Thinking of giving up on bac and going to topa

[Citygirl]

Hi Everyone,

I haven?t posted in awhile because I was doing my first time try of bac and seeing what happens. Didn?t want to post every darn thing I was thinking and feeling and bore the crap out of you ; >)

I started bac in late August. I had the usual issues (somnolence, mostly) at first and then got used to it. The big thing was driving. It really effects my driving and I do a lot of it, so I couldn?t do it if I had places to go. Well, I could, but it felt like driving drunk, which I don?t do.

I was really sensitive to bac at first, so I had to take it slow.

I am up to 100 mg now and all the way through, I have had no decrease in AL consumption AT ALL. I have not been AL free, except for 2 days here and there. The bac definitely made me more ?tipsy? faster, but I still drank a bottle of wine every night. Without fail. Sometimes I actually thought that I wanted AL MORE while on bac than less. Maybe I?d be up to 2 bottles a night without it ? who knows? So maybe, on some level, it did actually help me, but I don?t know it.

I did come to the realization that my drinking was habit-based and not craving-based. Which I guess it?s good that I know that. I haven?t found a good substitute activity though for the time that I spend drinking that actually works for me. My witching hour is around 7-8PM. Then I drink till bed time. Wine only and always.

I also discovered that I use AL because I have terrible insomnia. The bac actually guarantees that I sleep, whilst also drinking. I am OUT and not waking in the middle of the night like I used to when I only had AL to put me to sleep. Not that this is a good thing, but?well?it?s a thing.

There?s more I could say but, at the risk of putting everyone to sleep, the bottom line is I was thinking of scaling back the bac and maybe trying Topamax. Wondering if maybe bac is not the tool for me?

What does anyone think?

I read the forum a lot and search it a lot and I respect all of the posters here a great deal. When I first posted, the encouragement was so cool, I couldn?t believe it. And I see it for other people as well.

Anyone who has tried bac and/or topa or BOTH, preferably, who has experience or advice ? I?d love to hear from you. I started with bac because what I read about the side effects vs. the side effects of topa seemed much more tolerable, even though the book is topa-based. Also, it seems there?s much more info (anecdotal and otherwise) about bac on this website.

Thanks guys. Your insight is appreciated.

All the best!

[ThirdMan]

Thinking of giving up on bac and going to topa

I'll just be the first to state the obvious, something you probably already know, but 100mg is actually not that much compared to what some people take. I've read several people write that they got almost nothing out of Bac until they reached upwards of 200mg. HOWEVER, I can understand that since you are driving all the time, somnolence is probably the one side-effect you really can't afford. I'm still pretty green myself, but my two cents would be to just ween off the bac if you can't go up higher and switch to something else. If your drinking increases substantially, or if you find yourself drinking and driving instead, I might stick with the bac. But if it isn't helping I wouldn't think a lower dose would do much aside from possibly still give you the occasional bout of the sleepies, which could be dangerous. Also, it sounds like you may have hit the nail on the head when you said it was more the habit than the cravings, in which case Naltrexone might be more effective, or maybe topa. Unfortunately I haven't tried topa, sorry.

[jessie]

Thinking of giving up on bac and going to topa

Baclofen

I'm so glad you posted the question as I am in the process of deciding whether I should go for Topa or Baclofen. And I don't have money to throw around.
Please keep us up to date.

[Cinders]

Thinking of giving up on bac and going to topa

CityGirl,

I took Topamax for while until I figured out I was allergic to it.

I titrated up on the Topa and was doing the whole MWO "thing."

I had to put stickies on my dashboard telling me where to go and who my client was.

The Bac doesn't do that to me. At all.

You are nowhere near the level of where you should be re Baclofen, keep going up.

btw, there are no silver bullets. The meds help but after that you still have to deal with you.

I hope you find success.

Love,
Cindi

[Lenore]

Thinking of giving up on bac and going to topa

Have you read about or considered naltrexone/TSM?

[Spectra]

Thinking of giving up on bac and going to topa

I had to get to about 220mg, and even then there was no "switch" as such. I don't think you can rely on the Baclofen to do all the work for you, I certainly can't.

Many people, myself included, ramp up in the evening. My schedule after 16 days AF is:

8am-10mg, 11am-10mg, 2pm-25mg, 4pm-25mg, 6pm-25mg, 8pm-10mg, 10pm-10mg

At the point where I stopped drinking I was on nearly double that.

If you don't have to do too much driving over Christmas, and if you the party season doesn't have too much pull, you might be able to go up hard and fast and then back down before the real world rears it's ugly head.

I've tried in the past and always found day three, four, and five the hard ones - if you get past that i sure you'll be home and dry.

Take care

S

[Lo0p]

Thinking of giving up on bac and going to topa

I am on bac and doing TSM. I'm currently taking 200mgs of bac and am effortlessly AF. If I want to drink I take a naltrexone and drink. Examples of this would be on Thanksgiving I had 1 1/2 drinks, then I went to my sister's house another day to play poker and had 3 beers over the course of several hours while playing poker. Been AF for the rest of the last 3 weeks.

Now, if I were not doing TSM and only taking 100mgs of bac I would still be drinking my normal amount, which incidentally is 2 - 2 1/2 bottles of wine a night.

This seems to be my 'silver bullet.' I've picked up my life just where I left it 8 years ago.

Trying to mitigate SE's like somnolence while driving is something for which only you can decide the best course of action. But I'll reiterate what others have already said and say you haven't even given the baclofen a fair shake yet.

If you do decide to give up early and switch to something else that is western medicne/scientific/empirically based (which seems to be a bad word when it comes to alcoholism...a disease ) why not go with something that has been proven highly effective like TSM? It has a boatload of research behind it going back 30 years and has way less SE's than bac or topa.

[tiptronic_ct]

Thinking of giving up on bac and going to topa

CityGirl...

Have you worked out what your potential maximum dose of bac is? Without that, you cannot make an informed decision. You can PM me if you want and I'll work it out for you. All I need is your weight.

These basics seem to get lost because of all the bac threads (not that lots of bac threads are a bad thing).

I had to go up to 240mg before I hit my switch. The dangers of somnolence and driving should not be underestimated. I fell asleep at the wheel during rush-hour traffic and drove into the back of the car in front of me. The damage to my car alone came to almost US$8000. The somnolence does get much over time though. At the time, I must also add, much of my daytime somnolence was because of insomnia. I got only 2 - 4 hours sleep a night. I envy the long nights and vivid dreams others seem to be enjoying

Having said that, I still get extremely drowsy mid/late-afternoon, after having taken 40mg at lunchtime and 60mg at 4.

I started on Ritalin yesterday (I was dignosed with ADD). The one thing I noticed immediately was that there is not a single sign of somnolence any more. Usually, at this time on a Saturday afternoon, I would be well into a Nanna Nap. Not so today. This is NOT medical advice, but you might want to look into some kind of stimulant to counter-act the effect of bac.

I can remember that when I came close to my switch, I could hardly get up in the morning. Having had NO side-effects from Bac until I hit around 200, it certainly wasn't pleasant. I used to add two heaped teaspoons of good quality (i.e. pure) caffeinated instant coffee granules to my morning brew. I also carried a bottle of water with me at all times. I would take a sip or two whenever I felt myself losing concentration. Something simple as sucking on a sweet / mint helps as well. Put some favourite music on your ipod and crank the volume up...

I can only speak for myself, but I was so desperate to stop that I would have tolerated much worse side-effects just to get sober and remain so.

[Citygirl]

Thinking of giving up on bac and going to topa

Thanks for the quick replies, everyone. As always, the advice is thoughtful and extremely helpful. I've PM'd Tiptronic. THe bottom line from what I gather is that I do need to find a way to go up and figure out how to balance life/work with the dosing. I only take it form 5PM through bedtime because I have no desire to drink, except at night. I'll keep reading and see if anyone else posts. I am finally dealing with ME - found a therapist just last week. Something I've been needing to do for a LONG time. Taking care of everyone else and working like a dog leaving myself empty. Good advice and good reminder that I have to get my own (mental) house clean as well.

This is great, everyone - many, many thanks!

[billyb]

Thinking of giving up on bac and going to topa

Just a thought - if it were me I might consider spreading your doses out a bit more, taking some in the morning and midday. Having all of it in the evening will undoubtedly cause somnolence, since your body is not getting acclimated to the bac being constantly in your system.

Also, even if you only get cravings at night, taking bac during the day can certainly help. By reducing the amount of stress and anxiety during the day (even if it's a barely noticeable, low-level stress), it will help prevent the sort of tension build-up that demands a drink at the end of the day.

[Spectra]

Thinking of giving up on bac and going to topa

Suppliments

Hi Citygirl,

Try and have a look at some of the supplements. Don't underestimate them, and if you hunt around online you can find them at pretty good rates. L-Glutamine seems to work really well for me.

[tiptronic_ct]

Thinking of giving up on bac and going to topa

Citygirl

I've responded to your PM.

The core message is: take it easy, you'll get there

Cinders & Spectra also touched on an issue for which I've been shot down in the past, but I'll repeat it nevertheless.

Baclofen is NOT a cure for alcoholism. Even if you take the line that alcoholism is a disease - the typical analogies are hypertension and diabetes. It alleviates the symptoms of your addiction, if I can phrase in the simplest possible way. You must be committed to staying the course and realise that you're in this for the long run.

It is also NOT a silver bullet which will take all the effort out of stopping. Especially since you claim that your problem is habit, not true addiction (which I doubt, but let's leave it at that for the moment).

At some stage, your own willingness / determination / motivation HAS to come into play, and that is where a place like MWO becomes indispensible.

Have you looked at the https://www.mywayout.org/community/f1...box-27556.html? You will find great ideas on how to break the old habits and patterns. To become aware of "triggers" - those things that upset you and make you think of picking up a drink. How to start beating your witching hour. Etc. etc. etc...

Read, read and read some more. Participate. You'll get lots of support and guidance. Not all the advice you'll get will be appropriate for your circumstances, but I assure you all of it will be well-intentioned.

Use any and every thing you have at your disposal: especially things like L-Glut (I ate it by the spoonful, and it did help me), as Spectra mentioned. Check out the Holistic Healing section.

And for dog's sake, people!!!!!! Do your research before diving in. Start by reading Dr. Ameisen's book - INCLUDING the case studies in full. This is not aimed at you, Citygirl, but a general comment to anyone who reads this.

Other essential threads and resources:

Phill's site, as much as I disagree with / dislike his approach: baclofen4alcoholism.com
Lo0p's thread: https://www.mywayout.org/community/f2...ead-38718.html
Zenstyle's thread: https://www.mywayout.org/community/f2...ion-34919.html

And please read from beginning to end, not the other way round

Alright, enough sermonising from me in a single post...

[PhoenixRising]

Thinking of giving up on bac and going to topa

I tried topamax before starting on baclofen.

Topamax had SO many side effects for me I just had to quit taking it. My job requires concentration, or, at the very least, a semi-functional brain (I am a computer programmer). I was not able to do that. I would stare at the screen, remember what I had to do and then stare at the screen some more. I could not hold a thought. I could barely talk. I couldn't remember words or even form a semi-intelligent sentence. If I had had to do anything involving public speaking, I would have been toast. I am so glad the symptoms went away when I got off of it. It did nothing to help with the cravings.

With baclofen, I felt slight relief at 80mg, but, like you, was still sucking down the wine. I went through 3 weeks where I was drinking more than I had before, while titrating up on the bac. Now that I am up to 160mg the pull is almost gone. I also gave myself permission to have a glass of wine if I want to when I am in a social situation. That alleviated the "OMG I can never drink again, better have my fill now" mentality. I also changed my habits - I avoid going to the grocery store after work as the lure of the bottles on the shelves has proven too great. I also walk for about 1/2 hr on the treadmill when I get home, and I sit in the den with my hubby vs sit in the living room by myself. I got some good books to read; altering my evening routine has helped.

I almost gave up on the bac because I never thought I'd need to take so much. I weigh 145 so I didn't think I would ever go this high. Some here weigh less and have gone higher than I have. You just need to keep going up, and alter your dosing schedule so that you are taking more when you need it and when you won't be driving. Add some in the middle of the night so that you can get it into your body when it doesn't matter if it makes you sleepy. I find it makes a TREMENDOUS difference in my anxiety and my quality of sleep, so I will probably always have some on hand for those reasons alone.

HTH

-P.

[Larisa]

Thinking of giving up on bac and going to topa

I've done topa and am now on bac (still 180-200+/day). I've been almost AF for three or four months now, with bac's help, but I'm not indifferent to alcohol. (I went up to 280 and was so catatonic by the end of the day that I decided going up further was just silly.) It has really, really helped.

Topa worked great for me. After I got up over 200 mg, I really didn't care to drink. It worked a little better at suppressing cravings for me than bac, but I eventually got depressed, started drinking again, and blew the topa's effectiveness. That happens if you drink on high doses of topa - it doesn't happen with baclofen, thank goodness!

[cowgal]

Thinking of giving up on bac and going to topa

Hi and sorry you are having a hard time.............

Citigirl............... welcome, I have not met you yet..................:welcome:

I have done topa, nal, campral................paid thousands of $$ for Rhonda Lenair to cure me.........you name it, Bac is the first and only thing to have done wonders for me...................even finally went off my wellbutrin for anxiety/depression due to the wonderful effects it had for me............

I really thought Topa was working, but just turned out that beer tasted like crap out of a can..........one I drank anything else, I was drunker than could be................like the old days..................

I really hope and pray that whatever you choose works out for you, good luck!!!:h

xo:l:l

MA