This Redhead's Baclofen Thread

[redhead77]

This Redhead's Baclofen Thread

Ne/Neva Eva;1085277 wrote: the new av is for you. (Have you read the Maguire version? Who's the evil one now? lol)

:H
Thanks for being my baclo-sis.
I haven't read it. I love Oz, so it may be something I'll try to read when I'm not on here all the time. .

EDIT: For the above post. Thanks for all the kind words and thoughts. I'm not going to address them because I'm done thinking about it and wasting my precious energy. I do appreciate you DG, Bruun, Neva, Pbar, and Bleepster.

Bruun, I love those white stips. I use them twice a year anyway. Maybe I'll buy some just to keep the pearlies okay until I'm over my smoking binge. :thanks:

I don't really have cadillac latrines bleep. I invested in some good toilets. The boys kept clogging my other ones. Just the boys of course.

I'm out of here for a few hours. I'm going to force myself to go to church today. Then lunch with a friend. I had to pop an xtra bac, just for church. Being so close to all those people, ya know? Plus, I think a lot of them are weirdos. But not me. :H

EDIT: You too CF. Thanks. We were cross posting. Okay, I really am outie.

[Ne/Neva Eva]

This Redhead's Baclofen Thread

RedH, re. the weird sleeping SE: I had delusional moments and hallucinations. Even now they're alarming. It's cold comfort to share them, honestly. But you're not alone. And many other people have reported something similar.

They didn't last for me. And I was VERY quickly able to disspell them when they did happen when I talked to myself about it. Literally, "Is that true? Did that happen? Am I dreaming still?"

Very important to think calmly about these things before reacting. (I emailed and texted and called people based on these "dreams" only to find out they had NO IDEA what I was referring to.) And you can always reach out here, and elsewhere, 24/7. Like having a sponsor. (lol, okay?)

That said, good on you for church. I'm going to an AA meeting in an hour, and baclo-sister, there aint enough bac to make me comfortable with that!
xo

[coalfire]

This Redhead's Baclofen Thread

Good luck Ne. Have I missed something or is this your first?

[TracyA]

This Redhead's Baclofen Thread

Red, good for you! The guys sounds like he has issues beyond what bac could fix anyway!

Sorry to hear about your rude awakenings. I'll bet that one is temporary though. FWIW, I went through a bout of that due solely to menopause - every single night, I would wake up convinced that there was someone in the house, full on panic attack. I haven't had the auditory hallucinations though. I hope they pass in hurry for you.

[Bruunhilde]

This Redhead's Baclofen Thread

Red, the one thing I've seen posted on MWO again and again and elsewhere, and that I know for myself as well, is that you have to WANT to get sober. Seems some people can go through all sorts of life-altering AL-inspired destruction (outside of what they're doing to themselves) and not really think they would want to live without AL. Alot of people on this forum want to moderate, for example, and I admit I would too. Maybe someday I will be able to but I'm afraid I'll only mod in social situations where it's expected, or binge on a bottle of wine at home now and then. However, that's a vast improvement over DUI's and killing innocent people and jail. We all have to be beaten up just the way we personally need, in order to change. Seems harder to be convinced for the young, after all, look at our ages. Coal's nephew is a prime example.

I hope your SE goes away soon, are you going to titrate up to try and leave it behind?

I'm with Coal, I admire single mothers and don't know HOW they manage. You are all Superwoman and you should be proud of accomplishing what most of you do, which is work AND mother the kids all week.

[redhead77]

This Redhead's Baclofen Thread

I'm not sure Bruun. I will decide tomorrow. Technically, per my new schedule, I would go up by 10 mg tomorrow. I have now changed myself to 10 mg increments every 3 days. I will evaluate tomorrow how I feel and what I'm going to do.

I would like to talk to Dr L about my current SE's. Since I'm not following his protocol, he will freak! He will of course tell me this is why. I don't know if I would have avoided them or not, if following his protocol. I will tell you, I wouldn't be at my dose for many weeks. I do really want him to understand, though. I think he is very receptive to what people tell him, it's just many aren't telling.

He now has greater than a 3 week appointment wait, at least for his established patients. I tried to call tonight to confirm my appt, and his mailbox was full. He hasn't been in for the weekend. In 2 days it filled up.

I worry about the boom on this website, and what it may do to him. I think he needs to hire a nurse, one whose found indifferance preferably, to help him with his what is now becoming a new alkie clinic.

He might not be able to afford a nurse, though. He doesn't charge many. If he does, he does it on a sliding scale of what they can afford. Many alkies, can't afford to pay. He just accepts that.

I am very concerned with how much everyone mentions his name on this website. I am not sure that's in his best interest. Of course, this is my very, very humble opinion. There are a great many who will lose financial gain once baclofen becomes a choice treatment.

It will be an absolute tragedy or disaster to many, if this doctor gets attacked for prescribing. Possibly going after his medical license. Maybe his name and numbers shouldn't be written everywhere and people could pm others. If of course it was determined that the person seemed to be legitamate. This is again my humble opinion, but one I do hope you all consider.

[Ne/Neva Eva]

This Redhead's Baclofen Thread

I echo your concerns re. the Good Doctor.

I also understand your concerns about going up the bac-ladder. There is something to be said for slow and steady, perhaps. Who knows??? So few of us have been willing to try it! However the two who have, Isolde and Serenity, had a relatively pain-free ride. More of a trolley car experience than a roller-coaster experience.

Without being completely redundant and quoting from the thread I started about that, I'll say that I thought Ig made a very good point: It took him 2 1/2 months to find indifference, with steady increases it would've taken him the same amount of time. I wonder if I'd have needed to slog through 7 months if I'd been consistent (even once!) about my increases in dose.

That said, I'm not sure the SEs can be avoided. (sorry just calling it like I see it, folks) Better to have your eyes wide open and a plan in place for the more onerous ones with your eyes firmly on the goal. It is worth it, RedH. I'm here to testify. Totally and completely worth all the hell (in my case) to come out on this side.
jkttdp, however that's going to work for you.
:h

[RedThread12]

This Redhead's Baclofen Thread

I have pretty weird sleep-effects, too RedH. I often "lucid dream," which means that I realize that I am dreaming while I'm in the dream, which has been a damned good thing lately. Mine is repetitive and hysterical. Full disclosure, here are the details: I recently started dating a really lovely man. For the first time in a very long time I'm sleeping with someone on a regular basis.

But when I go to sleep, I always think I'm sleeping with my last boyfriend. I have these "lucid :H conversations in my head while I'm sleeping or . . . something. "This is Jack. Remember you're sleeping with Jack. No it's not, it's John. If I get out of bed to go to the bathroom, I have to walk down the hall to the left . No, it's Jack! The bathroom is just on the other side of the dresser. You haven't slept with John in ages. OPEN your eyes!" Then I do, and I realize I'm sleeping with Jack and I cuddle up and it's great. Weird. Very weird, and it happens almost every night I sleep with Jack.

I've also had some of the other things: people standing by my bed, people partying in my house; the radio on to a specific program. I think my early experience with hallucinogenic drugs has been a great gift in traversing the baclofen path. That, along with thousands of hours of paying attention to and being conscious of my breath and intentional relaxation processes.

I think I can honestly say that I have never had any discomfort from any SE's (well, overdose excepted), and I've gone up as high as 250 mg. I need to go to Ne's thread and let her know that I am pre-menopausal, too. I'm certain that the SE's are actual and physiological; but I also think there are things we can do by choice, even if we're still drinking, to mitigate them. Guess that's a pop over to Ig's thread, too. I don't seem to fit into any of the categories

That's why I think this board is so spectacularly important, significant and valuable. ALL of our experiences may just be what helps the next one hang on and find a way out.

Enjoy your thread. Thanks.

[redhead77]

This Redhead's Baclofen Thread

RedThread12;1085907 wrote: . I think my early experience with hallucinogenic drugs has been a great gift in traversing the baclofen path. That, along with thousands of hours of paying attention to and being conscious of my breath and intentional relaxation processes.

:H I too experimented with hallucinogens and a few other things when I was young. Never had a bad trip, luckily. I think the hallucinations I was getting weren't very positive or benign.

How in the world does one even begin the process of meditation? A few folks write about it around here, but when I try, I just can't quiet my brain. Other thoughts just keep coming. I try to push them out, but it becomes a battle, which I believe isn't conducive to effective meditation. The whole breathing thing leaves me perplexed as well. I don't know how to therapeutically breathe, except for Lamaze style breathing. I'm thinking that's not what were aiming for.

There must be a meditation for beginners. One that has you building up time, for which you can effectively meditate. I think for me, and my ADD brain, that 1 minute may be a good starting point. I recognize how valuable it is, and I really admire you folks that can make it work.

I am happy to report that the bizarre night hallucinations have ceased. They were occuring somewhere in the 140-150 range. I stayed at 150 a day longer this time. I have noticed with my titration schedule (increasing every 3rd day), that I feel good on the 3rd day. I then usually decide to go up. At 150 it took 4 days before I was comfortable. I just won't go up until I've adjusted to the newest titration. I'm now at 160. It is my 3rd day at this dose. I think I'm going to hold out at this dose a few days longer. I feel okay today (normal SE's), I'm used to those.

I've got some stuff coming up next week that I need to be functional for. Then again, maybe I should go up tomorrow and then just stay at that dose until after my important stuff. I would probably have time to adjust. I certainly don't want to hold this process back anymore than I have to. I guess I'll decide tomorrow. Sigh.


That is what's hard about this whole thing. Trying to find that middle ground. The one where you're functional, but not holding back the process.

Once again, I will ponder this all tomorrow.


Redhead

[bleep]

This Redhead's Baclofen Thread

Red, it sounds to me like you are going along nicely.

I won't give you any advice on the meditation front, seeing as I haven't ever stared at at my belly button in a meaningful way before, but on the baclofen I feel entitled to weigh in...

As I said, going along well. Listen to your body, which you seem to be doing, and ignore it. When it says stop, keep pushing it ever so slightly. You don't want to be at a level where you are perfectly comfortable, because then you are going too slowly. You seem to have it down to an art form.

I think that bad trips are a figment of publicity - everyone knows someone who knows someone who had a bad trip, but really, as a percentage, it must be a minuscule proportion of people who have a bad trip. Well worth the risk, imo. A good trip is something else...

[redhead77]

This Redhead's Baclofen Thread

Often it is hard for me to update my thread. I figure, if I don't having anything interesting to say, why say anything at all? I do find myself needing to resue it before it hits the third page. I just can't see that. I really admire you people that have something interesting to say almost daily. You know who you are! :l

I titrated up to 180 yesterday. I am unhappy to report that I am not feeling very well. I have severe vertigo (had to run an errand with my daughter in the car today, and questioned if I was safe to drive). I also am suffering from pretty bad nausea. Last night after having a couple of glasses of wine -(half the bottle), I threw up. A few times. May have thrown up my bac dose that I had just taken.

I know what you're thinking. If drinking makes you sick, then just stop. I don't think I even needed to drink last night. Except the kids were overwhelming me. I have used alcohol as a crutch. It is exhausting to be a single mother. It softens the evenings of homework, refereeing fights, baths, books, all of it. The problem is the softening turns to blackness on more than a few occasions.

I do this all without any financial support, and minimal interaction of the kids with their father. In less than a month he will be gone and I won't even have every other weekend free. He quit his job over 6 months ago so doesn't pay any child support. He doesn't pay a penny, or even buy them a pair of shoes. I would consider myself lucky that I live in a state that considers this unacceptable. A man is put in jail every weekend until he finds a job so he can contribute, but I can't do that either.

If I put him in jail, he may be in quite a lot of trouble, and it may jeopordize the job he has finally gotten. A job that takes him away for almost 5 years, may leave him dead, or severly wounded. I filed for divorce and he signed up for this. At a time when the world has gone mad. I had to write a letter to let him in, and really considered not doing it. I did end up writing it, because the alternative could be worse. No financial support for the kids, and a dead beat dad. One who would rather party and hang with his very young GF, than see his kids. At least I know where he's going, it is considered absolutely dishonorable not to support your family. They come down on men who try like a ton of bricks.

I have been wondering lately if I've made my life much harder than it needed to be, by my choices. I know he wants me to feel that way. He tries very hard. I am quite sure, had I not, that I wouldn't be here right now. I would have drinken myself to death. I would have WANTED to.

I haven't written much about these very real issues on my blog. Issues that I will have to overcome to give up my much loved crutch. I wanted to save this part of my life for moms on bac. I just can't do it at the moment. Maybe when I find indifference. I tell myself, it can't be that far away. Or could it.......

The sickness I experienced last night may also be due to the fact that I went on a low carb diet a few days ago. A very low carb diet. My scale is still without a battery (yes, I'm doing that on purpose). I would guess by how my clothes fit, or don't, that I have probably gained around 10 lbs, since starting this. Unfortunately, the mild form of nausea, is relieved with food. I find myself eating frequently. Healthy food, but still too many kcals. I found I could work out for a short period of time, but again, it was temporary.

I guess I had a lot to say today.

Redhead

[Bruunhilde]

This Redhead's Baclofen Thread

Redhead, you have got yourself a whole lot of life there to manage. You sound like you're making balanced, rational choices in spite of what your ex really deserves. What is it with dads that don't care about seeing their kids? I don't get that at all.

I wish I could help you somehow. I've taken care of my sick friend's kids for a week while she was dying, and between all the homework and the driving them around to lessons/games and then the food and bathing, and fighting, it was crazy. Can't imagine doing it and working too. I guess some thing would have to give.

I admire your fortitude. I'm sorry you don't feel well. I hope you are able to post that the vertigo went away - soon! If not, do you plan to titrate up through it, as they say?

[redhead77]

This Redhead's Baclofen Thread

Thanks Bruun, I somehow know you would help if you could. :l I think the places he's going will provide him with everything he deserves. I'm a true believer in karma.

You know me. Tomorrow is a new day, and I will decide then.

[Ne/Neva Eva]

This Redhead's Baclofen Thread

Wow, RedH.
There is so much I would like to respond to in your post! For the sake of relative brevity, I'll stick to the bac.

I REALLY struggled with what I described then as vertigo. I used a lot of things to help with it. Distraction was the biggest. But also humming, and growling and singing. Seriously. There was a discussion about it on Ig's thread in around October of last year. (There is some sort of science behind it. Can't remember now.) A low guttural in the back of the throat growling and hum, like "ooohhhmmm." Maybe RedT can elucidate. Give that a shot and see if it helps you when you are feeling wonky. I found this one particularly effective while driving.

Also talking on the phone. And using eye-focusing techniques. I often looked at things out of the corners of my eyes when I was feeling particularly off kilter.
I'm probably belaboring the point, because it started happening for me around 30mg/day (where I spent almost a month!!!) and didn't stop until I got to around 100mg. Obviously that isn't the case for you and it's likely to go away in a day or two.

The throwing up? Ugh. I don't know what to tell you about that, except don't drink. Which is funny and not so funny.
Both of the SEs sound to me as if they might be too much bac, too soon? I have thrown up from bac alone when I took too much, too.

As to the diet: Dude, seriously. Your body doesn't have enough going on, being thoroughly ransacked by bac, that you decide to deprive it of carbs? You're already depriving both your mind and your body of the carbs it really wants. I know it's not just for vanity's sake, but come on. Cut yourself some slack. At 180, getting sick from AL, and drinking very little, you're almost there. Take it easy, will you?

I'm really sorry about your soon to be ex-husband. pfffft. But it sounds like you are both making decisions that reflect where you are and how best to proceed. (I like your version better!)
xo
Ne

[terryk]

This Redhead's Baclofen Thread

Hey Redhead - I've been following your posts, not to closely, and just wanted to chime in after your last one. I eventually settled in on a very slow titration (~10mg every 5-7 days). Early on, around 80-100mg, I had bad cognitive and (terrible) memory problems. I also started my titration whilst on a (vegan) 20g carb/day diet (I lost about 35lb and then gained 40 back due to baclofen related food craving - I can explain at length if interested). I also had the typical lucid dreaming and weird hallucinations. Putting the diet on hold, minimizing (or eliminating) the drinking, and slowing down the titration let me reach the switch at 280 in September 2010. My cognition and memory started to snap back when I was around the 180's. Bac related eating (stuffing myself even after I was full) also stopped around there too (40lbs too late). Now, six months after the switch, I'm completely normal at 240mg/day. I start to doze off around 10-11pm if I park my butt in front of the tv for too long, but that's about the only side effect left. And I sleep better than ever at about 7 hours a night. I went back on the lo-carb vegan diet, and now do a 6 day CKD and have lost 42lbs in about 120 days. So I just wanted to say that while you're traveling a rough, bumpy road right now, it looks like (to me) that you're headed in the right direction. -tk