Experience with Naltrexone

[bloggy]

Experience with Naltrexone

DrHyde;450776 wrote: This is my first post on here. Hello everyone. I just got the Dr. Eskapa book The Cure For Alcoholism, and I received the naltrexone from River Pharmacy today as well. One thing i'd like to point out is that Dr.Eskapa doesn't recommend taking the pill everyday. You should only take it before you're going to drink. One hour before. Otherwise it would take the pleasure out of doing positve things that are beneficial for you. Also says you need to do this for 3 to 4 months to be comepletely "cured." And that the 1st time or two , the drug wouldn't really make much difference. As I said, I just got the stuff and haven't tried it yet, so we'll have to wait and see. And as far as liver problems go, he said you would have to be taking 300mg doses for anything like that to happen. Overall, it sounds great to me. I hope it works. Thanks.

So Sorry, DrH, I have just read your post again, and I think I misunderstood the first time round. You are referring to Dr Eskapa's advice, whereas I was referring to Dr. Sinclair's recommendations.

When I looked for the Dr Eskapa book on Amazon.co.uk (takes too long from the US) it was not available- I am going to go back to look for it now- that might be a new possibility for me.

[bloggy]

Experience with Naltrexone

I just realised something today that might be of interest for those thinking of trying naltrexone.

I was kind of addicted to these soya veggie burgers I have recently discovered over here (there is not a large variety of ready made veggie stuff here) and have been a lifelong fan of any sort of salad with dressing, not the healthy raw salads but the more unhealthy coleslaw and potato salad type.

When I took my first dose of Naltrexone i was naturally monitoring my every feeling as I hadn't had any tests done and am very sensitive to medication. I didn't feel anything untoward and although I didn't remember having much of an appetite I made a meal of my veggie burgers and potato salad.

I couldn't finish it, halfway through I felt a bit sick, and since that day the thought of both the veggie burgers and potato salad makes me feel ill. I did not really think much of it until today when my BF bought me some of the burgers not knowing I had gone right of them. I reluctantly tried one but it made me want to gag.

I was just wondering if I had had some alcohol an hour after it would have had the same effect- has anyone else had a similar experience? My meal list is quite limited because I am veggie, but these were two of my favourite foods!

I don't care as I doubt the nutritional value was very high, but I wondered if anyone else had experienced anyting similar- I am thinking of taking a Naltrexone again and drinking a beer an hour after.

It might just work that way when we are not used to the Naltrexone being in the system and hit us harder- because anything else I ate for the rest of the time on the naltrexone was OK- just that first meal.

(Or is it wishful thinking)

[DrHyde]

Experience with Naltrexone

No to sinclair method

After I posting my first message, I intentionally drank a lot of beer after took the naltrexone. I felt extremely weird. Very bad actually. I would not reccommend it to anyone. This is definitely not for me. I am going to use the naltrexone as it is normally prescribed, as an inhibitor, and go with abstinence. I just want to quit. I went out and bought all the supplements, except for the kudzu and the all one, which i ordered online. I am going to follow thw MWO sugesstions and hope it works. That is not to say that I will never drink again. I just want to get on the right track. The sinclair method MAY work, but I don't want to have to go through that kind of weirdness. If I'm going to drink, I'd rather just drink and enjoy it, without the mental staightjacket. That's just my opinion. Still struggling. DrH.

[bloggy]

Experience with Naltrexone

DrH

I am sorry it didn't work for you, but at least we keep trying- that is the main thing.

By finding what doesn't work I guess eventually we will find what does.

[Amethyst26]

Experience with Naltrexone

New to Naltrexone

Well, I guess I am jumping the gun here...I will be new to Naltrexone as soon as I get my order from River Pharmacy. I have tried Campral and although I really had no problems with is per say...I drank right along with it. I beleive that my alcohol problem has alot to do with my anxiety and depression as well as hormonal issues. I recently managed to abstain for 2 days for the first time in months,. But am worried as to how long this will power will last. I am just afraid of the side effects of Naltrxone. My main prob has always been night time wine binge drinking which does not allow me to function properly the next day and interferes with my antidepressant causing more depression...etc. A vicious cycle. I am a nurse and actually put myself on the antibiotic Flagyl for a week in order to abstain because it is cheaper than antibuse and basically makes u sick if u drink hence my abstinance for now. So any advice on naltrexone will be appreciated. I will be off the flagyl by the time i receive this med and want to take it along with campral but only on days i think i will be tempted to drink,...as it is so expensive.

What should i expect?

A

[bloggy]

Experience with Naltrexone

Hi Amethyst-

It seems everyone is different as to the effects- it seems to work brilliantly for some and not so well for others. It was working for me- I just did not feel like drinking as before, but I panicked when I noticed my eyes looking yellow.

Because I was doing it alone, I thought it better to stop.

If you go back to the beginning of this thread I describe in quite some detail how I felt on it each day I was taking it.

Wishing you the best of luck- please let us know how you get on.

[Amethyst26]

Experience with Naltrexone

wow

Yellow? that is scary. I guess I will go read back to your posts. I am already putting enuf presure on my liver by takind Effexor and Birth Control Pills. [I] did read high quantities cause liver damage so i was only planning to take it when i was in high risk situations ...

[bloggy]

Experience with Naltrexone

I think that is the ideal way to go, Amethyst.

I took the route of taking it daily and I am super sensitive to all medication, so I wouldn't class me as 'average'.

I was alo thinking about just taking it agin as you say- when the risk is high.

[Benedikt]

Experience with Naltrexone

More rich tasting booze please

Hey all, I'm having my second liver test, as per my doctor, in 4 days, then I'll start my Naltrexone+Drinking treatment. I'll let everyone know what kind of side effects I notice. A month ago I also started taking lots of Vit C, 6,000mg a day, Milk Thistle, 1,500mg a day, and Vit E, 400iu a day, to help my liver along. Most nutrition books or otherwise will recommend something like this for liver support.
I started keeping a Drinking Diary, I really scared myself when I started to add up how much I was drinking, alot more than I thought, you should try the same.
Upper limit for "moderate" drinking is 25 per week and I was way over:upset:
Will keep you all up to date.

I really hope I don't have any adverse reactions to naltrexone, it's my first real hope in years!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

As I sip my glass (bottle?) of Cabernet

[bloggy]

Experience with Naltrexone

Benedikt;457305 wrote: Hey all, I'm having my second liver test, as per my doctor, in 4 days, then I'll start my Naltrexone+Drinking treatment. I'll let everyone know what kind of side effects I notice. A month ago I also started taking lots of Vit C, 6,000mg a day, Milk Thistle, 6 pills a day, and Vit E, 400iu a day, to help my liver along. Most nutrition books or otherwise will recommend something like this for liver support.
I started keeping a Drinking Diary, I really scared myself when I started to add up how much I was drinking, alot more than I thought, you should try the same.
Upper limit for "moderate" drinking is 25 per week and I was way over:upset:
Will keep you all up to date.

I really hope I don't have any adverse reactions to naltrexone, it's my first real hope in years!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

As I sip my glass (bottle?) of Cabernet

I do hope it works for you Benedikt- please keep us posted!

[rv9]

Experience with Naltrexone

I'd like to chime in a bit on the Sinclair Method. I'm not on it yet, but I've spoken at length (a couple hours) with Dr. Eskapa, as well as exchanged e-mails with both him and Dr. Sinclair.

Here is the deal as I understand it. If I misuse any scientific terms, please accept my apologies and just roll with it. This is just a general description.

Alcohol, unlike other drugs like heroin or cocaine, is a 'dirty' drug in that it affects a number of systems in the brain. The opioid receptors are but one part of what alcohol affects. The opioid receptors are responsible for some of the good feeling that comes with drinking, but not with the sensation of being tipsy or drunk. If you drink on naltrexone, you can and will catch a buzz and/or get drunk, depending on how much you drink. In fact, your impairment could be greater due to inattention caused by naltrexone itself.

As you drink what's happening is you are 'taking care of' the systems other than the opioid receptors. Things like the GABA receptor complex and others. These are the systems that make you feel like crap when you withdraw. By continuing to drink, you keep the withdrawal from happening, BUT the endorphins are blocked. This happens at a very low level that you cannot feel.

The blocking of the endorphins does not cause withdrawal or craving. What it does do is start untraining the brain to associate alcohol with an endorphin rush, which is the root of the addiction. Over time (3-6 months), the addiction is broken and drinking automatically reduces, causing a prolonged, painless, safe withdrawal.

So to summarize:

1. Alcohol affects many systems in the brain.
2. One of those systems, endorphins, is responsible for addiction but not the unpleasant side effects of withdrawal.
3. Naltrexone affects only the endorphins by blocking opioid receptors. This causes deaddiction but not withdrawal symptoms.
4. The other systems are responsible for the unpleasant side effects of withdrawal but not the addiction.
5. Continued drinking keeps the other systems "happy" while the addiction is broken.
6. As the addiction is broken, drinking naturally decreases, weaning the "other systems" off of alcohol so slowly that no unpleasant withdrawal takes place.

On the issue of drinking without Naltrexone:

Dr. Eskapa said that before the addiction is broken, drinking without naltrexone could cause a spike on quantity drunk because of opioid receptor up-regulation. This could last through a few drinking sessions but consumption would return to 'normal' (which for most of us is too high) after that.

If you drink without naltrexone after the addiction is broken, it will be almost (but not quite) like you had never had a drinking problem. You could get addicted again and likely would, since your brain is clearly already susceptible to it. This process could take months, BUT each drink without naltrexone makes the next drink without it easier and more likely. That is why he advises that patients keep naltrexone with them always and never drink without it. It's just not worth the risk.

I hope this all makes some sense. I'm heading to a psychiatrist on Tuesday and hopefully he buys into helping me with this. As a backup, I placed an order with River a few days ago.

[rv9]

Experience with Naltrexone

DrHyde;453933 wrote: I am going to use the naltrexone as it is normally prescribed, as an inhibitor, and go with abstinence. I just want to quit.

DrHyde,

According to Sinclair, Eskapa and a bunch of studies, naltrexone doesn't reduce cravings (see my post above) and so is pretty useless with abstinence. In fact, the people who did best in studies that encouraged abstinence were the ones that fell off the wagon!

If Naltrexone doesn't work for you, you might consider aversion therapy at a place like Schick-Shadel. It is expensive but has very good success (80% or so). I have talked at length with a man who went there 20 years ago and hasn't had a drop since. He was so impressed that when the clinic almost closed its doors a few years ago, he gathered a handful of investors and bought the clinic in order to keep it open. He and I are going to go to lunch soon to discuss further. If cost is an object then it would almost be worth it to find out what insurance companies will cover it and take a job (temporarily) with a company that offers that insurance. Underhanded, but so are insurance companies ;-)

[bloggy]

Experience with Naltrexone

Thanks rv-

That is basically how I understood it, but what I wasn't prepared for was the kind of sick feeling and the yellowness around the eyes I experienced after about 5 days on it.

I did not have anybody who I could ask about it- do you know anything about that, or other side effects?

[rv9]

Experience with Naltrexone

marbella;458979 wrote: That is basically how I understood it, but what I wasn't prepared for was the kind of sick feeling and the yellowness around the eyes I experienced after about 5 days on it. I did not have anybody who I could ask about it- do you know anything about that, or other side effects?

Nausea is a normal side effect occurring in something like 10% of patients but I think it usually subsides quickly. The yellowness is of concern, IMO. None of the studies showed liver toxicity at doses < 300mg.

One compilation of studies I read suggested that individualized dosing as low as 12.5mg (1/4 pill) was used in some cases. Maybe you could give that a shot? You can read it here:

http://www.atforum.com/pdf/NaltrexoneWhitePaper.pdf#search="naltrexone"

[tsfitness]

Experience with Naltrexone

Thanks Redwhine, by the way, i love your name! I had breast cancer 5 years ago so I go in to see my oncologist every 6 months and they do bloodwork. I wonder if that is something they screen for? Anyone with medical background know the answer to this? If so, I'd love to hear it. So an update on me, all very weird. ORdered the topa, took it one day 25 mg, it made me so sick ( or did I have a bug?) then could barely drink for the past 3 nights. One glass, 1 and a half at the most. I havent taken the topa again. To be continued. Good luck to you!