Antabuse Thread

[Unwasted]

Antabuse Thread

Kirkland, I'm responding to your thread so it will move up and someone will see it. I don't know enough to answer your question, but there are quite a few people taking Antabuse here. Not sure why it's taking so long for you to get an answer. You can also post on the general thread. K9 has taken it for a while, and so has Nora. They would more likely see this question if you posted under General. I think 48 hours since the last drink is long enough, but I'm hesitant to say unequivocally because it can really make your friend very ill if that's not long enough.

Best of luck.

[Kirkland21]

Antabuse Thread

Unwasted;1261807 wrote: Kirkland, I'm responding to your thread so it will move up and someone will see it. I don't know enough to answer your question, but there are quite a few people taking Antabuse here. Not sure why it's taking so long for you to get an answer. You can also post on the general thread. K9 has taken it for a while, and so has Nora. They would more likely see this question if you posted under General. I think 48 hours since the last drink is long enough, but I'm hesitant to say unequivocally because it can really make your friend very ill if that's not long enough.

Best of luck.

Very much appreciate the bump.

Yeah drove my friend home after posting that and pressed him not drink on the ride and to especially hold on even more till we can get his place to go straightened out and got all kinds of "I won't I won't". But then pressed him too that since that is the case then there should be no problem taking the Antabuse and got all kinda of reasons he wanted to wait.

Btw I very much don't know if I am speaking in the right ways here, don't know if my position as a person who is helping is wrong to post here so if it is not appropriate please let me know.

Also btw told him I found and read many of the stories on this thread in sort of a you can't BS as well now thing.

About the best I got out of him was that he was going to talk to his Psychologist in the next two days (who he just started seeing but only twice so far as on his second visit the guy called the cops on him as he showed up drunk then drove off when the Dr got mad at him for it) and would ask him (the Psychologist) if it was OK to start now.

Also talked to his dad in front of him when I brought him home to that there was that deal before he went to the hospital that when he came back he will take it in front of his dad every day to be sure he is talking it and said how he told me in the car that he said he would.

One other thing I should mention though is I actually got the bottle when I brought him home and found out its actually from October of 2010....so its not just a few months old as he told me so I don't even know if the product is still good.

Well appreciate any and all help

Thank you.

[Ne/Neva Eva]

Antabuse Thread

Hey, Kirk.
I didn't respond because generally it's not such a good idea to give advice to friends...You know? He can take the antabuse.
Seems to me that there are a couple of other real issues. The first is that he doesn't want to take the antabuse, despite being hospitalized. I can assure you that experience sucked. He's got to have reasons for not wanting to take the antabuse, and they're likely unrelated to the safety of it. (I mean the safety of drinking is no longer a question, is it? He knows where that takes him.)
I know that when I was in a corner, with no way out, and no support, that the only thing I could think to do in order to cope was to drink. That was really awful. Doesn't sound like your friend has many productive options. But one thing is for sure, that drinking is not an option. I applaud your willingness to help. He's got a good friend in you, even if he can't see it at the moment. When I was in that position, and knew that I was going to end up where it sounds like your friend was, I begged/cajoled and lied my way into a 30 day treatment program, courtesy of a city. Perhaps this is an option? It didn't keep me sober for long, nothing did until baclofen, but it gave me a new lease on life. If you want to post where you are in the world, we may be able to help you find help. (maybe. ) Or you can send me a private message and I'll see what I can do.

Oh. And one last thing. Fire that psychologist. Don't wait. Fire that knucklehead. He has NO idea what he's doing if he sees calling the police as a productive option. I would fill this with swear words that would make my husband blush, but we don't know each other, so I'll refrain. But once your friend gets a good doctor, and some sobriety, I hope he walks back in that office and tells him to eff off. From me. There are plenty of good ones out there.

(oh. I should add that I'm a year sober. Because of baclofen. And I don't have anger management issues. :H It just makes me really, really, really angry when someone is treated poorly by someone in a position to help. Stupid creep. And I have a wonderful therapist who tolerates my occasional rants about the knuckleheads in her profession. )
Hang in there. And take good care.

[Ne/Neva Eva]

Antabuse Thread

And the antabuse is very likely still good. It should have an expiration date on the bottle.

[Greg]

Antabuse Thread

Hi Kirkland, it sounds like your friend is terrified of letting go of alcohol, due to an enormous psychological dependence on it. This dependence usually remains intact even after a person is physically detoxed from alcohol. I used to make all sorts of promises to other people, and even myself, about quitting, but I always had some sort of delaying tactic up my sleeve at the same time. I could not imagine my life without alcohol, and the very idea frightened the living daylights out of me. This sort of thing went on for many years.

To answer your question directly, there is no reason I am aware of that would make it dangerous for a person to start Antabuse once all the alcohol is out of their system. Antabuse only works by preventing the proper metabolism of alcohol, which in turn makes a person ill, so this should not happen if there is no alcohol in their system. That would never take a week to come about. I have started taking the drug the day after drinking, although with extreme care...I have always breathalyzed myself at the local club to make sure I had a zero alcohol reading, and even then I would only take 1/4 of a tablet (50 mg) that first day to be safe. The following day, I would then take a whole tablet. I have not had any bad reaction from doing this. 48 hours should be more than enough time away from alcohol to allow Antabuse to be taken safely.

I hope you are able to help your friend remain abstinent, but the harsh truth is that a person cannot be made to stay sober if they don't truly want to be. Many alcoholics are not ready for abstinence even when alcohol is harming them. The best bet could be to get this person into a program, so at least they are away from alcohol, if he can't/won't commit to taking the Antabuse under supervision, as he said he would.

Another option is to see if he will try a medication to reduce his cravings for alcohol, so that he may start to feel more at ease with not drinking. I'm not the best person on this forum to give advice about that, but plenty of others here are taking baclofen as an anti-craving medication. It usually has to be taken in high doses (much higher than the usually recommended maximum daily dose) and unfortunately not many doctors will prescribe that (many won't prescribe the drug at all for alcoholism). I had to resort to using cannabis as an alcohol substitute along with taking Antabuse at one stage (which I don't recommend), so that gives you an idea of how difficult it has been for me to deal with this addiction.

Just one more thing...keep in mind that drinking after taking Antabuse, up to a week or more afterwards in fact, is likely to cause a very unpleasant reaction that can be a medical emergency. People have died due to this, although that may be unusual. Giving Antabuse to someone who is just not able to stop themselves from drinking afterwards can be a disaster, and this risk must always be kept in mind.

I'm sorry I have not given a more positive uplifting reply, but I thought you should know the harsh realities involved here. Many people do recover from even the most severe alcohol dependence, but it can take time and various failed attempts for some of them. I hope your friend gets better soon, so he does not remain stuck with alcohol dependence.

(P.S. I cross-posted with Neva Eva, and agree with what she says. She is one of those here who has a lot of experience with baclofen, and who has found solid sobriety. There are quite a few others here in that same situation. They are the best ones here to give you further advice I'd say...I wish you and your friend all the very best with this).

[NoraC]

Antabuse Thread

Hi Kirkland - just saw your post. Thanks UW for bumping it.

I do take Antabuse. But, the truth is that you can't force your friend. Like Greg said, it can be so very dangerous if he would drink on it. It could kill him. And, until he is ready to make that commitment, there is just nothing that you can do or say to make him swallow that pill. (I know this from personal experience) He has to be ready to abstain. Once you swallow the pill, you can not drink for about 10 days after the last pill.

I wish that I had better information for you.

Good luck. You are a great friend.

[Kirkland21]

Antabuse Thread

First thank you all for your advice and I know very much that a proper physician should be making this call, its just when he tells me things like one Dr. told him to wait a week I don't have much to argue him on it as who am I to question it.

Also Neva, I did understand how you handled this and got as to the why too just to let you know and I thank you very much.

Basically for all that are talking about his make up,...I could put it in so many examples but in the best way I could put it is that his personality wasn't all that much different then a alcoholics personality long before he was one.

I have known him for close to thirty years now and even back when we were in our 20's he was already a person who limited "himself" in his options to very few things and would only do what he wanted to do and that was within his very limited terms and listed to only the people he thought were cool and such.

For one example his older brother who he admires greatly still to this day only thinks that only old an antiquey things are cool and anything new or technology wise is stupid so still to this day my friend refuses to learn how to use a computer even though he is plenty smart enough to do so and even though he lost a unbelievable opportunity for $100,000.000 a year job he fell into about 5 years ago because he wouldn't.

And even for now he will only go to a rehab place that is in the country, and has as he put it on the ride home, a place he can smoke, exercise and is Co-Ed, (which isn't because of why you might think as he really is nuts desperate to find a girlfriend). So my response to that was, I talked about this only gotta be my way thing and asked him why on that list wasn't that it be a place that would help him for his physical addiction to alcohol and having good psychiatry care.

Anyway again, I could go on for tons of examples but the point is this was always his way long before he was physically addicted to alcohol so sadly he is like this perfect storm for it now and has many skills to stay this way from long before, so that is in part why we are kind of pushing like we are as we know if we don't he never will do it himself and just will be dead.

Also just to mention it for the knowledge of it, he has been to about four 30 day programs over the past three years and countless AA meetings too and about the only reason we convinced him to do a 90 day is because its the one thing he hasn't tried yet (although we personally know of the other and actually reasons it might help).

At any rate, we are all doing the most we can but we know we are not professionals and know he needs those and are just hoping and doing what we can for him not drink again until he can get things arranged with his job and all the other things he needs to do before a 90 day leave from life. So I still don't know if he will get himself on the Antabuse but I thank every one for their support and kind words.

Thank you all and best of luck to all of you.

[Ne/Neva Eva]

Antabuse Thread

Please, please get and read Dr. Olivier Ameisen's book, Heal Thyself. The first edition was called The End of my Addiction.
And give one to your friend, too! If I had a friend in that situation, I'd read it to him just to make sure that he reads it!

And at the risk of sounding like I'm pushing a choice on you, or your friend, please look into a medication called baclofen. I suggest this based a lot on your description of the things he feels like he needs in order to be okay. (A place to smoke and exercise and find true love! :H I'm not laughing at him. I'm laughing with him...And yet, he IS missing the point, isn't he? Which does not bode well for the antabuse... just sayin')

Hang in there. And keep in touch if you have the time. I'll be curious to know what the next step is, and excited to hear that he is getting better.

Thanks, and thanks too for being such a good friend.
Ne

[Kirkland21]

Antabuse Thread

Thanks Neva, I'll try to see if I can get him a copy before (or if) he goes away. Sounds like it might be a good thing for him to read on his down time if he is going to be away for 90 days.

Also if there is time, I will see if I can talk to someone about baclofen.

And I will chime in on any positive progress.

Again, thanks to everyone.

[Kirkland21]

Antabuse Thread

Hello all

Bit of a little update question on my friend.

We all have been keeping up the talk on him getting on the Antabuse and his last thing was he was going to talk to his psychologists about taking it which he saw last night but called me this morning and said he that since he wasn't a medical doctor he changed his mind on that but would call his doctor today about it which was kinda hard for me to argue as it kinda made sense.

But also he keeps talking about as he was given a prescription for Ativan from his hospital release and had been talking that but stopped yesterday, that he thinks he needs to wait maybe from a day or two to four days after stopping for that to get out of his system before he can take the Antabuse or there would be a problem.

As I have established, I know and am not at all thinking that any reply here is a replacement for a doctors involvement, but am just wondering if anyone thinks this is true or not to help with direction.

Thanks for any help.

[Ne/Neva Eva]

Antabuse Thread

I would disagree with some of what is written on the following websites, but it will give you the basic info. Sounds to me as though he just doesn't want to take it. just sayin' (sorry.)

Disulfiram - PubMed Health

Antabuse-Disulfiram Facts for Alcoholism and Addiction

[LadyLush]

Antabuse Thread

Kirkland,

I am kind of late in the race here and will respond deeper when I have time. I take Antabuse and Lorazepam (generic Ativan) with no contraindication whatsoever.

Antabuse is the ultimate game stopper and many of us don't think we are through playing the game...
But we really are or it would not be a choice.

If that makes sense..

Good luck,

LL:l

[Kirkland21]

Antabuse Thread

Hello all

First thank you for the replies, it always good to be more informed on things.

Also sorry that this is a little off point for a little bit but to give an update, my friend is heading up a rehab place today.

Out of respect of his privacy I won't say where but it is someplace that had been recommended to me by a professional and looks to be of the proper type of place he should be going although I don't know much more of it then that.

But at least it is not a place he has been before so it's not like he knows all in's & outs to get around doing what he should be doing. But that's not to say he can't learn all that pretty quick too as he highly specializes in that. One thing is though I do know is that the place is mostly geared towards military personal and near a military base and is in a military town environment which is a thing in general we both admire and respect so I am hoping that environment will also be a plus.

Also another good thing is that it is a place that takes his jobs insurance so at least he won't be on the freak for how much it is costing him.

A few things I'm not to happy about though is that the program or at least what they are talking about for now and what his insurance will cover is only for 5 weeks. Although there maybe options for more if the place say's he needs it.

Like I said, he has been through these 4 week trips before and they haven't worked although by that I mean that a good part of that is because he hasn't done his part and just treated it like a month long vacation.

But all in all we have been really getting on him that he really needs to step up to the plate with this one this time like its his last chance and also that he needs to focus on not just the physical addiction to alcohol part, but all the mental issues he has that really are a big part of his relapses.

So he seems to be on board with the concept but in getting back to the point of this thread, as of last night when I only got a chance to speak to him briefly, he still hasn't gone on the Antabuse and still hasn't even called his Dr to ask about the mix with Ativan.

Basically the main excuse for this is that he has been so busy planning to get up to this place and it has been a quick direction change for him he as once he found it, he wanted to get there fast which is good although I think has a lot to do with that meaning he gets away from his parent. But to get to his excuse, he said that with all he had to do he hasn't had time.

But he is telling me that he is bringing the bottle up there and is planning to ask the doctors once he gets there if he can take it and if they say OK, he will.

So basically he has gotten some phone calling cards and told me he is going to be keeping in touch and so as far as that Antabuse, if he calls me, I will just keep on him about it. And if I have to eventually call his counselors or doctors up there about it, I will.

Again I greatly thank all the responders to my questions for all their help and I very much wish you all the best of luck.

Thanks again.

[Overit44]

Antabuse Thread

Just started Antabuse

I'm really afraid of the food interactions. I really don't want to get sick. How would I have known that vanilla contains alcohol, really? How do you learn what you can eat and not. I love salads but what dressings don't contain alcohol? Now I'm doubting having started this medication.

[Overit44]

Antabuse Thread

I dont' know if anyone is still around on this board. I sure would appreciate having someone to share with. I did start my AB yesterday afternoon with 1/2 250mg pill. So far nothing other than a mild headache, maybe, could be sinus. Anyway, feeling VERY empowered today. My addiction is more mental/emotional than it is physical. I'm very nervouse about food interactions though and cleaning products. My side job is to clean homes. Almost all chemicals have alcohol. We'll see. Anyone out there?