Baclofen Dosage 'Poll'

[WitsEnd]

Baclofen Dosage 'Poll'

It's a pleasure Virgil. Good luck!

[reneesmiles]

Baclofen Dosage 'Poll'

Less than 30 mg per day
30 - 50 mg per day
60 - 80 mg per day
90 - 110 mg per day
120 - 140 mg per day
150 - 170 mg per day
180 - 200 mg per day
210 - 230 mg per day
240 - 260 mg per day
270 mg or more per day

I was very sensitive to Bac at first, so I seem to be maintaining at 30mg/day

[beatle]

Baclofen Dosage 'Poll'

Virgil;798729 wrote: Hi Folks,

Based on the information that people have kindly offered to date, the baclofen dosage required to reach the 'switch' is 1.1 - 3.2mg/kg body weight. This tallies very well with the figure quoted in Dr Ameisen's The End of My Addiction (pages 166 - 167), which is 1 - 3 mg/kg.

What is interesting is that, albeit based on a small sample, gender does not appear to have much bearing on the required dosage. That could change, of course, as more figures are added in future. Combining males and females, the overall average baclofen 'switch' dosage works out at 2.4mg/kg.

As a fellow OCDer, I am compelled to take issue with your conclusions regarding gender and required dosage.

As you do point out, your conclusions are based on a small (very small) sample.

Also, your conclusions are based on who answers your plea for a poll.

If I were to compile similar statistics for all the threads addressing the subject of baclofen on this forum (which I have not done), I would wager (although, of course, I have no basis in reality to do so) that gender would have a very significant impact on how much is required and how much is tolerable.

Anyone who answers this poll will have been successful (right?). So the statistics of anyone, male or female, who is successful may indicate that males and females have a similar "switch" dosage based on weight.

But what about all of those who are not successful?

Was their "switch' point too high, so that they never reached it? Were the side effects too extreme so that they gave up? Why would they answer a poll like this if they were not successful?

My impression (although not based on any statistical evidence collected by me or anyone else) is that women have far greater negative side effects in regard to baclofen than men do.

Thus, many women either give up or settle on moderation, as they are unable to tolerate the side effects. Most are probably disappointed and still struggling to come to terms with their failure to succeed as they had hoped (while so many men have succeeded).

Hence, they would not post on a thread asking for a poll about dosages.

This is not to question yoru motives, Virgil. Of course you are well meaning and your conclusions make sense based on the results of this poll:thanks:

[Virgil]

Baclofen Dosage 'Poll'

beatle;799778 wrote: I am compelled to take issue with your conclusions regarding gender and required dosage.

...your conclusions make sense based on the results of this poll:thanks:

Hi beatle,

The two statements above appear to be in conflict.

As for your other comments and rhetorical questions, they are perfectly valid points.

I did try to stress that "What is interesting is that, albeit based on a small sample, gender does not appear to have much bearing on the required dosage. That could change, of course, as more figures are added in future". There are no less than three caveats in there. I'm at a loss as to know how I could have worded my statement more clearly.

V.

[eight days a week]

Baclofen Dosage 'Poll'

I don't think you could have been any clearer in that whatsoever Virgil.

beatle, thank you for making some interesting points from the point of view of someone who has been around this site and the Baclofen threads and experiences here a lot longer than I have.

Just a thought - is there any reason why people who have been unsuccessful with Bac can't contribute on this thread at what dosage they gave up with it. due to side effects, or for any other reason? Would that also be helpful?

eight

[beatle]

Baclofen Dosage 'Poll'

Virgil;800023 wrote: Hi beatle,

The two statements above appear to be in conflict.

As for your other comments and rhetorical questions, they are perfectly valid points.

I did try to stress that "What is interesting is that, albeit based on a small sample, gender does not appear to have much bearing on the required dosage. That could change, of course, as more figures are added in future". There are no less than three caveats in there. I'm at a loss as to know how I could have worded my statement more clearly.

V.

Well, I did anticipate that my comments would elicit a reaction. I also expected a rational and civil response, and I am gratified that this was the case.

So, to respond in kind:

Virgil, your wording was impeccable. You did indeed offer all pertinent caveats.

I was expanding on, not criticizing, the conclusions you made -- or more appropriately, trying to clarify your conclusions and what they may or may not signify.

Yes, you did cover that ground.

And, of course, eight, those who have not, or do not, ever reach their switch point are welcome to post, but I don't think there are many who would feel inclined to do so based on the thread asking for at what dose you reached your switch point.

All that said, I think this thread is interesting and useful. Many people have posted on it in an unusually empirical way. This kind of information is valuable, and the consolidation of the information is helpful to many people.

I did at some point start a thread about the differences between the reaction of men and women to baclofen. Although purely anecdotal, my impression is that women have a much more difficult time with side effects than do men, and that far fewer women than men ever get to their switch point.

[Cinders]

Baclofen Dosage 'Poll'

This is such a great thread, it really is.

If I were a wagering woman, which I am, I would bet that weight has a lot more to do with "off switches," "bad effects," etc than gender.

But that is just me, wagering again. I have turned $1000.00 play dollars into $80,000.00 on yahoo BlackJack, though. Just an aside here...

I never reached my "off switch," I can't get that much medication through a doctor here. I can get 80 mgs/day. That is all.

I am taking that right now and suffering a lot of side effects. However, I am also now taking 1200 mgs/day of Neurontin (Gabapentin) that I had titrated off of.

In other words, I am doing what one is not supposed to do. I went from nothing to 80 mgs/day of Baclofen, 1200 mgs/day of Gabapentin, 180 mgs/day of Verapamil.

So, my side effects can be from any of those drugs.

I am working through them and must. If I don't, I suffer horrific and excruciating headache pain.

So far no seizure. :H:H

Any way, I am ordering from an online pharmacy tonight enough Baclofen to get me to an "off switch." At least I hope so.

I am praying for the true "off switch." I hope all of us find it.

btw, at 80 mgs/day, in the past when I titrated up correctly, it did help, even though I didn't reach an off switch. It blunts the cravings to the point where I can ignore them. They are irritating flies in my head instead of stampeding elephants telling me to go get that d@mn drink. (Which leads to 10 or 15 more until black out.)

So, once I get to my off switch, I will post my weight (wtf???) and my dosage. Hopefully, you will know my gender based on my name.

Love,
Cindi

[beatle]

Baclofen Dosage 'Poll'

I hope all those drugs aren't competing for placeuch:

What does "so far no seizure" mean?

[Cinders]

Baclofen Dosage 'Poll'

Beatle,

My cocktail of drugs is all approved by my GP and she is very careful.

She does not know I went without for so long, though. So, I am "titrating up" by starting with where I need to be rather than going slowly.

I am simply grateful she is taking over the management of all my meds. I think that it is much safer that way. Before, I had scripts from my neurologist, my psychiatrist and my gp. Today I have scripts from my gp. An extremely careful gp.

My neurologist gave me Vicuprofen for my pain. My gp will not. She knows I am an alcoholic and will not prescribe pain meds willy nilly. She will give them to me but only a few at a time.

I am on a toxic cocktail of drugs, though. That is why my gp ordered blood tests. Liver panel, urine, etc. She wants to insure I am not doing more harm than good.

But, understand, I would ask and sign any consent form required, to be alleviated from my head pain. It is too horrid to deal with.

I would rather do what I am doing today than be given a "drip" of morphine. That is my only other option. Have a drip of constant morphine to alleviate my pain.

I do not want that and will fight to stay away from it as long as possible.

Love,
Cindi

[beatle]

Baclofen Dosage 'Poll'

not relevant

[Greg]

Baclofen Dosage 'Poll'

Less than 30 mg per day
30 - 50 mg per day
60 - 80 mg per day
90 - 110 mg per day
120 - 140 mg per day
150 - 170 mg per day
180 - 200 mg per day
210 - 230 mg per day
240 - 260 mg per day
270 mg or more per day

I'm sensitive to baclofen's insomnia-causing effects when it is taken too close to bedtime, hence my low daily dose so far, but even this dose seems to be helping with cravings. Fortunately many people don't have insomniac reactions to baclofen and some say it helps them sleep.

[eight days a week]

Baclofen Dosage 'Poll'

beatle;800232 wrote:

And, of course, eight, those who have not, or do not, ever reach their switch point are welcome to post, but I don't think there are many who would feel inclined to do so based on the thread asking for at what dose you reached your switch point.
The thread title is simply 'Baclofen dosage 'poll''. There is no mention of the switch point, so Virgil could easily edit his first post to welcome contributions from those folk who never got far enough with Bac, for whatever reason, but only if he felt that was a helpful idea. Merely a suggestion on my part.

Greg;800335 wrote:
I'm sensitive to baclofen's insomnia-causing effects when it is taken too close to bedtime, hence my low daily dose so far, but even this dose seems to be helping with cravings. Fortunately many people don't have insomniac reactions to baclofen and some say it helps them sleep.

Wow, I am very lucky! I sleep like an absolute dream on Bac (and I'm a lifetime problem sleeper). I do so hope this never changes...it might be the end of my Baclofen dream if it stops me sleeping properly.

[Virgil]

Baclofen Dosage 'Poll'

eight days a week;801162 wrote: The thread title is simply 'Baclofen dosage 'poll''. There is no mention of the switch point, so Virgil could easily edit his first post to welcome contributions from those folk who never got far enough with Bac, for whatever reason, but only if he felt that was a helpful idea. Merely a suggestion on my part.

Hi 8,

In the opening post of this thread, I did say "Simply indicate in your reply at which one of the baclofen dosage ranges below did you experience the 'switch' for alcohol reduction...". So, I think it's best if the thread remains as is. However, I have another suggestion - should I start another thread entitled "Did baclofen work for you?" (or words to that effect). People could simply indicate a 'Yes' or 'No' but then go on to explain in more detail about their personal experience, if they wish.

What do others think of this idea? I will only proceed if there is a general consensus (say 70% in favour) that it is worth pursuing.

V.

[craving]

Baclofen Dosage 'Poll'

Less than 30 mg per day
30 - 50 mg per day
60 - 80 mg per day
90 - 110 mg per day
120 - 140 mg per day
150 - 170 mg per day
180 - 200 mg per day
210 - 230 mg per day
240 - 260 mg per day
270 mg or more per day

[beatle]

Baclofen Dosage 'Poll'

Virgil;801365 wrote: Hi 8,

In the opening post of this thread, I did say "Simply indicate in your reply at which one of the baclofen dosage ranges below did you experience the 'switch' for alcohol reduction...". So, I think it's best if the thread remains as is. However, I have another suggestion - should I start another thread entitled "Did baclofen work for you?" (or words to that effect). People could simply indicate a 'Yes' or 'No' but then go on to explain in more detail about their personal experience, if they wish.

What do others think of this idea? I will only proceed if there is a general consensus (say 70% in favour) that it is worth pursuing.

V.

I agree -- the intention of the poll was clearly stated: to find out at which dosage a person reached their switch point. I see no reason to change the poll midway. That wouldn't make sense.

There was a thread a while back called something like "Baclofen failures" -- I didn't like this name for a thread, because I felt like it labelled people as "failures" if they couldn't tolerate the baclofen, which didn't seem fair.

But that really wasn't my point at all. It doesn't matter to me what or where people post their success or failures (bad word, bad word!). Maybe we should also start a thread on people who are somewhat successful on baclofen, but haven't hit their switch? Or maybe one on people who are successfully AF, but never hit their switch?

It's not really important to me -- my main point was that we cannot draw general conclusions about people who take baclofen based on an informal sample of self-selected respondents who have succeeded on reaching a "switch" on baclofen. If, for example, women in the dosage poll reached their switch point at about the same dosage level as men, is that significant if most women never get there, while most men get there and get there fast? (just a postulation -- not intended as a hypothesis). That's the kind of thing I was trying to point out. That's all.