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**Ne/Neva Eva** · February 24, 2011, 12:49 PM

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Not going to bring you to tears, though my side effects through out the ride haven't been pretty. They were the worst (for me) at the lower doses. Then they just intermittently sucked.

Glad you started your thread. To what do you attribute your continuing struggle?

And for god's sake, friend, are you getting any sleep at all? :upset:
:ls
Karen/Ne

**Longshot** · February 24, 2011, 12:55 PM

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Ne/Neva Eva;1065440 wrote: Not going to bring you to tears, though my side effects through out the ride haven't been pretty. They were the worst (for me) at the lower doses. Then they just intermittently sucked.

Glad you started your thread. To what do you attribute your continuing struggle?

And for god's sake, friend, are you getting any sleep at all? :upset:
:ls
Karen/Ne

Only with the aid of triazolam, and usually only at around 5am, is the only time I can get any sleep. I've literally turned into a teenager.

**bleep** · February 24, 2011, 01:05 PM

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Hey Longshot, glad you decided to start your thread!

400+ baclofen is no joke, I was there for a while, so I know what it's like. Hopefully you won't have to go much higher. Have you considered splitting your doses more - it helps considerably with the SE's.

The insomnia blows - mine also removes all traces of tiredness, which is great, but I am getting 4 hours of sleep, which may be enough. Sorry I don't have any tips there, but this forum is full of people suffering the same thing, so if there's a cure, someone will help you find it. There's also a sleep thread, I don't know if you have had a look at that?

Good luck man.

**Lo0p** · February 24, 2011, 01:31 PM

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I've got a helluva day ahead of me so I can't give this the attn. it deserves atm. Anybody remember that guys name?

BOOM! manlookingfornothing right? that was him! I think it was 400 on the button.

More later if I can...gotta run and pick up my Rx!

**beatle** · February 24, 2011, 10:13 PM

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Longshot, I kind of thought you had your own thread, but I guess not -- it was all about sleep and probably on somebody else's thread? (Sorry, no short-term memory here :-().

I know I advised you, both on the forums and off, and I think I was the one who suggested lithium orotate. The dose I recommended (and is standard), is 5-10mg. You are taking 300mg?

More scary:

Triazolam, as I believe you were already aware, is a benzo, and as such, highly addictive and tolerance building. I googled it, and on a public health site (PubMed Health - Triazolam), it said:

If you take triazolam for 7 to 10 days or longer, triazolam may not help you sleep as well as it did when you first began to take the medication, and you may wake up more easily during the last third of the night. You may also start to feel anxious or nervous during the day, and you may develop dependence ('addiction'; a need to continue taking the medication) on triazolam. Talk to your doctor about the risks of taking triazolam for 2 weeks or longer.

Plus, the scariest part: The recommended dose is 0.125mg-0.25mg per night, and you are taking 50-100MG?

Perhaps you are focussing a little too much on how much baclofen you are taking and how little sleep you are getting? When these are in fact peripheral or steered by other forces?

As you say, "Frankly if I have hit a switch I would have had no idea as I am completely out of my head 24/7 due to insomnia." I'm afraid that may be what is happening here.

**ignominious** · February 25, 2011, 06:37 AM

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Sort of been following your plight from the beginning and frankly have been at a bit of a loss for what to

say apart from good luck and I, vicariously, am sharing your agony.

Now at last I have an opportunity to add something:

I think Beatle has a point.

Not the most original line I've written.

Baclofen itself causes new thoughts to emerge and new synapses to start firing. Insomnia will make you

think differently about things. With everything else you are trying your brain must be on fire.

Here's hoping you haven't spontaneously combusted by the time this reaches Ireland.

**Longshot** · February 25, 2011, 07:19 AM

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beatle;1065651 wrote: Longshot, I kind of thought you had your own thread, but I guess not -- it was all about sleep and probably on somebody else's thread? (Sorry, no short-term memory here :-().

I know I advised you, both on the forums and off, and I think I was the one who suggested lithium orotate. The dose I recommended (and is standard), is 5-10mg. You are taking 300mg?

I'll check the bottle now. I've been takin 15mg. Will drop to 10

More scary:

Triazolam, as I believe you were already aware, is a benzo, and as such, highly addictive and tolerance building. I googled it, and on a public health site (PubMed Health - Triazolam), it said:

If you take triazolam for 7 to 10 days or longer, triazolam may not help you sleep as well as it did when you first began to take the medication, and you may wake up more easily during the last third of the night. You may also start to feel anxious or nervous during the day, and you may develop dependence ('addiction'; a need to continue taking the medication) on triazolam. Talk to your doctor about the risks of taking triazolam for 2 weeks or longer.

Plus, the scariest part: The recommended dose is 0.125mg-0.25mg per night, and you are taking 50-100MG?

Perhaps you are focussing a little too much on how much baclofen you are taking and how little sleep you are getting? When these are in fact peripheral or steered by other forces?

As you say, "Frankly if I have hit a switch I would have had no idea as I am completely out of my head 24/7 due to insomnia." I'm afraid that may be what is happening here.

I'm tritrating down on the triazolam and asking my Doctor for Zolpidem. Sorry missed the decimal point I'm taking. .50-.75mg a night.

I've also ordered some Seroquel for the short term to kick my sleeping patterns back to touch.

**ignominious** · February 25, 2011, 07:57 AM

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That'll learn me.

All the same, you've got a heap of different things going on. Maybe if you can cut out or cut down the other medications as much as possible

I know the insomnia thing must be driving you crazy, if I have one or two restless nights I'm not happy! More exercise works for me.

Having just read Sunny's success thread I'm also inclined to ask how much of your drinking now is due to craving - got to have a drink and how much is habit or just escapism. Baclofen really only gives us back the power to make a reasoned decision about alcohol.

**Longshot** · February 25, 2011, 08:07 AM

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ignominious;1065883 wrote: That'll learn me.

All the same, you've got a heap of different things going on. Maybe if you can cut out or cut down the other medications as much as possible

I know the insomnia thing must be driving you crazy, if I have one or two restless nights I'm not happy! More exercise works for me.

Exercise really works for me, unfortunately I had a bad run in torrential rain on Feb 15, and my leg is completely out of action.

Having just read Sunny's success thread I'm also inclined to ask how much of your drinking now is due to craving - got to have a drink and how much is habit or just escapism. Baclofen really only gives us back the power to make a reasoned decision about alcohol.

My wife and I have me pretty much on lockdown 24/7. I'm not working at the moment and neither is she.

It's wonderful that she's taking great care about me, it just feels like I'm a teenager some time.

**ignominious** · February 25, 2011, 08:17 AM

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Sounds like a gas in the Longshot household. Love and drama at full speed!

You've both been on this for so long is it possible that changing the setting is what's preventing you from going AF? Possibly the craving is not for alcohol but for drama and kiss and make up. Gawd I sound like an agony aunt of something.

**beatle** · February 25, 2011, 11:26 AM

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Longshot;1065845 wrote: I'll check the bottle now. I've been takin 15mg. Will drop to 10

I'm tritrating down on the triazolam and asking my Doctor for Zolpidem. Sorry missed the decimal point I'm taking. .50-.75mg a night.

I've also ordered some Seroquel for the short term to kick my sleeping patterns back to touch.

That sounds better.

Those meds doses seemed stratospheric (and catastrophic).

I'm not sure if it is so important on the lith oro. Might be fine at 15mg for a big guy.

Also, I think 6mg melatonin would make more sense for you.

And I'm wondering about the 5-HTP. Do you feel a difference, or is it a sort of random possible helper to you arsenal? I know I recommended it, but I wonder if it might be better to cut it out for now until you get a better grip on what is doing what. The Melatonin and the lith oro can just stay there forever. No harm nor interactions that I know of, and melatonin, at least, is supposed to be good for many other things than sleep. In Seven Weeks to Sobriety, she recommends taking it for life. For everyone.

I'm just thinking, the less ingredients in the potion, the easier it is to identify what is doing what, and to cut out possibilities of interactions we may not be aware of.

Also, you might want to check contraindications with 5HTP and Seroquel. Not sure why, but I have an idea they might not work well together (both work on serotonin?) This is pure conjecture off the top of my head.

Good luck. I've said it numerous times... sleep deprivation magnifies all other problems -- in my experience it is not possible to get or stay sober if you can't sleep. Vicious cycle for sure.

**Longshot** · February 25, 2011, 11:45 AM

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beatle;1065963 wrote: That sounds better.

Those meds doses seemed stratospheric (and catastrophic).

I'm not sure if it is so important on the lith oro. Might be fine at 15mg for a big guy.

Also, I think 6mg melatonin would make more sense for you.

And I'm wondering about the 5-HTP. Do you feel a difference, or is it a sort of random possible helper to you arsenal? I know I recommended it, but I wonder if it might be better to cut it out for now until you get a better grip on what is doing what. The Melatonin and the lith oro can just stay there forever. No harm nor interactions that I know of, and melatonin, at least, is supposed to be good for many other things than sleep. In Seven Weeks to Sobriety, she recommends taking it for life. For everyone.

I'm just thinking, the less ingredients in the potion, the easier it is to identify what is doing what, and to cut out possibilities of interactions we may not be aware of.

Also, you might want to check contraindications with 5HTP and Seroquel. Not sure why, but I have an idea they might not work well together (both work on serotonin?) This is pure conjecture off the top of my head.

Good luck. I've said it numerous times... sleep deprivation magnifies all other problems -- in my experience it is not possible to get or stay sober if you can't sleep. Vicious cycle for sure.

I've got the zolipdem, I'll easy off on the benzos on the course of the week.

I'll check the contradictions of the Seroquel and and 5HTP as if it arrives (if it's not here by morning, it won't arrive till monday)

Other fun this week ?2,000 dentists bill, and a trip to the Radiologist on monday to investigate a broken bone in my wrist.

**Longshot** · February 25, 2011, 11:46 AM

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ignominious;1065890 wrote: Sounds like a gas in the Longshot household. Love and drama at full speed!

You've both been on this for so long is it possible that changing the setting is what's preventing you from going AF? Possibly the craving is not for alcohol but for drama and kiss and make up. Gawd I sound like an agony aunt of something.

Entirely possible, the Settings are very stressful and unlikely to change any time soon.

**Longshot** · February 25, 2011, 12:29 PM

My Thread

beatle;1065963 wrote: That sounds better.

Those meds doses seemed stratospheric (and catastrophic).

I'm not sure if it is so important on the lith oro. Might be fine at 15mg for a big guy.

Also, I think 6mg melatonin would make more sense for you.

And I'm wondering about the 5-HTP.

5-HTP was for self diagnosised Hypnic jerk, that was along long time ago. I'd miss that right now.

Good luck. I've said it numerous times... sleep deprivation magnifies all other problems -- in my experience it is not possible to get or stay sober if you can't sleep. Vicious cycle for sure.

Agreed I feel so much better and more positive after just a few hours sleep.

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