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    What to try first?

    Hi, this is very long, thanks if you read it.

    I'm posting here about my husband and I'm wondering what people would recommend for him. He's 33 has been drinking heavily since his teens. In the last 20 months or so he's acknowledged that his drinking is a problem. (With varying degrees of acceptance). 9 months ago he had acute liver and kidney failure, though this was more to do with prolonged paracetamol overdose than alcohol. (He spent a weekend very drunk and somehow convinced himself he had a broken rib, he kept taking painkillers then forgetting her had taken them and taking some more a few minutes later). His kidneys are now near normal and his liver Gamma GT is back to 90, down from 890.

    He has attended AA (which he hates), psychotherapy (he initially had a great psychologist but we've moved back to Ireland from London so can't see her anymore), attended a two week in-patient detox and tried CBT. He was on Campral for a few months which he found useless and is now on Effexor, 75MG a day. At the moment he is drinking 3-4 times a week, usually a 1/4 or 1/2 bottle of neat vodka on his way home from work.

    He is prone to crazy mood swings. He can be sitting having a chat one minute and then just freak out, storm out of the room, start yelling. Sometimes he seems to think we're in the middle of an argument when we are not. He is working really long hours at the moment, out of both job necessity and a desire to keep busy, and he isn't sleeping well so I think sometimes these "arguments" happen because he is half asleep and in a type of dream.

    If he can get sober forever then great, if he can find a way to be a genuine "social drinker" (which he says is what he'd honestly really like) that's fine too. I just wish there was a way that alcohol could become unimportant to him. There are other issues at play here too, I've read many theories that in a lot of cases problem drinking is a symptom as much as a cause and that may very well be the case here. He is now looking for a counsellor/psychiatrist who will help him deal with those issues rather than one focussed on alcohol abuse.

    We have talked about him trying either Naltrexone or Baclofen. Obviously with his past health problems neither may be possible and we'll find some doctor who we can consult about this. But from a mental health type of place what do people here think might be best? If he was going to try Naltrexone would he have to change the way he drinks in order for it to work? I'm not sure how well I could cope with him openly drinking at home a lot. (I can't quite describe the level of hell that my life has been for years with his drinking.) I've read a lot of stories on The Sinclair Method board and a lot of people describe keeping on drinking for ages and ages out of habit rather than desire. My husband has gotten out of the habit of drinking at home and I don't want to re-ignite that. He has some of the same worries though he hasn't read through the website. He says he has worked hard to stop drinking at home and doesn't want to restart.

    Would Baclofen be a better option in that case? It seems to me that how much he drinks has less efficacy in helping the Bac to work? So he could just continue on doing as he normally does with alcohol until the point when (if) he gets the urge to change due to the drugs? Though the side-effects sound more nasty (and the ED stuff would be especially unwelcome). And the thought of starting a drug that may well need to be for life is warying.

    #2
    What to try first?

    Hi Ally - firstly he is going to have to really want to stop for himself otherwise nothing will work. Alcohol has a nasty way of becoming the most important thing there is for us alcoholics.

    Hopefully someone who has used Bac can give you some advice. Can you try and get him to come on here and chat to a few of us?
    It's time I put my big girl pants on. :grannypants: I hope they fit.

    Comment


      #3
      What to try first?

      "He is now looking for a counsellor/psychiatrist who will help him deal with those issues rather than one focussed on alcohol abuse."
      This is a very good idea....
      When you said "mood swings", I thought...Bi-Polar.
      Has any doc addressed this?
      There's a lot of information here .
      Welcome to MWO Ally.
      Don't forget to take care of yourself too!
      xoxo
      Belle
      "Be still and know that I am God"

      Psalm 46:10

      Comment


        #4
        What to try first?

        First and foremost he needs to be more involved. If he actually wants to drink less then he needs to figure out how to do it. He needs to be involved in what choice to make.

        I use both TSM and baclofen. I drink whenever I want to which ends up being a couple to a few drinks a month nowadays. TSM and naltrexone stress the liver and baclofen stresses the kidneys.

        Tylenol (paracetamol/acetaminophen) stresses the liver much more than anything I think.

        What you've heard regarding naltrexone sounds accurate to me.

        A couple of the things you've heard regarding baclofen are just some people's personal opinion:

        1: Baclofen took me from drinking 80-100 drinks a week down to less than 10 (edit: actually now more like 0) and I always drank as much as I wanted to. I didn't attempt to become abstinent or even drink less at all and for me it worked faster than what most here experience. When you hear someone say you need to drink less or become abstinent for it to work, that may very well be the case...for them.


        2: There is nothing wrong with my libido or "functioning" at all. Many people respond to medications that way.

        If you and him need this to stop soon I'd seriously consider baclofen, but again he needs to make that decision.
        :nutso: I take pride in my humility :nutso:
        :what?:
        sigpic
        Graph of My Drinking From July '09 to January '10

        Consolidated Baclofen Information Thread




        Baclofen for Alcoholism and Other Addictions
        A Forum
        Trolls need not apply

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          #5
          What to try first?

          Ally,
          I can't add much to Loop's advice but I wanted to congratulate you on your involvement. Yes, he needs to partake but having someone like you by his side will make it so much easier for him.
          Also, keep in mind that TSM is to take it only when you're drinking. That choice can be away from home or you.
          I have a feeling that you guys will work it out together!
          HS

          Comment


            #6
            What to try first?

            Baclofen worked and worked very quickly for me. I have been abstinent on it for 8 months. IMO there needs to be a decision on HIS part to commit to a specific plan. You can support his choice or not.
            I tried all those things too and failed until baclofen so there is hope.
            The reason for relapse is craving followed by drinking. There are often other issues but I contend that he will make little progress until/unless he stops being alcohol dependent. Use of alcohol promotes dependence in those so prone. This is why I favor abstinence for myself and would advise it for others.
            Depression is often a co morbidity and studies show that treating is along with the alcohol dependence improves the outcomes of each problem.
            The baclofen is mostly excreted through the kidneys. Just a small amount through the liver. He would likely need careful monitoring under the care of a doctor who knew what he was on.
            Welcome and best of luck.
            Steer him to this website and see if it appeals to him
            Sunny

            Comment


              #7
              What to try first?

              First off thanks for all the replies. I know I can't do this for my husband but he's my husband - we're a team and I can help him with the research. When I say he's busy with work I'm talking 13-16 hour days, 6-7 days a week right now. He doesn't have time to do the research himself and I do. Once he has a couple of days off I'll tell him what I've found out and point him in the direction of whatever books/websites are most helpful/relevant.

              He'll make his own decisions on what he'll do, it's up to him. At the end of the day I could decide what I want him to do, order the pills and give them to him but if he doesn't want them he won't take them. And if he wants to keep drinking himself into oblivion he will.

              From how he's been for the last while I think that getting help for the underlying issues is the most important thing on his road to recovery. But if there is something that can maybe help him stop drinking and help with his anxiety issues while he works on that then it's worth researching.

              Comment


                #8
                What to try first?

                Hi Ally,

                I can't speak for any other meds but NAL can have adverse effects on the liver and a Dr. will usually/should run a "liver panel" to ensure the liver is healthy enough before prescribing it.

                I've been perusing the internet and looking through my copy of the Merck Manual 18th Edition and I'm not too convinced GGT by itself tells a lot other than to throw a flag that something may be wrong and dig deeper. I have my detailed blood work in front of me, one from the ER and one from my MD who I thought ordered every test known to science and on neither report do I find GGT levels. From what I gather, ALT, AST, ALP and bilirubin taken in combination are what they've looked at when determining whether I had any liver issues (along with an ultrasound).

                Very cool web site that details blood tests:

                GGT: The Test

                I do agree with the others - he has to want to do something about his alcohol issues otherwise nothing will work.

                RV
                Dean Wormer to Bluto (John Belushi) from the movie Animal House: "Fat, drunk, and stupid is no way to go through life son."

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