was that the movie???). In any case, I have done a lot of work here, but in terms of back home, I think that is my greatest fear and I really want to get a handle on it before I return. Db, your post was great. As I have not only had a thing with alcohol, but in the past with drugs (u name it), I am forever thinking about how nothing (thank God) has ever happened. But luck always runs out. Thought2much your story is unbeleivable, I am only glad that you made your way back home safe and sound. Starlight, keep up the good work, everyday is another day, and it sounds like you are doing fantastically

Rachel sounds like we're in the same boat, and beleive me, if I find the answer I will definately let you know. Chilli, I too am only using supps and the cds, hope they are working for you, as for me, if I lague I want to drink. So I guess it will be mroe a testiment of will. Beatle, I am on everything (supps) but topo. As you already know I am on Ativan, don't really know if I should be drinking on this, last week I had serious cravings for sugar and caffeine, this week back to beer. I am having beer again tonight, not doing so well with moderating, but back to AF tomorrow, its like Sat. just threw me off course completely!!!! In any case, thanks for your words.
I hope to write again very soon completely AF....soooo on goes the journey!! Good luck to all!!!
4ever

**beatle** · June 26, 2007, 12:23 PM

How to effectively moderate????

Wait! Are you on ativan AND drinking? If so, how much?

**4everakid** · June 27, 2007, 07:39 PM

How to effectively moderate????

hey Beatle, yes, Sat? couldn't tell you how much... a lot. Mond. 3 beers, Tues, 3beers...yesterday back to AF...now you scare me?? I checked it out on the net and it said Ativan only increases the effects of alcohol. Should I be worried about something else? I am on a total of 2mg/day. The days that I drank, I only took .5mg, knowing that I did not want to mix the two together. So I guess my drinking was a very conscious decision. If you have any info. would love to hear it....you are way better than I when it comes to these drug interactions. Thanks Beatle

4ever

**beatle** · June 28, 2007, 03:36 AM

How to effectively moderate????

well, I am only good at these drug interactions from experience. I have a personality flaw/trait that makes me question and challenge everything I am told, including, or especially, warnings. I have successfully mixed drugs that shouldn't be mixed, and mixed drugs and alcohol when they shouldn't be mixed, which makes me even more cocky about disregarding warnings. But I did have a couple bad experiences, one not so long ago with ativan and alcohol. I took a total of 2 mg ativan over a few hours (I was set to hold an important presentation at work and didn't want to drink to calm my nerves, as I usually have done in the past). Anyway, the presentation went fine, and then to celebrate, I went out and had a drink. A very small one, I should add. I managed somehow to get home (though I can hardly remember how) and passed out for a few hours. I was fine after I woke up, but pretty scared about the lost hours and being a failure regarding my AF goal. So, that said, I will be very careful in future about mixing the two.

Another thing about ativan: it is a benzo and very addictive. It is supposedly harder to get off benzos than alcohol or pretty much anything. I am careful not to take it too often, so as not to get addicted (yeh, go figure). If you have been taking it everyday for more than a couple weeks, you should probably cut back slowly. There is a lot about this on the internet. However, I think ativan can be a good drug for people with alcohol problems if they take it instead of drinking to combat anxiety. Just try not to take it every day. I try to keep it down to a couple times a week at most-- only when I really really feel I need it.

**out** · June 28, 2007, 09:22 AM

How to effectively moderate????

moderation is what you define it to be...

In my opinion, that is. If you read what seems to be the standard defined by moderation management and other sources is for womem no more than 9 drinks per week and no more than 3 drinks in a sitting. Binge drinking I have often seen defined as any more than 3 drinks in one sitting, which I think makes 70% of my entire city binge drinkers on a Friday. Responsible drinking is defined as no more than 1 drink per hour. So my question is then...if you have 4 drinks in 4 hours are you being a responsible drinker or a binger!

Anyway my point with all this is that most defintions while founded on some good ideas and research are all somewhat arbitrary and you have to not fall into the trap of believing you are a loser because you don't match some of these ideals. I am primarily a binger, so moderation for me might be that I binge 1 or 2 times per month rather than 4 or 5. No, I don't really consider that moderation, I'm just making a point that any positive change is what to focus on. You went 21 days before having a blowout...how long would you usually go? Sounds like you that in and of itself is quite an acomplishment. If I went 21 days without chocolate I would probably eat the whole box too! We'll all figure this out, I'm sure. Take care.

**4everakid** · June 28, 2007, 09:43 AM

How to effectively moderate????

Why is it I always seem to get WAY more honest opinions here than from the doc!!! hahaha, thanks guys for the info. Wow, Beatle, now I'm really glad I didn't pop my other pill before going out on Sat. night....eeeh!! Glad you made it through alright

I am going to do some looking into re. the addictiveness of it......crazy thing though! Today I went to my doc to begin to get weaned off, his recommendation was antipressants??? I told him I did not want to be on any drugs, and then he got quite insulted

Why is it that they always try to force them down you!!! I did not know this was such an addicitive drug, time to self monitor again....I think this is the first time in a long time I've actually monitored myself so much

Out, your analogy was great, thanks for the perspective

thanks again guys!!!

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