My Baclofen Experience

[moglor]

My Baclofen Experience

Hi All,

Sorry for not updating more frequently. I've been busy with life in general, which is good! I'm now completely off of baclofen (for about 72 hours) and alcohol cravings have not returned. It's very strange though, once I titrated down to around 25mg/day, I started getting ferocious carb cravings. It's hard to tell if this is addiction/bac related, or a result of my low carb diet/weight loss. (I have lost 25lbs since starting Bac.)

I feed the carb craving with ice cream, which is not the best, but hey, it's not beer! I am going to look into more atkins-style solutions for carb cravings, though.

Since I stopped bac, I haven't had many noticeable effects. My muscles were a little stiff for a couple days, but also hard to tell if that was bac or gym related. Other than that, I'm feeling good. I'm still on the antidepressant, of course, and will continue to take that. I remain largely indifferent to alcohol, and can even be around it when others are drinking or at a bar without any serious problems.

Best,
Moglor

[Ne/Neva Eva]

My Baclofen Experience

bump

For one of the best stories out there! It's been a couple of weeks, Mog. Check in and tell us how well you're doing!

[moglor]

My Baclofen Experience

Thanks for the bump, NE! I'm glad people like my story. I thought maybe it ended there, but it doesn't! There's lots more, some good, some bad. If you are impatient like me, and you think this is too long, then take this one word to heart before you browse away from this post: Vigilance.

Since my last post on 15 Feb 2011, (has it only been 2 months?) I have, essentially, returned to my previous lifestyle. Yes, I am drinking again, heavily. Granted, it's not as bad as it was before I started Bac originally, but it's only a matter of time. I am gaining weight, I look ill, I am bloated, my blood pressure has skyrocketed. My stomach is a mess, and I completely identify with Cinders in her post that I recently replied to.

So there's two real questions to be addressed here.

1) Why did I return to my original pattern?

2) When will I return to Baclofen?

The second question is much easier to answer. I am already back on baclofen. As soon as I realized I was off the rails, I restarted bac at 25-50mg/day. I just placed an order for another 4 months worth, and as soon as it arrives, I will ramp back up. The only reason I don't now is that I am unsure of the delivery time from Goldpharma these days.

I am confident that I will regain sobriety with Baclofen.

The answer to #1 is much, much harder to identify. I had a discussion here with Sunny once about the reasons for drinking, and she said the drinking for her was self-sustaining. I.e. she drank because alcohol made her want to drink. In my case, and I suspect a similar case for most people here, alcohol is an escape.

I drink to forget.

I drink to forget the fact that I'm horrendously in debt. I drink to forget that I can count the number of friends I have on one hand. I drink to forget the fact that I haven't dated since 2005, and that I haven't had a meaningful relationship since 1994, unsurprisingly, due to the fact that I drink. I drink to forget that I ruined said meaningful relationship in 1994, and screwed the pooch on the one chance I had at happiness because of alcohol. I drink because I go to work every day to a job I hate that bores me to tears to pay an insane upside down mortgage on a house I hate living in. I drink because my favorite cat is very old and has cancer. I drink because it makes playing video games more entertaining. I drink because I am fat and bald. I drink because I talked to a young woman who I thought was interested in me, but wasn't. I drink because my car needs repairs. I drink because I have to visit my parents and somehow hide the fact that I'm a drunk. I drink because my roof leaks. I drink because I don't want to go to the gym. I drink because I'm on medication for depression. I drink because I live a charmed life in one of the world's richest countries, and I am unhappy.

I drink because it's easier to be drunk than to deal with what goes on in my head.

Honestly, MWO people, I'm not sure where this leaves me. Sobriety is still my goal, but I have a really hard time coping with everything. Maybe therapy would help? Has anyone had any success or positive things to say about it?

-Moglor

[bleep]

My Baclofen Experience

That's quite a post Moglor. Your stories was one of the first I read on MWO, and was one of the ones that confirmed in my head that baclofen was the way to go, so I thank you for that. You are in no small way responsible for some of the joy I am finding in life as a result of baclofen, so I hope you can take some solace from that.

I don't think our stories are ever finished, so I'm grateful you have come back to make this post. I too struggle with post-indifference, although I don't have your worries to compound issues. Another member, Lowcountryman, also recently went off baclofen and craving returned. His story ended happily, after he resumed taking it immediately, as I'm sure yours will.

So, as you know, sobriety is yours for the taking. Your other woes are much easier tackled sober, but again, I'm sure you know this. At this point why not try therapy? It can't hurt. I have precious little experience with it, other than to say I think the right therapist is crucial. The wrong person will be worse than useless.

Good luck in your ongoing quest Moglor, I wish I could offer you the same sort of guidance you inadvertently offered me.

[Murphyx]

My Baclofen Experience

Hi Moglor, I'm sorry to hear of this, but as you know your switch dose is waiting for you, so no permanent damage done.

Can I ask why did you decide to stop baclofen altogether? Was your decision prompted by some evidence, experiences of another member or an experiment?

[Ne/Neva Eva]

My Baclofen Experience

Hi, Mog.
Well that's just awful. All of it! I'm sorry.

I TOTALLY get it, though. In so many ways I think that new found sobriety is harder than just about anything. At least for me, when I've done it before.

It is so much easier to ignore things that weigh me down when I'm drunk. They still weigh on me, but who cares?!

The roof may be caving in, my friend, but it's repairable. Or you can walk away from it. And the house and the job. All those things are simply circumstances.

I say that not to be trite. The Ne household has been facing some mighty drastic changes and I was a little frantic about coming up with solutions to maintain our lifestyle in a place I don't like, in an apartment that drives me crazy, without any job prospects, and a fair amount of debt. Then I realized that change, even bankruptcy, might be preferable to how we're living now.

I know for sure that I couldn't have dealt with all of the dramatic changes that were beyond our control if I was still drinking. I wouldn't have. I'm glad I'm facing them and dealing with them. Though it's very disconcerting.

I know that you've struggled with depression and that it returned when you tapered down. Bac definitely has antidepressant qualities for me, and I'm reluctant to go down for that reason alone! With each step down I notice a little bit of that mind-chatter that undermines my sense of well being and purpose. ("I suck! I can't do it! I've screwed this up every time I've tried it!" sort of thing. pfffft. Who has time for that nonsense?)

With some bac and some sobriety the clouds will part, Mog. They did for me. In a glorious, though very mundane, way.

Glad your bac. Glad you posted. Looking forward to hearing more...
:ls and :h
Ne

[Ne/Neva Eva]

My Baclofen Experience

Have you tried to find a doc for the bac? I can't remember where you are, but the list has been growing and I have some other resources... I think it may help. But, ftr, I can't find one in my ass-backwards part of the country!
Still, I'll help you find one if I can and if you want...

[phoenix11]

My Baclofen Experience

Problems getting Baclofen - can anyone help?

Hi everyone, I'm new to this forum and would like to start off by wishing everyone the best on your journey. I started drinking in my early teens and the last 20+ years have been full of the madness, sadness, loss and desperation you all know about. I recently read Dr Ameisen's book and this lead me to lots of stuff online including this site. I live in the UK and armed with info went to see my GP, but he said he could not prescribe Baclofen unless it was recommended by a specialist. I arranged to see a psychiatrist privately last week - he specialises in alcoholism/addiction and my doctor gave me a letter to take along. The consultant gave me a prescription for a week's supply of Baclofen and said he would write to my doctor. I've seen my doctor today, but to my amazement he said he would not prescribe Baclofen because it's not licensed. I said "but you've got the report from a specialist". He muttered something about it being "a long letter" which made me think he hasn't even read it.
I was so disappointed, but my doctor seemed pretty final about his position. I've had a good relationship with him over the years and don't want to spoil that. Does anyone know if legally there's any way I can insist my doctor prescribes Baclofen, I don't know where to go with this. I'm reluctant to use online pharmacies because of concerns about purity. I feel so down - I'm doing everything I can to get well, doctors are allowed to prescribe off-label, I've got a specialist's recommendations - I don't understand why the system is closing the door on me. I'd appreciate any advice anyone can offer.

[bleep]

My Baclofen Experience

Hi Phoenix, and welcome,

Your frustrations with doctors is by no means unheard of, several of us have had the same rejections. There are a couple of ways around it. You could try find another GP, one who is more open to the idea, although I gather in the UK that is not a simple thing. There are several articles you can print out to take to your GP, but if he thought a letter from a specialist was "long" it doesn't sound like he will read them.

I wouldn't be too concerned about purity from online pharmacies. Some are dubious, but several members have found success using this method, and will be able to guide you accordingly.

The first step, of discovering this method, was for me the hardest. The rest will fall into line if you give it your best shot.

Should you want to print off some information for your doctor, a lot of it can be found here:

https://www.mywayout.org/community/f2...en+information

Best of luck.

[Murphyx]

My Baclofen Experience

Hi Phoenix.

GPs in the UK are very reluctant to prescribe off-label. And this statement from the MHRA (Medicines Healthcare products Regulatory Agency) explains why:
"Doctors can prescribe Baclofen to treat alcoholism; they don’t need approval, but if any problems with patients that arise, the doctors would be liable.”
So, first of all the doctor would need to do a huge amount of research to satisfy themselves of the efficacy and safety of baclofen, and that would be quite difficult considering the paucity of high dose baclofen research, and then they need to consider the liability question. Could they get their insurance companies on board? Would they even bother?

Any chance of the psychiatrist continuing to prescribe? Was he amenable to the idea of high dose baclofen?

If that doesn't work out then why not try the online route? It's what I did and so have hundreds of others. It's not ideal, but if there's no alternative, what can you do?

There are a number of online pharmacies used by people here. Personally I use 4rx and I've never had any problems with either delivery to the UK or quality of the pills.

EDIT: Are you on any other medication at the moment? If you are, it would be a good idea to confirm they can be taken with baclofen.

[redhead77]

My Baclofen Experience

Ne/Neva Eva;1096739 wrote:


The roof may be caving in, my friend, but it's repairable. Or you can walk away from it. And the house and the job. All those things are simply circumstances.

I say that not to be trite. The Ne household has been facing some mighty drastic changes and I was a little frantic about coming up with solutions to maintain our lifestyle in a place I don't like, in an apartment that drives me crazy, without any job prospects, and a fair amount of debt. Then I realized that change, even bankruptcy, might be preferable to how we're living now.

You, me, Ne, and probably at least half of America, are in this situation right now. With either a house underwater, that we can't sell, or debt, or both. Oftentimes, the debt is directly related to the house, that we can't afford the payments on, due to life circumstance such as job loss, job change, or divorce.

I remember when I got my first mortgage. I was trying to figure out how much house to buy. The realtor told me something that I will never forget. "You should own your house, your house shouldn't own you." I think of it often, with the very drastic things I've decided to do. I never in a million years thought I would be the one to walk away from a financial obligation. When I went to try to sell it, it turns out I had to bring 80K to the table. I don't have 80K, I am trying to collect child support to buy diapers.

And, I will not live a lie anymore, in any part of my life. Lies that rob me of my true potential, steal away my soul. Excuses for me to continue the life of an alcoholic. How can I not drink when I have so much stress?

Credit is just a number, used by our government for control. I know, your thinking, tell that to the car dealer when you go to purchase your next vehicle. My answer is, don't buy a new car. Buy a used one that you have saved cash for. The cash that you are now saving, because you have ditched all the other bullshit, and high interest whatevers. That's how I want to live anyway. If I don't have the cash to pay for it, I don't purchase it. Period.

I am not telling you, to just up and walk away from it all. These are huge decisions with lasting repercussions. Maybe your house isn't that far underwater, and it will come back when the market does. What I am asking, is how important is that house going to be, when the coroner zips you bloated body into the body bag, and removes you from it? These are all just material things.


I was thinking about you recently. You were on your way out the door as I was entering. I remember reading one of your last posts about titrating off bac completely. I gotta tell you, I was alarmed. I was just thinking, I wonder how that guy is doing. The one we haven't heard from in a while. Have we not heard from him because he is doing so well? I guess not. At least baclofen can be done more than once.

I'm glad your going to again take the pills. Therapy? I don't know. I've had hours of it, and it didn't help me with my drinking problem. What I did bounce off my therapist, is my decision to do all of these dramatic things to free myself. He said, are you asking me to give you advice here? He doesn't like to do that. I said, yes, this time I am. He said, RUN. Get out. You have a new life waiting, and all this can be fixed.

Good luck Moglor. You have a plate full of bullshit. Just remember to keep your eyes on the goal. None of the rest matters, if you lose your health. For that matter, you won't be in that house, anyway. And no chick is ever going to want to date you!

[phoenix11]

My Baclofen Experience

Hi bleep

thanks so much for this. I didn't know where to start on this forum so just typed in baclofen and reached out and I appreciate the feedback, I feel this is a good place, just looking around there seems to be so much support here. My addiction has isolated me so much I've almost come to expect rejection. It took me a while to take the first step of looking to get baclofen, reading Dr Ameisen's book was where the change really started, I tend to be quite skeptical but his account of his experience truly moved me, I sensed here is someone who's been through it and he's not trying to push anything just for personal gain. I hope I will find my way, I've been on balcofen for 7 days and sensed a difference right from the start. When I saw the psychiatrist I was withdrawing from alcohol and the librium my GP had given me wasn't doing anything, he told me to start the baclofen right away and that it would help and it did literally within the first day. The first night was a bit weird though, I had this nightmare about trying to reach my mum who was in distress and couldn't get to her and I literally couldn't move in my bed until gradually I became conscious and then I went right back to sleep and had the best sleep I've had in years! Unlike with other meds I didn't wake up feeling spaced out. And the dreams I'm having now are quite interesting, the one I had last night was actually quite funny I woke up laughing! I also feel calmer, which is saying a lot for someone who's been in the grip of anxiety and panic since my childhood. I'm quietly confident and hopeful!

best wishes

[bleep]

My Baclofen Experience

The dreams are indeed amazing. I had lucid dreams, waking dreams, the whole thing, and loved it all. What dose are you on? I would imagine still a very low one? There are a few things to watch out for, which we can go over. I'd prefer not to derail Moglor's thread though.

The best thing to do at this point, IMO, is to read some of the other threads, and perhaps start a thread of your own, where you can tell us how you are doing, and we can follow your progress.

[phoenix11]

My Baclofen Experience

Hi Murphyx

Thank you for getting back to me, I'm starting to feel part of this! My GP's response makes so much sense now in light of your quote from the medicines regulator. I remember when I first approached him about baclofen about a month ago, he mentioned "what if something happens" when he was saying why he wouldn't prescribe it off-label. Good news - I've contacted the psychiatrist and he said he will post another script so that's a welcome bridge for the time being. To be honest, when I saw him I was just glad to have found someone who would prescribe it so didn't really discuss high doses, but he started me off on 30mg/day and said to increase gradually to a max of 60mg. Also, I'm a bit scared of mentioning higher doses in case he thinks "oh no here's an addict asking for MORE!" - I know this is about me and the way I think others see me. But part of me is also uncertain about taking higher doses - strange don't you think for someone who's put so much poison down his neck without giving it a second thought! It would be interesting to hear about people's experiences with the switch and how they got there. He did say as well that it's important I do not run out of baclofen and since my GP won't prescribe to let him know before that happens and suggested I see him again in a couple of weeks. I'll raise the issue of higher doses then. But it's good to know that for the long term there's the option of getting it online hearing from someone first-hand that you've had success with that is reassuring especially given what you've told me it's unlikely my GP will budge. I'll need to clarify with the psych if he's prepared to support me long term, I'm so scared of asking too many questions in case I lose what I've got if that makes any sense. I think it's clear by now my self-esteem isn't doing too well. It's good to be on this site I believe it will help me.

best wishes:new:

best wishes

[Murphyx]

My Baclofen Experience

Phoenix

Good news about your psychiatrist. If he hasn't yet heard of baclofen as a treatment for alcoholism, it sounds as though he might be happy to go along with it once he knows, so I would suggest you print off some of the stuff Bleep pointed you towards and maybe even take him a copy of OA's book.

As Bleep says, start a thread and tell us about yourself and your present dose etc. You'll get tons of people jumping in to offer advice. And read some of the threads from people who have through it. You'll have to do some digging to find them, 'cos there's a load of other stuff on this forum as well.

Keep us updated.:goodjob:

Murph