Any women hit the switch (with bac)?

[AMELIA]

Any women hit the switch (with bac)?

Beatle,
Thank you for your post. I do agree with you about being AF before you address your issues. That was my mistake - I got sober and didn't deal with the underlying issues.

Perhaps this is why I chose to pick up a beer (the instant stress reliever) instead of my baclofen when I was nearing the start of one of my exhibitions. I put myself under way too much pressure (newly sober), without any backup, tool box or close support.
I lost nearly a stone in weight over those few months because I was so stressed. The reasons of which I am still unsure. I suspect was rooted in my need for approval as an artist and my basic low self esteem. The exhibitions were a resounding success (thank goodness), but I did drink a far amount during that period.
I also now need to deal with why, when I am about to start work on a piece of art, the urge to drink becomes so strong (this is the stuff I need to work through).
So, I know where to find the trusty horse, I just have to work out how to get the cart attached...and then get into it!!
By the way, I totally agree with going private if you can afford it. I get my Bac privately and will continue to deal with any 'alcohol related' issues that way.
You sound good. The work you are doing with your therapist is must be benefiting you and your self esteem if you are leaving her office feeling elated.

[cowgal]

Any women hit the switch (with bac)?

wow

Thanks Amelia and as always Beatle.....................I am starting counseling this Thurs AM, and don't want to focus only on AL, so great insight, getting back on bac too.........picking up my rx tomorrow AM and starting slow but need it, or I am going to spiral down again..............all these insecure feelings of being on my own, others and financial troubles have me very worried:no:..............one minute at a time, at work right now, thank GOD or I may just be trashed right now!!??? off tomorrow that is why Iwant to start bac asap!!!! Bac is the horse for me too Beatle.................will start working on the cart Thurs AM, looking forward to it, but my experience in this podunk town is finding a good counseler is difficult!! Hope it works, :fingers:

lots of love to u both!!!!!:l:h

Mean it.....................you always help me and everyone immensely!!!!:wings:

MA:h

[Virgil]

Any women hit the switch (with bac)?

beatle;806176 wrote: Virgil, I agree completely that we need to sort this out. But I do think Dr. A has used that term... not sure, though, because it's so long since I read the book. I wonder if he said it in that TV show? Or on his website? I'll do some research later.

And tip, your definition is what I think (thought). Which reconfirms that I have not reached the evasive "switch". If there is no alcohol to be had, I can deal with it, but if there is, the tea is not going to look very enticing (and I do like tea).

beatle,

It would now appear that we have reached agreement. Tiptronic has confirmed what I thought Dr Ameisen stated. In tiptronic's words:

"Switch = indifference to alcohol"

You were going to do some research - did you manage to find the time and/or are you happy that we can now put this one to bed?

V.

P.S. people from other forums know that I am a stickler (!) when it comes to ensuring that words are clearly defined.

[Mettaphorica]

Any women hit the switch (with bac)?

One thing that seems to me to keep getting overlooked in threads is the fact that like any drug, for some people Bac simply won't work. Similarly, for some, it will work to some degree. While we hope so much and want to put a lot of faith in a medication as perhaps finally being the cure, for anyone undertaking Bac, or any other therapy, must keep in mind that for them, it may not work, or may only partially work.
Antidepressants, for what they are worth, only do part of the job. The depressed person still needs to take some action to overcome depression (such as exercise, CBT, doing things even if not feeling like it etc). I believe same with AC drugs help.

We hear and read these wonderful stories of people hitting a switch and being indifferent to alcohol and AF free, as if that is the gold standard and if Bac doesn't completely achieve this in the way we expect, then there's something wrong with us or the drug, setting oneself up for feelings of failure and low esteem, or not using the drug because it's not "perfect".
ANY result or reduction in AC or craving is a GOOD result, it doesn't have to be perfect. It seems to me that people want something to take responsibility for their own behaviour. Whilst I understand (boy, do I understand) the compulsion of addiction, in the end, you are the one who picks up the beer or wine, you are the one who chooses, no one is sitting on your chest pouring it down your throat.

Mettaphorica

[Greg]

Any women hit the switch (with bac)?

I will chime in here for a bit and say that I'd be very happy with any medication that gave me a solid, dependable reduction in alcohol cravings, especially in the evening. If there were still some residual thoughts about alcohol or easily handled cravings for it, then I'd be quite satisfied with the result and regard the drug as being successful for me. I have yet to achieve this result during my current month of being AF, although I achieved notable craving reductions a number of years ago while on Campral and AF.

As with any other medication, baclofen is going to have varied results at varied doses for different alcohol-dependent people. However it seems that the total indifference/switch being referred to only happens for most people at very high doses. Dr Ameisen is a man of quite slim build yet he needed 270 mg per day to reach this total indifference, after being on 180 mg per day and not being satisfied with his results at that already high level. I have not reached such a "switch" at the levels I have taken so far, but I have only been up to a maximum of 75-100 mg per day. I will be honest here and admit that it's not only side effects keeping me from going higher, but also a fear of taking huge daily doses of this drug and possible withdrawal symptoms from those doses. We have Dr Ameisen's experience and book, and each others' experiences so far, as guides but has anyone actually read case studies or other reports of patients being given daily baclofen doses over 100 mg for neurological/muscular conditions??

My lower baclofen doses seem to have helped me so far and anything is better than going back to alcohol, so I will start to go higher and I'll definitely let everyone here know if I do reach that somewhat elusive switch, and if I manage to stay sober afterwards.

By the way I fully agree that other issues in life need to be dealt with as part of starting a new sober or alcohol-reduced life. I will not be able to lead a satisfying life until I have dealt with quite a bit of personal and emotional baggage.

[WitsEnd]

Any women hit the switch (with bac)?

Hello, yes, I agree with what you have all said ... I've been gone from here for a little while and so never saw this thread but I am female (last time I checked) and yes I hit the switch on 21st Dec at 225 mg and am now titrated down to 160mg and remain indifferent to alcohol. Funnily enough, I was given a glass of wine tonight and I took one sip and then went to make a cup of tea as tea seemed much more interesting. But I do agree that Baclofen does nothing to help the mental crap, although the lessening of anxiety is great, depression still an old black dog that follows you around ... I'm still an alcoholic, just one that doesn't drink (just now, but fingers crossed): someone said once on this forum that it was when Baclofen takes effect that we should start to get mental health help etc and I think that was really wise. I think that Baclofen is a tool to help us not drink, of course it's not the solution but if it works for you it's a great tool and I think it could help/be part of saving many more lives. it's the most hope that I've had in 14 alcoholic years.
Great to hear from you Mary Ann :h

[sisley]

Any women hit the switch (with bac)?

Okay, Im confused and new to this site...I had surgery on my neck, C4,5,6,and 7 spinal fusion, and a metal plate put in there they gave me baclofen for, pain?? relief tension whatever..didnt seem to work all it did was make me pass out...altho I was drinking w/it at that time...how does it help w/addiction???enlighten me please...I have a huge bottle left and thinking of trying it again w/out the booze of course

[beatle]

Any women hit the switch (with bac)?

Sisley, welcome here! I will get back to you shortly (as I am sure others will do)!

... but first I must address other recent posts:

Amelia, Greg, Cowgal, Phoenix, Virgil -- such great input... but I'll have to get back to you, too.

Mettaphorica;807267 wrote: One thing that seems to me to keep getting overlooked in threads is the fact that like any drug, for some people Bac simply won't work. Similarly, for some, it will work to some degree. While we hope so much and want to put a lot of faith in a medication as perhaps finally being the cure, for anyone undertaking Bac, or any other therapy, must keep in mind that for them, it may not work, or may only partially work.
Antidepressants, for what they are worth, only do part of the job. The depressed person still needs to take some action to overcome depression (such as exercise, CBT, doing things even if not feeling like it etc). I believe same with AC drugs help.

We hear and read these wonderful stories of people hitting a switch and being indifferent to alcohol and AF free, as if that is the gold standard and if Bac doesn't completely achieve this in the way we expect, then there's something wrong with us or the drug, setting oneself up for feelings of failure and low esteem, or not using the drug because it's not "perfect".
ANY result or reduction in AC or craving is a GOOD result, it doesn't have to be perfect. It seems to me that people want something to take responsibility for their own behaviour. Whilst I understand (boy, do I understand) the compulsion of addiction, in the end, you are the one who picks up the beer or wine, you are the one who chooses, no one is sitting on your chest pouring it down your throat.

Mettaphorica

and I don't know how to do the double quote thing, but here's the other one I wanted to quote (from witsend):

"Hello, yes, I agree with what you have all said ... I've been gone from here for a little while and so never saw this thread but I am female (last time I checked) and yes I hit the switch on 21st Dec at 225 mg and am now titrated down to 160mg and remain indifferent to alcohol. Funnily enough, I was given a glass of wine tonight and I took one sip and then went to make a cup of tea as tea seemed much more interesting. But I do agree that Baclofen does nothing to help the mental crap, although the lessening of anxiety is great, depression still an old black dog that follows you around ... I'm still an alcoholic, just one that doesn't drink (just now, but fingers crossed): someone said once on this forum that it was when Baclofen takes effect that we should start to get mental health help etc and I think that was really wise. I think that Baclofen is a tool to help us not drink, of course it's not the solution but if it works for you it's a great tool and I think it could help/be part of saving many more lives. it's the most hope that I've had in 14 alcoholic years."

Point well taken! I guess I have been barking up the wrong tree here. Obviously, it's all very enticing to think about a little magic pill, but why not be happy with a very helpful little pill?

Many others have been saying this all along, and I have always agreed. I'm thrilled with the progress I've made so far, and I know I have been very active in achieving the progress. At this point, I don't need much more "outside" help (just lots of the inside type!)...

Still, it is intriguing to me that many men seem to be able to achieve this indifference, whilst no women (one exception!) do.

[AMELIA]

Any women hit the switch (with bac)?

Sisley - Welcome!
Whenever I have had alcohol with Bac, it has brought on sleepiness. I have only made progress with it once I have given myself a start date without alcohol. So, it is possible that you may experience a lessening in cravings when you try Bac AF.

This is proving an interesting thread! Thank you everyone for your input.

I agree that for some people Bac is a helpful pill. But the bottom line is that taking a pill isn't going to sort your life out - like you said Beatle, the pill is helping you to deal with other issues because alcohol isn't the all consuming problem.

I am only newly AF again. I am only on 60 - 70mg and have the odd 'urge' around the witching hour.
I realise that this time while using Bac, I really need to address the things that were underlying my drinking anyhow. Low self esteem and the myriad of problems that associated with that, the GUILT that I feel from choices I have made over the last 15 years while drinking heavily, the 'time and opportunities' I feel I have lost etc.

There is really no silver bullet, but I feel that so far Bac has been the drug that has most effectively helped me to reduce and stop Al. And I do believe I reached my switch at 80 - 120. I chose old habits (drink) at a time of extreme pressure (instead of Bac) the last time round.
I think that once I create a plan and a tool box, with dedicated work on my personal issues, I think I could make long term sobriety a possibility (and only on 60 - 70mg)

[Mettaphorica]

Any women hit the switch (with bac)?

Hi Beatle and Amelia

I am very happy for a pill that works! That's my whole point--it doesn't need to be perfect to be good enough. My concern was for people reading who might think it really is the silver bullet, and then if that doesn' t happen for them, or they start taking it and find it "only" partly works, or that their head is still a bit of a mess, that that then means it hasn't done its job, or that there is something wrong with them. Personally, I am relieved and grateful for Bac.

I am on 45mg (just moved up today from 40mg) and find my "indifference" is in the form of not wanting or needing to go past one drink -- the cup of tea is, indeed more interesting! I don't need to force it. If something is happening at this dose, let's see what happens as I move upward. BTW, in case anyone else out there is thinking, "how come Metta is getting some response at such a small dose?" (I responded almost immediately, and at 20mg, a definite lack of compulsion coming on) is because I am quite small and lightweight, a bit underweight for my height, in truth. I am fully prepared to go higher than 40 if need be.

I have started this from 10months AC free, and then in Dec Jan noticed the occasional "slip". Well, I know where that' s headed, no matter how much I try and convince myself otherwise. So I've nipped it in the bud with Bac. In the past, I would've "titrated" up from one glass of wine to a bottle before you could say, AA. (Which I've never used, btw). If things had run their usual course, I'd be drinking a bottle a day by now, maybe more.

Given that I am on such a low dose and have feelings of "don't want anymore" and want the tea instead, I wonder if I will be one of your "switch hitters". Right now, I think I could easily pass it up in the evening, if I listened a little more to that part of me that is indifferent and says, "nah, don't really feel like it". (I go ahead anyway, partly out of habit, partly out of "testing" this, partly out of the AC trying to re-establish a foothold)
more power to you, girlfriends!
Mettaphorica

[Greg]

Any women hit the switch (with bac)?

I'm one of the idealistic silver bullet hopers, or was. After reading Dr Ameisen's positive experience with baclofen, I was hoping to have a similar experience, and at a much lower dose (by detoxing first). I'm now taking a more general look at my situation and not expecting the drug to be able to solve everything for me.

[beatle]

Any women hit the switch (with bac)?

Well, I'm not giving up on the goal of "indifference", but I'm now appreciating improvement and looking at reaching the goal as a gradual process.

[Mettaphorica]

Any women hit the switch (with bac)?

Hi Beatle

By all means, DON'T give up the goal of wanting to hit indifference! Where there's hope, there's action, where there's action, eventually there's a way out, over or through, one way or another. What I am trying to say is people should hold lightly to this goal--that is, give it a go, take the meds according to a good plan, note changes etc. If it works, fantastic! But, and Greg voiced it more succinctly than me, there's likely still stuff to be sorted through --like, the reasons you drink in the first place, how to cope with triggers and anxiety etc. All this stuff still needs to be worked on. It will likely manifest as some other addiction/destructive behaviour.
I am also saying is that if it doesn't work for someone, they should not blame themselves, and when entering into this treatment, be prepared to also work on yourself, and be prepared for the possibility that it may not work for you, or only partly work. We know now that it hasn't for everyone, and so entering into it with hopes is fine, entering into it as "it's this or die" cuts off any other avenues and kills hope/motivation should it not work.
I am glad it is working for you, as it is for me, somewhat.
Mettaphorica

[craving]

Any women hit the switch (with bac)?

Mettaphorica;808301 wrote:
If it works, fantastic! But, and Greg voiced it more succinctly than me, there's likely still stuff to be sorted through --like, the reasons you drink in the first place, how to cope with triggers and anxiety etc. All this stuff still needs to be worked on. It will likely manifest as some other addiction/destructive behaviour.
I am also saying is that if it doesn't work for someone, they should not blame themselves, and when entering into this treatment, be prepared to also work on yourself, and be prepared for the possibility that it may not work for you, or only partly work. We know now that it hasn't for everyone, and so entering into it with hopes is fine, entering into it as "it's this or die" cuts off any other avenues and kills hope/motivation should it not work.

It would be wonderful if everything was fixed with Baclofen. But Baclofen is "just" fixing the craving - you still have to change your routine by yourself, and fix the rest of the broken things in your life yourself.

I think the fix of the craving is more than anyone can wish for. I never experienced something similar to this. Expecting that ALL impact alcohol has caused to your life will be cured right away with taking a pill is insane! :H

Although Craving is gone, there are still so many other problems to be sorted out. But the no craving is a VERY good start, and I strongly think that this is the right thing to help getting back on track!

[beatle]

Any women hit the switch (with bac)?

Mettaphorica and craving, how right you are. I AM glad that it is working for me somewhat.

I AM changing my life. What more could I ask for?

I am in a down phase right now. But I'm not worried -- it will turn around soon.

I'm still having horrible anxiety and obsessive thoughts, but it's much more under control now.

I'll let you know when the switch happens!