Strictly Sinclair: Naltrexone Done Right

[SpringerRider]

Strictly Sinclair: Naltrexone Done Right

I agree with all the Lena has said. Conditioned learning extinction has a certain protocol to be followed.

I lost a friend last summer. He was shot by a cop in what I would call, suicide by cop. Jeff was a nice guy sober but a monster drunk. He was short and we referred to him as little Jeff. For a while I let him live in my basement while he was sober and getting back on his feet.

I had never met someone that got so overtaking by alcohol. He has a sweet 12 yr old daughter and was just flushing his life down the drain. He was quite smart but just couldn't stay clean. When I met him 10 years ago, he had gotten out of prison after six months for excessive DUIs.

He was pretty handy so I hired him to finish my basement and also gave him a place to live. But he could not stay sober. One night he went to an Applebees and got so drunk they turned him off. He threatened the bar-tendress for not serving him and little did he know, he was sitting next to an off duty cop. I bailed him out.

A few months later he went into a Krogers and grabbed a case of beer, even though it was Sunday and you can't by alcohol on Sunday. He did not get out of the parking lot and that put him in prison for another six months.

Last summer he got a job with a small construction outfit. They gave him a place to live. One night he got drunk and took their van and left. They called the law and reported it stolen. He was spotted by the cops and when they attempted to pull him over her swerved and ran into the cop car. They shot and killed him.

He did want to stay sober and I think something like Sinclair method would have worked for him. At least it would have been better than what he got.

What makes Sinclair so much different is that while writing this, I am sipping a Tequilla. I will drink without restaint until I don't want to drink anymore. Last night I could not drink the second glass. I finally poured it down the sink. I lost all will to drink it. That is the kind of thing my wife would do but never me. I am drinking and thinking like a normal drinker. And I get here without effort!

[SpringerRider]

Strictly Sinclair: Naltrexone Done Right

cyclefan;549269 wrote: Well, it might be kinder than the fate my cousins had planned for him at one point which involved concrete boots and the Missouri River. Of course, I understood your jest, though great minds and all....

Well if it is that desparate, you may want to entertain something more serious. Time is not on your side. Talk with her. Let her read the book. You may not have to be surreptitious with him. If he returns to drinking put him on Naltrexone and let him know that he can continue to drink as long as he takes Naltrexone one hour before. Insure he knows this is not Antibuse. He may be compliant if he knows he can drink as much as he wants! I would be so interested in a case like that. He sounds like an excellent candidate.

And it seems that you have nothing to loose.

Good luck and God bless.

[aurora borialis]

Strictly Sinclair: Naltrexone Done Right

I was just catching up on reading on this post and I am touched by the honesty with regards to how the addiction has affected people. I feel this as well. I am a former binge drinker and it is not an understatement to tell you that binge drinking is dangerous. I have seen 3 friends die, one recently because of this addiction. I hate going to funerals because of it. I knew I had to do something for myself and AA was not working for me in any way. The Sinclair method has, and I only wish my friends were alive so I could have had the oppertunity to get them to try it. I actually believe it is saving my life. It is with great relief and joy that I can say I am at the stage where I am beyond that stage of fear foe my life, and now it is saving my relationships. So much crap and physical as well as emotional consequences have all stopped. Without struggle and pain. Just a little unaltering discipline.

[Solice]

Strictly Sinclair: Naltrexone Done Right

Hi Potato. Thanks for the post and encouragement. How long was it for you nefore you began to have alcohol free days, ie, just no desire to drink at all on given days??

I'm wnating to force my self not to drink just so I can experience my endorphins again doing other things but still get the cravings or desire after work to crack a few beers.. Haven't had an AF day yet..

[lenaleed]

Strictly Sinclair: Naltrexone Done Right

Every drink re-wires the brain

Solice;550535 wrote: I'm wnating to force my self not to drink just so I can experience my endorphins again doing other things but still get the cravings or desire after work to crack a few beers.. Haven't had an AF day yet..

Rv9, who is in touch with Eskapa and Dr. Sinclair, reminds us regularly that it will impede our progress to try to "force" an alcohol free day. Indulging our cravings is the way to extinction. The day will come when we are ready. I haven't read his post yet, but looks like our SpringerRider may have hit that milestone. We may have to have a party over at our Sinclair site.

Eskapa says the first step is to think of alcohol addiction in a whole new way. That includes the idea that while we are taking naltrexone, drinking is "good" for us. We cannot get unaddicted without drinking + naltrexone.

Hey francophone, I've noticed you on our thesinclairmethod.com; Index page site. I was a high-volume daily drinker like you. rv9 says the Sinclair method works best for drinkers like us.

[bloggy]

Strictly Sinclair: Naltrexone Done Right

A Work in Progress;549319 wrote: You know, I think that one of the reasons I am so interested in, and so closely following this whole naltrexone thing, is that I am wondering if it would be effective for someone like my father... his alcoholism was very severe, he ended up committing suicide... I just know there is NO way he ever could/would have stopped drinking permanently (he lasted maybe a month in AA, once), nor would he have stayed on antabuse. He is beyond any help now, of course, and it still eats at me. For my father, for someone like him... if his physician had explained to him how to use it... I just wonder. Might it have made a huge difference, for him?

Time will tell. So far, from what I have read, it looks as if there might be something along the lines of 50% "sustained recovery" rates over a period of, perhaps, 6 months? Maybe a year? That's very good, compared to other "methods." I am very interested in seeing how this picture looks over a period of 1, 2, 5 years... and also wondering what might be the factors that lead to drop-outs or lack of "success" for other reasons.

WIP, I wonder if for drinkers like your father, (I am guessing here as of course I did not know your father) but I can think of a few guys known to me personally, if the answer might be the less they know the better.

SR made a remark a few posts back that if someone were told it was a pill to reduce hangovers it might work better- I can really see the sense in that, as the very wired drinker would think he was doing something to help him continue to drink.

I had a friend whose alcoholism killed him a few years ago, he was 52, and although I knew him 20 plus years, and his life was miserable due to his drinking he never saw the connection- he thought drinking was the only good thing in his life, and everything and everybody just 'happened' to him. I think if someone had explained the method to him he would not have been interested, and after a short time would be 'forgetting' to take his pill. However if he thought it was a hangover pill he would have taken it religiously.

Dr. Sinclair said on the podcast that people were given the pills and told to take one an hour before drinking, in those days of course there was no instant internet access for information, and I wonder if they were told anything else? The way he describes it, one gets the impression they were not told much- I don't think that is a bad thing.

BTW, for anyone who is interested, today is the end of day 7 for me- I have drunk a total of 19 beers during those 7 days, and of those 19, I really struggled to finish probably 5 of them. I have not tried in anyway at all to control my drinking- quite the opposite in fact because I think each drink I take is going to get me better faster, but I tell you it has been a struggle to get them down. Tonight I did not even bother bringing beer number 3 home with me- and it was a real relief I did not have to try to struggle through it.

[SpringerRider]

Strictly Sinclair: Naltrexone Done Right

A Work in Progress;549319 wrote:
Time will tell. So far, from what I have read, it looks as if there might be something along the lines of 50% "sustained recovery" rates over a period of, perhaps, 6 months? Maybe a year? That's very good, compared to other "methods." I am very interested in seeing how this picture looks over a period of 1, 2, 5 years... and also wondering what might be the factors that lead to drop-outs or lack of "success" for other reasons.

Sorry about your father. And to me it now looks like a damn shame. The more I understand the Sinclair addiction model, the more enraged I get at all the pain the world has suffered. I regard alcohol addiction as a pebble in your shoe. It can be a small stone or and piece of hot molten lead or a little living critter with fangs. Whatever the case, as long as it is there, you must deal with it.

I believe AA was a way to manage the pebble. We learned to compartmentalize it by rituals and chants. It was always there but we convinced ourselves we could live with it.

There are also chemical ways to help mask the pebble but it is still there. Various substances make the addiction more tolerable or less pronounced.

And then the Sinclair method comes along and says, I can remove the pebble. And we discovered that that pebble was not the alcohol but the addiction. The alcohol was the vehicle for the addiction just as money is the delivery vehicle for a gamblers compulsion. Taking away the alcohol from and alcoholic makes as much sense as taking the money from a compulsive gambler. You are fighting the wrong beast.

We Sinclarians believe we are in the correct fight. We are going after the addiction process. I am sorry that I have no longitudinal data to offer you all. I have not seen any myself. We may end up being the first to provide it. Nor will I guarantee you that this is the answer. I will gurantee you that I am telling you the truth to my findings. It is the best that I have.

With every drink, I believe I am drinking to my health. If this works do you know what that will do to the principle of alcohol recovery?

[francophone]

Strictly Sinclair: Naltrexone Done Right

Re: Strictly Sinclair: Naltrexone Done Right

lenaleed;550800 wrote: Rv9, who is in touch with Eskapa and Dr. Sinclair, reminds us regularly that it will impede our progress to try to "force" an alcohol free day. Indulging our cravings is the way to extinction. The day will come when we are ready. I haven't read his post yet, but looks like our SpringerRider may have hit that milestone. We may have to have a party over at our Sinclair site.

Eskapa says the first step is to think of alcohol addiction in a whole new way. That includes the idea that while we are taking naltrexone, drinking is "good" for us. We cannot get unaddicted without drinking + naltrexone.

Hey francophone, I've noticed you on our thesinclairmethod.com; Index page site. I was a high-volume daily drinker like you. rv9 says the Sinclair method works best for drinkers like us.

Hi, Lena

Yes, I was on the site, the other day, and even tried to register. I was unsuccessful, if memory serves me, and came back here to read more of the posts. I am becoming more and more hopeful. Hope begets desire, desire begets motivation, motivation begets action, and action, right action (a Buddhist prerequisite) is what I need to do.

francophone

[JohnR]

Strictly Sinclair: Naltrexone Done Right

Just catching up...

I had a rather painful dental procedure last week so please forgive my absence from the board. I am recovering nicely (with the help of pain killers) and AF for 4 days now. Other than my mouth, I am feeling great!

[BecomingMeAtLast]

Strictly Sinclair: Naltrexone Done Right

Just want to jump in with another thanks for this thread. I'm also reading with interest the posts on thesinclairmethod.com thread.

Be

[Goin4More]

Strictly Sinclair: Naltrexone Done Right

Just popping in here to share my experiences, so far, with Naltrexone. It seems important to encourage as many alcohol-dependent people as possible to give the Sinclair Method a try. Like Lena, I also have a strong intuitive sense that this really is the answer for most alcohol addicts. . .and also that it's going to have an uphill battle being accepted by the medical community at large. So we all need to do our part.

I've just started week four, have made NO attempt to curb my drinking, but am already experiencing less desire for alcohol, overall. At a family get-together last night, I drank five glasses of wine - half my normal amount. I went to bed with a fairly clear head, remembered all of the conversation and events of the night this morning, and have not suffered the usual morning shakiness and muddled thinking. Best of all, I did not make an ass of myself in front of friends and family!

Naltrexone does seem to bring on a feeling of fatique about an hour after I take it, but this soon passes. I find that I drink a glass of wine much slower than previously, and really do enjoy it more.

SpringRider, I can so identify with your experiences with your friend who was the proverbial 'hopeless drunk.' I hired a man to work part time for me last year, believing he was an abstaining alcoholic. He was very intelligent and capable, and a dependable worker. We talked about interesting books we both read, and were becoming real friends.

Then my S.O. and I went out to a local bar one night, and this fellow was there. Well, sort of: he was on a bender, and had become a totally different, obnoxious S.O.B. I won't go into details, but discovered later he'd stolen his girlfriend's car, sold his tools to buy booze, and was eventually arrested that night for DUI and auto theft. His third DUI - he's now in prison for a mandatory three year stint. What a needless waste of a valuable life!

The idea of offering Nal as an anti-hangover vitamin? Under these kinds of circumstances, it seems like a downright ethical thing to do, IMHO. Once the drinking is under control, then the 'subject' can be told what's up, and decide if they want to voluntarily become re-addicted. I don't know anyone who has experienced this addiction who wouldn't THANK someone for setting them free - with, or without, their knowledge.

[nancy]

Strictly Sinclair: Naltrexone Done Right

I don't think it would work as vitamin. If you are on it, you need some sort of medic alert for emergency purposes. If ER was to try things to block pain during procedures,they might not work.

there might also be drug interactions and of course the liver issues to watch.

[SpringerRider]

Strictly Sinclair: Naltrexone Done Right

JohnR;551618 wrote: I had a rather painful dental procedure last week so please forgive my absence from the board. I am recovering nicely (with the help of pain killers) and AF for 4 days now. Other than my mouth, I am feeling great!

Were you taking Naltrexone while using the painkillers? Since many are opioids (hydrocodone), I would be curious how that worked.

[lenaleed]

Strictly Sinclair: Naltrexone Done Right

As many posts on this thread and this site attest, the liver issues for this drug have been over-emphasized. We who have abused our livers are always wise to monitor liver function while on any drug metabolized by the liver.

The larger issue is misleading someone about taking a prescription drug. Why not just say, take this drug every time you drink? It might have side effects the first day or two, but after that you probably won't feel it at all and eventually you probably won't want to drink very much. But until then, drink as much as you want, as long as you are safe (e.g. no driving).

Another issue is for m.d.'s: prescribing a drug with instructions to drink as you normally do. Eskapa says m.d.'s need not advise alcohol addicts to drink; they will anyway. They need only advise patients that, if they are going to drink, take naltrexone first. They should also add that on a day they do not plan to drink they should not take naltrexone.

[SpringerRider]

Strictly Sinclair: Naltrexone Done Right

Goin4More;551650 wrote: Just popping in here to share my experiences, so far, with Naltrexone. It seems important to encourage as many alcohol-dependent people as possible to give the Sinclair Method a try.

Here is where I have to part ways. If you are not actively drinking and have a method that is keeping you sober, DO NOT start drinking so you can do the Sinclair Method. That would be like breaking your leg to just try out a new caste.

Every act of drunkingness entails dangers to you, those around you and your help. Again, if you are not drinking, the Sinclair Method is not for you.

Who knows, we may all come back crawling on our bellies screaming for everyone else to run and save themselves. Not that I have doubts but at least wait for some of us to get some time under our belts. As WIP saves, the devil is always in the unintended consequences.