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    #46
    Baclofen Ladies!

    There is also a link between hypothyroidism and alcoholism. This is part of the endocrine system and the adrenal glands are part of that and the whole equation. Basically, there appears to be many strong links between these systems. all controlled by the brain.Yet another reason to believe there a physiological differences in how women and men respond to baclofen.

    (Although I never understood why/how this could be a matter of contention or difference in "opinion". As I pointed out in another post, it is a fact that women and men have different physiologies (this is the part where I threw in breasts and vaginas). I don't believe this is a matter of opinion. Nor is it a matter of opinion that different medications affect women and men differently... alcohol being one.)

    Here is a somewhat peripheral paper, addressing women alcoholics who had hypothyroidism response to detox, and beyond:

    THE OCCURRENCE AND TREATMENT OF HYPOTHYROIDISM AMONG ALCOHOLICS -- GOLDBERG 20 (4): 609 -- Journal of Clinical Endocrinology & Metabolism

    From this paper:

    "An interrelationship between alcoholism and thyroidal hypofunction is postulated and discussed; several cause-and-effect mechanisms are explored."

    I have heard from several doctors that thyroid problems, depression and alcoholism a closely linked. I'm not sure anyone knows why (exactly). But this mostly affects women. (I have also heard the figure 5%of women in the U.S. over 40 have hypothyroidism and 10% of the women of 50 have it. I apologize -- I don't have documentation for this, so it is just hearsay.)

    Here is quite an informative site:

    Hypothryroidism and Hyperthyroidism

    It explains about the thyroid system and its connection to the brain... and if you scroll down, this:

    "Alcohol or opiates can increase T3 levels in the body by preventing the breakdown of T3 in the brain, so in hypothyroidism alcohol can act as a mood elevator. Alcohol gives these patients a mood-elevator buzz. At the same time, alcohol is causing the liver to be stressed and toxic which disturbs the metabolism of all kinds of hormones over the long-term. By keeping the T3 levels high in the system this suppresses the Thyroid Hormone (TH) being released from the brain. One result of this is that the liver starts producing more cholesterol, fatty acids, and triglycerides. Alcohol also hurts the liver over time enough to prevent it from storing the fat-soluble vitamins such as Vitamin A. Because of this, Vitamin A (carotenoids) can build up in the body and shows up in the palms of the hands and soles of the feet as yellowing.
    So when you smoke and drink, you are really doing a double-whammy on your thyroid gland. It's so hard to quit because of the hormonal imbalances that these products cause. Some think that this is why smoking and alcohol are so addictive."


    Hypothyroidism is basically a "women's disease". So the above is how women react, not men.

    And look at this one from another forum:

    Hypothyroidism and Alcohol? : Thyroid Disease Forum : Active Low-Carber Forums

    ok, enough from me today
    Your time is limited, so don't waste it living someone else's life... And most important, have the courage to follow your heart and intuition. They somehow already know what you truly want to become. Everything else is secondary.

    Steve Jobs, Stanford Commencement Adress, 2005

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      #47
      Baclofen Ladies!

      Coal-
      I can't figure out the quiz thing and the link doesn't work. I didn't weigh in on the other thread because my experience is pretty much opposite yours! First drink in early teens and I was off and running!
      I can't identify *when* I became an alcoholic because I have ALWAYS had a dysfunctional relationship with AL. Always. No exaggeration. I drank for the purpose and with the result of getting very, very drunk and quickly.

      There are a lot of alcoholics and heavy drinkers on both sides of my family. More of them than there are of people with 'normal' reactions to AL. (mostly functioning and normal otherwise, ftr.) My heritage doesn't have any specific origin, as far as I can tell! Northern European, Mediterranean... But really, who can tell? Very American in that I'm a mixed breed!

      beatle-thanks for the ongoing contribution toward a better understanding of this! It's a rather exhausting line of thought, though, isn't it???

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        #48
        Baclofen Ladies!

        Since I lost an hour's post about meditation/brain function/change of brain structure, I'll just pop in here with a teeny-tiny bit of scientifically based information about the amygdala and the limbic system. The limbic system is the "mid-brain." Things that happen there are below the level of our conscious thought, but are the primary drivers of what we DO, instead of what we say or think we want to do. Ever noticed that . . . "I'm going to blah, blah, blah, but instead I do something even more stupid?" The decision is made before we actually get to think about it!

        The amygdala (actually there are two of them, one on each side of the brain) receive information through the central nervous system and for some god-only-knows evolutionary reason have been given the ability to evaluate that information as "good," "bad," or "neutral." Then, still hidden in the middle of the brain, waaaayy before it gets to conscious awareness, the evaluations of the amygdala tell the brain what neuro-chemicals to transmit through the entire body. Those neuro-chemicals cascade through the body in nano-seconds. Then, because we're "feeling" a certain way based on those neuro-chemicals, we act, or more aptly, re-act, to the sensations originated by the amygdala's evaluation of good, bad, or neutral.

        Well, that worked to keep the human species flourishing for millenium. Unfortunately, the same mechanisms are about to bring an end of the species because it is driven by kill-or-be-killed, power-over, survival. We no longer face extinction when something/someone new enters our universe. But the amygdala hasn't figured that out yet. We still get the same cascades of neuro-chemicals, but there's no appropriate venue to let them express, so instead we get anxiety, PTSD, OCD, and a host of other diagnoses all related to the amygdala's determination of "bad, I must fight or flee, or freeze, because if he thinks I'm dead he won't kill me (depression)." Or sometimes, even though it has been scientifically demonstrated that the amygdala is primed to go negative, we feel sensations of "good, I must have that, and more of that and more of that." All based on the physical sensations we feel prior to having any conscious awareness of what's going on. THAT is what the amygdala does and I have lists and lists of studies that have been done on it's role in all kinds of psychopathology. I use that term in respect to Ig's thread about the psychosomatic effects of baclofen. The whole idea of a mind/body separation is actually dissolving even in places like the Mayo Clinic!

        And THAT is why I believe, as do Anon, Otter, and a few others, that baclofen has such enormous potential across a wide spectrum of issues. I haven't done my research to figure out how baclofen moderates the amygdala, but my own experience tells me that it does, and I'll get around to reading those papers someday. If you want a serious overload of research having to do with the amygdala (none about addiction), go to Richard J. Davidson, Ph.D., Lab Director Here's a guy who's been working with the Dalai Lama for 16-17 years with a total commitment to bring "mind training," meditation, into the scientific discourse. And he's doing it, along with the help of others, whose work is more appropriate for people wanting to explore meditation and about which I WILL post on my own thread, soon. I promise.

        Oh, and I am a bac lady. I'm 54, still having regular periods, found relief from alcohol the first day I took it - 10/10/10, have had periods of abstinence and periods of moderation. Having been freed from being an alcoholic from day 1, I'm still experimenting with finding an ultimate "switch." Or maybe it will just be a decision. The overdose didn't help anything. A week later I'm still dealing with some of that outfall.

        Whew. It's an exciting time and this is an exciting place to be. Thanks, y'all. That is all.
        "Wherever you are is the entry point." --Kabir

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          #49
          Baclofen Ladies!

          RedThread12;1086895 wrote: It's an exciting time and this is an exciting place to be.
          Yes, it IS an exciting time and place to be, oh my! (as Dorothy would say).

          Thank you So much for that, RedThread (does RT work ok?).

          I learned so much. And fascinating.

          I probably missed it somewhere (I can't be expected to follow all
          the posts on all
          threads, can I?), but how do you know all this? I mean enough to explain it in layman's language so well? I feel like nobody's ever done it that way before. At least not for me.

          Well, heaps of thank you's, however you came about your knowledge and your incredible ability to communicate what you know.
          Your time is limited, so don't waste it living someone else's life... And most important, have the courage to follow your heart and intuition. They somehow already know what you truly want to become. Everything else is secondary.

          Steve Jobs, Stanford Commencement Adress, 2005

          Comment


            #50
            Baclofen Ladies!

            Ne/Neva Eva;1086532 wrote:
            beatle-thanks for the ongoing contribution toward a better understanding of this! It's a rather exhausting line of thought, though, isn't it???
            You are one to talk, NE. How exhasuting are your lines of thoughts? :H
            Your time is limited, so don't waste it living someone else's life... And most important, have the courage to follow your heart and intuition. They somehow already know what you truly want to become. Everything else is secondary.

            Steve Jobs, Stanford Commencement Adress, 2005

            Comment


              #51
              Baclofen Ladies!

              Red, that was a great post, thanks! Shows nuclear weapons in a whole new light!

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                #52
                Baclofen Ladies!

                Red, great description, I haven't heard it put so succinctly before and then there's the y'alls in there to make it just "down home". I've heard this (greatly simplified) described as the "fight or flight" reactions taken out of their original "survivalist" environment. So I sit in front of my computer and get an email that blows a gasket in my brain and my body reacts further (brain awash with chemicals) - I feel like I'm threatened to the core! It's crazy ass shit.

                Found the "Unfortunately, the same mechanisms are about to bring an end of the species because it is driven by kill-or-be-killed, power-over, survival." telling as well as your "it has been scientifically demonstrated that the amygdala is primed to go negative" quote. Zowee.

                All this supports the idea of hypnosis and hypnotherapy reaching the limbic or subconscious, it seems. What do you know about that, Oh Feather of Knowledge?
                :l

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                  #53
                  Baclofen Ladies!

                  I ran across this info ages ago, a guy named T.Lingo ran this lab studying the amygdala for many years and say's that you can conciously click it forward to improve your mood and outlook. He has died but this guy neil slade was one of his students.

                  Neil Slade Amygdala Chart
                  What Is "Click Your Amygdala?" - Neil Slade's Amazing Brian Adventure

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