Booktree on Baclofen

[Booktree]

My Experience so far with Baclofen

1.26.11 ? Thursday

8:30am -- Took 5 mg. This was my first dose ever. Didn?t feel anything.

12:00pm -- 5mg. Felt a bit of somnolence for a few hours afterwards and also a very tiny, subtle relaxed feeling. Or was I just imagining it?

5:30pm -- 5mg. Felt nothing.

Cravings to drink or do drugs are very strong this evening, but I did neither.

Total = 15mg

Note: For the first time in over 20 years, I actually slept through almost the entire night (7 hours straight) without waking up.


1.27.11 ? Friday

8:00am ? 5mg.
9:00am ? 5mg.
2:00pm ? 5mg.
3:00pm ? 5mg.
6:00pm ? 10mg. Still feeling nothing at all. Just incredibly hungry and thirsty. (Ate about 5 times today?)
9:00pm ? 10mg. Still feeling absolutely nothing at all. WTF???

Cravings for alcohol and/or drugs are incredibly powerful this evening. But I somehow managed to remain abstinent.

Once again, my ability to sleep almost through the whole night was amazing. I did wake up after the first two hours due to having to use the bathroom, and I recall a bizarre dream and the feeling (in the dream) that I was stoned out of my mind, almost to the level of being paralyzed and nauseous, from the Bac.

Total = 40mg


1.28.11 ? Saturday

8:00am ? 10mg. Appetite is outrageous. I was starving about an hour after waking up, which is unheard-of for me.

12:00pm ? 10mg. Ate again at noon. Huge appetite, and feeling absolutely no other effects from the Baclofen. A couple of hours later I felt a tiny, very subtle feeling of relaxation and spaciness that was quite nice.

3:00pm ? 10mg. Felt nothing.

6:30pm ? 10mg. Still feeling nothing. Still have out-of-control appetite. If this keeps up, I?m not going to be able to keep taking Baclofen. I?m going to be grossly overweight in no time at this rate. AND I am having way worse cravings than before I started taking it. I?m starting to feel bummed out.

8:20pm ? The cravings are INSANE tonight. I haven?t had cravings this bad in such a long time, I hadn?t even remembered what they were like. I want so badly to drive down the street to the liquor store, I can hardly stand it. I don?t know what?s holding me back, other than I am afraid to drink while taking Baclofen, because I don?t know what the side effects will be like.

Total = 40mg

Perhaps I shouldn?t add this to the post... I hope this is not TMI, but I am really upset right now and need a bit of support/advice/help/feedback, or something?

Just got off the phone with my ex-girlfriend (she is also a recovering alcoholic; uses AA to stay sober). I was telling her about how low I?ve been feeling, that I isolated all day, that my best friend (who is also a recovering addict) never called me back today and I?m worried about him due to his outing to a casino last night with his new gf who is a cocaine user, that the Baclofen doesn?t seem to be doing anything for me except increasing my cravings and appetite, and finally, I came out and confessed to her that I am still in love with her and can?t get past it. Her response to that confession, as I was crying, was to say that perhaps we just shouldn?t talk at all, that the only thing I need to be focusing on right now is my sobriety, and that she is NEVER going back there with me--she has made a decision, and we will never, ever be more than friends again in this lifetime. She was emphatic about that. She couldn?t have made it clearer. She said that at any rate I am not ready for a relationship and that I need to stop looking outside myself for things or people to make me feel better.

She then proceeded to yell at me for over a half an hour about how I?m not working the program, am not taking it seriously, just want a little pill to take away all of my problems, that my spiritual life is for shit, that I?m self-pitying (about having been adopted and having had an addict/alcoholic birth mother), need to grow up, need to make a decision once and for all to just not drink or do drugs, need to go to meetings way more often, even if I?m tired after work (that?s no excuse), need to call my sponsor and others in the program more, and that the only reason I stayed clean for the 7 months in rehab was because stuff wasn?t available to me there, etc. Damn, she was just flat-out brutally harsh with me. It hurt really bad to hear all that, especially coming from her. I know that what she said was mostly true, but I had just made myself totally vulnerable to her, and that was her response. It just felt so cold-hearted to hear all that (in the form of yelling) from someone you?re in love with. I kept saying ?I know, I know? to what she was saying, but then she would just respond ?I know you know all this, but it?s not about knowing, it?s about doing? when are you going to start actually acting on what you know??

Sorry for the sob story. But it just made me second-guess the whole Baclofen thing. Maybe I am just looking for an easy way out?

I was on the verge of driving to the liquor store when she called, so I am actually grateful that she did call. And now the liquor stores are closed, so I must go to bed sober.

Good night, all, and thanks for reading.

[Lo0p]

Booktree on Baclofen

I want you to know that I read your story and I am thinking about you. You have made a good decision coming here, don't stray too far from us, you are on the right path. I'm at work right now and on my android so I can't really respond but others will come.

It's not your fault. You have a disease. It's not your fault. Stick around, we'll talk more soon.

[Bill Gorton]

Booktree on Baclofen

Book, all I can say is, I'm sorry you had to go through that. My ex is a child of alcoholics and an ex-addict herself, and she could get on her high horse about my drinking. But not as bad as what you just described. Damn! That was harsh! Just keep in mind that some of what she hurls at you is actually meant for someone else (her father, her mother, herself?) Just keep that in mind.

Are you here to help you or her? Baclofen has worked for a lot of people here. You've only taken it for a couple of days. Why not give it a proper trial? You owe it to yourself.

[tiptronic_ct]

Booktree on Baclofen

Welcome to MWO, Booktree :welcome:

You seem to be caught in the middle of an old "ideological" battle around how alcoholism is defined. Is it a weakness of spirit & character? Or is it a disease? I'm with Lo0p on that score: it is a disease just like high blood pressure or diabetes.

Secondly: if anyone thinks that taking baclofen promises an easy ride by taking a little pill, they are sadly mistaken. The whole argument around baclofen being the "easy way out" pisses me off, actually. Big time. If alcoholics can find freedom from addiction through medication, why the hell not? Life is bloody well tough enough as it is: why make it deliberately difficult and end up with the incredibly high relapse rates we see in traditional rehab facilities, 12-step programmes and the like? All we do is set people up for failure.

OK - let me get off my soapbox for a while...

Let's try and be practical here:

The baclofen is not going to work overnight - you haven't been on it long enough to expect any significant effect on cravings for AL yet. Have you read up about titration schedules and the like? Are you self-medicating or are you under medical supervision? What are your personal circumstances: will you be able to titrate faster than normal, or do things like your work schedule dictate that you have to take it easy in case SEs like somnolence are bad?

Also have a look at the Toolbox Thread in the Monthly Abstinence forum - some great ideas there to help you come up with a plan for every day.

Borrowing from traditional approaches: be on the lookout for HALT (hunger, anger, loneliness, tiredness) situations. Your conversation with your GF and the way it left you feeling is a classic example of how it can bring you to the brink.

Look into supplements to assist you along the way: L-Glutamine in particular might help you lots from the little information that you've posted: it helps with cravings and also assists in evening out your blood sugar levels to help control hunger. Side note: wouldn't you rather gain a few pounds during this process than remain stuck where you are? Just sayin'... Buy the powder form (not capsules) and take up to 24 000mg per day (in split doses). When cravings hit especailly badly, put a little under your tongue and just let it dissolve slowly.

Participate on these boards, post about your experiences and do a lot of reading. YOu're sure to get lots of support along the way.

I wish you the best of luck!

[gratitude]

Booktree on Baclofen

book,
thanks for sharing all that. I agree with loop. you're in a good place here. keep coming back. don't forget in the big book it says " science might one day cure this but... it hasn't done so yet. that was written what1935? bill Wilson also tried many methods and was very open about alternative methods, just google his name and do some research. this is a craving of the body and an obsession of the mind according to AA. why not just relax, take your time, and give BAC more than a couple days? you can always go to AA as well. use all the tools available. hope to see you post more. I'm interested in how you do. you are one of the courageous ones trying this method. gratitude.:goodjob:

[bleep]

Booktree on Baclofen

Hi Book,

A bit of a down way to start and I wish I could say it only gets better, but as Tip says, this isn't the easy way out. It most definitely is a way out though. Don't expect a miracle on day three, that impatience is showing again! Lucky you didn't have to wait for the pills to arrive!

If you can overcome this and pull through it, you should be able to complete the journey no matter what happens. Take a breath, sit back, treat it like a logic puzzle. What's the most rational way to approach this? Surely it involves the pills, one of the only methods shown to have any success. It is very rough when you are hoping for a particular response, and get thrown a 180, but life goes on.

Our thoughts are with you. It's encouraging that you are not experiencing any bad SE's. Having an extra meal in the grand scheme of things is hardly unpleasant. I had something similar, it passed in a week or so. My tastebuds changed, so I ended up having a salad for the first time in my life as my extra meal. Now thats a bummer.

Good luck Book.

[Booktree]

Booktree on Baclofen

Thank you SO much for the replies, the support, and the good ideas. You all are so kind to take the time to reply to my post. I do so much enjoy coming here to read about others' experiences with the meds and the struggles, and I have already learned a ton of useful information. And it does help to feel a part of the community by actively participating.

I totally agree with you, Tiptronic, about the Baclofen NOT being an easy way out. I am firmly on the side of the debate that considers addiction a physiological disease, not a moral failing. I really can't tolerate the Puritanical view of alcoholism/addiction as a weakness of will and that we all need to just pull ourselves up by our bootstraps and white-knuckle through the whole damn thing... because clearly, millions of people around the world die every year from just that approach. No, and I also know that even if Baclofen does work, it still takes a firm determination to stop drinking/using and the use of other coping mechanisms to make life manageable.

Thanks for the L-Glut suggestions--I am definitely going to try that. I hadn't heard about the powder form.

I do have a script from my psychiatrist, but he is only allowing me to go up to a max of 80mg per day. And he only wanted me on 15mg per day for the first week... I have read up on the titration schedules, and am planning on taking it more slowly after this. And yes, my work demands that I not risk it in terms of SEs like somnolence during the day. So I will have to be careful to mainly just titrate up on the weekends.

Gratitude, Bill, and Loop -- thanks so much for the votes of confidence on this! I know I've been impatient here, and I do need to just relax and see how it goes. I'm not currently drinking. The last time I drank was Thursday the week before last (the 20th), and before that I had not had a drink in 9 months. (This abstinence was made easier due to being in treatment...)

Bleep, so true-- I am fortunate the pills came when they did. I like your suggestion of treating this like a logic puzzle. I love puzzles. Generally I much prefer reason over emotion. (The only one who can really get me emotional at all is my ex, in fact...)

Anyway, thanks again, you all, for responding! Hopefully tomorrow will be a better day.

:thanks:

[bleep]

Booktree on Baclofen

From all reports, and certainly my personal experience, not drinking only helps the process.

In all liklelyhood, you will need to exceed 80mg's per day, so you need to start thinking about that, and how to get around it. My doctor, to his everlasting credit, just sort of closed his eyes and wrote the script.

Brace yourself for becoming more emotional, in a good way. It certainly happened to me.

[beatle]

Booktree on Baclofen

Hello and welcome, Booktree,

The more you read here, the better. There are so many people with so many different experiences. I think most of the ones who gave up on baclofen were the ones who couldn't handle the side effects (or decided the side effects of other methods were more tolerable). Many people, not just the AA 12-step-indoctrinated, believe sobriety is, and always will be, a daily effort, a complete commitment, even if (even though) it takes all your energy to focus on just not drinking. Many people believe the disease and the struggle will be with you for the rest of your life, so you should just accept that and learn to live with it.

Baclofen is not and will never be an "easy way out". And it also takes extreme commitment. Commitment to the belief that you don't have to spend the rest of your life suffering from, and battling, your disease. It's not just a commitment to getting/staying sober, it's a commitment to a concept -- that alcoholism is not a mental disease, and it is curable.

There is a "cure", yes -- that's what Dr. L. and Dr. O say. I have yet to have hit the switch (indifference to alcohol), but the doctors, and mostly the people here, assure me it is real -- it is not just "help" and you have to do the rest (as far as alcohol is concerned), they say. But even before the switch (Dr. L calls it the "Golden Point" or "Golden Moment"), many people find a good deal of relief with bac, and even without reaching a real switch, they can manage their drinking much better.

Of course, you will have to sort out your own life after you are disease-free, but in my experience, sorting out your life is impossible to do while drunk. Or whilst using all your energy to stay sober.

As for L-glut and other nutritional healing aids (and other holistic aids), please look through the Holistic Healing forum. There is so much good information there.

Here is a thread about L-glutamine with tmgi on l-glut.

https://www.mywayout.org/community/f6...ine-37269.html

My advice is to take 5-6 grams of the powder mixed in water 3xday (total 15-18mg -- can go a little higher) between meals (might be hard for you! It's hard for me too, since I am a grazer), together with other amino acids (free form amino complex, taurine, etc) + a little vits b and c (or glass of juice).

This doesn't seem to do anything for my cravings, but I heard it's great for your body. Helps you absorb nutrition better, evens moods, etc etc etc.

[Lowcountryman]

Booktree on Baclofen

Book,

G-F's come and go. There's gonna be other G-F's. That has never changed in the whole history of mankind. And then another one is going to be 'the one'. Be thankfull that's she clear at least.

Bac to the Bac:
If you can manage the SE's, it's the easy way out. IMhO it's also the only way out. It's so fckn obvious that a 'will' is created in the brains. All the things you want/need/crave, all the muscles you use, they all come down to activities of the brain. You can try hard to 'change' your will, but the sobriety you get from that is based on the wrong fundaments. Like a concrete building on drifting sand. You have to build on solid ground. That means: fix the brain first, and then work on the things you want or don't want in your life.

Nothing wrong with using all the tools you can get. But in the end, you have to take the pills and work the land on which you intend to grow something.

First 100 mg/d, don't expect too much. It takes time.

Low

[Booktree]

Booktree on Baclofen

Cool, thank you for the additional responses. I am going to go over to the Holistic threads and read up more on L-Glut and other supplements. That will be one of my projects for today.

Beatle, thank you--I am prepared for the daily struggle (I am a fighter), if that's what it turns out to be. I will likely ramp up my AA/NA meetings this coming week and all the other daily tools that the program suggests. I know they have helped in the past, at least somewhat.

Low, so true about the gfs--! Sometimes it's easy to lose sight of that in the midst of things. I like the metaphor about "working the land" (i.e., the brain) in order to grow anything on it.... couldn't agree more!

Thanks again.

Booktree

[gratitude]

Booktree on Baclofen

book,
you seemed to have settled down a bit. I'm glad you are going to give the BAC a go.
please keep posting your experiences. I'm really interested in your progress. sorry to piggyback on your experiment but I am unable to take BAC at the moment.
man, I love this forum.:thanks:

[Booktree]

Booktree on Baclofen

Thanks Gratitude! I hope you can eventually try out the Bac. Will you be able to at some point? Here is today's update:

1.30.11 – Sunday

9:00am – 10mg (I decided to switch to the Novartis brand, which I obtained from GoldPharma--formerly I was taking the Qualitest Pharmaceuticals brand, from CVS). I seem to be a little less hungry this morning. Actually made it to 10:30 without eating anything.

1:00pm – 10mg. Appetite is noticeably less today, thank goodness. I can also definitely feel a substantial relaxation effect--this was most evident when I got out of the house and went to an NA meeting at noon. Normally, I would be very tense, bored, stressed, and unable to concentrate at a meeting, due to social anxiety/shyness/insecurity, etc., but I actually enjoyed being there for the first time in my life--I could actually pay attention and absorb what people were saying, I actually felt some measure of empathy with others, I found what they were saying to be quite fascinating and very helpful, my brain felt clearer and more open, and I felt very relaxed and at peace. As a result, I feel like I benefited a thousand times more from the meeting than ever before.

5:00pm – 10mg. Still having an excellent day. Feel very calm and at peace.

9:00pm – 10 mg. I am happy to report that my appetite seems to have returned almost to normal. I am also delighted to report that my sociability was infinitely enhanced throughout the day. Perhaps due to the calming of underlying social anxiety, which usually makes me very withdrawn and not want to talk to people, I spent most of the day with a friend (which would normally totally wear me out), talked to my mother for an hour and a half on the phone (which would usually also exhaust and irritate me), talked to my brother on the phone (which I normally avoid like the plague), etc… and felt absolutely fine throughout it all.

I also experienced NO CRAVINGS today whatsoever.

Total = 40mg.

[Toro]

Booktree on Baclofen

Awesome, the anxiety thing was a major side bonus of bac for me as well. Combine that with the confidence you get feeling healthy and AL free and its a doulbe whammy.

[bleep]

Booktree on Baclofen

It seems you are responding well at low doses, good news.

I never even knew I felt anxious, until suddenly it was gone. The increased empathy is a definite plus, do you find yourself wondering who you can talk to next?