Everyone in the UK - Baclofen

[coalfire]

Everyone in the UK - Baclofen

...and that concludes the sherlock and holmes investigation for today. Night night children. I'm off to bed.

[bleep]

Everyone in the UK - Baclofen

Missed all the drama, it seems

The link appears to have been shut down already, or is it just me?

[beatle]

Everyone in the UK - Baclofen

I'm not calling into question any of the seemingly ridiculous claims made by "Dr. Phill" nor that he has been entirely disingenuous. There are multitudes of negative adjectives that could very appropriately be applied to "Dr. Phill".

However, I have been to his Alcoholism Northwest UK site, and I can't see there anywhere that he poses as a doctor or implies he can write prescriptions. Maybe I missed that somewhere? The only place I can find that he is deliberately misleading is his web address, and in his email address, that start with "dr.phillip..." (which I don't think are illegal -- can't anyone use "dr." as part of their email and/or web address? I don't know.)

Anyway, I'm just pointing out this so that you are careful before you start something. It could be that in some way making it appear that you are an M.D. when you are not, even if you make no direct claim to be, is indeed illegal in the U.K. (or the U.S.?). I don't know. But I'm just guessing that you would have to have some proof that he had claimed he was an M.D.? And perhaps he himself has not done that -- in which case, case closed.

But, given his legal education, wouldn't you guess he is aware of the minutiae of the law regarding indiscretions and illegal acts?

If he is doing anything illegal, I would be more than happy that he is shown up for it made an example of what cannot be tolerated. But if he is not, I think the best route to ruining him (if that is your intention, which it appears it is), is to do it at a grassroots level. And there are endless opportunities there. If he is a true charlatan, doing more harm than good, acting out of greed for personal monetary gain, it should not be difficult to fell him.

He has already provided ample fodder. And he is transparent.

Whatever the case, if it he has done something illegal and it can be proven, he will be served justice.

[Cinders]

Everyone in the UK - Baclofen

and if he hasn't done anything illegal, he has just been done a great disservice.

Cindi

[beatle]

Everyone in the UK - Baclofen

TracyA;1086902 wrote: When I figured it out between him and Cowgal, I just wanted to puke and cry and scream!
Has anything about Cowgal and Dr. Phill been on the boards here? Has she written something? I don't recall.

Perhaps she has, and if so, I apologize for the following:

I think it is extremely inappropriate to bring up private matters and insinuations here, publicly. I had a close personal relationship with Cowgal (MA) by email, and she told me many things privately that I do not think she would have wished to be divulged publicly. Although she is dead now, I believe her privacy continues to deserve to be that -- private.

As far as I know, she never mentioned anything about this (Dr. Phill and her) on the boards. If that is the case, it would be an extreme violation of privacy to bring it up here in public as an underhanded insinuation with no verifiable source -- and it degrades both her and the credibilty of this community.

If I am wrong about this, and she has brought it up on the boards, I will rescind this.

TracyA;1086902 wrote: UK, would you please delete your original post, or at least the link so other people don't see it?

Telling/asking somebody delete quotes (whether publicly or privately) also degrades this community and calls into question its crdibility. This whole thread is based on UK's first post. The rest of the posts will make no sense without that first post. Which will mean the whole thread will be a conundrum to anyone coming upon it. What is the point of having any discussion if people go around deleting posts, and worse, asking people to delete their posts? And even worse deleting their own posts, leaving others to stand there to be ridiculed?

[TracyA]

Everyone in the UK - Baclofen

beatle;1086969 wrote: I'm not calling into question any of the seemingly ridiculous claims made by "Dr. Phill" nor that he has been entirely disingenuous. There are multitudes of negative adjectives that could very appropriately be applied to "Dr. Phill".

However, I have been to his Alcoholism Northwest UK site, and I can't see there anywhere that he poses as a doctor or implies he can write prescriptions.
You must have missed his bio on his numerous sites where he claims to be a surgeon. He does indeed go by Dr. on all his sites, on youtube and on here.

Anyway, I'm just pointing out this so that you are careful before you start something. It could be that in some way making it appear that you are an M.D. when you are not, even if you make no direct claim to be, is indeed illegal in the U.K. (or the U.S.?). I don't know.
I'm pretty sure that claiming to be a doctor and writing a book about using a medication off-label in doses well beyond the medical max - AND neglecting to mention that you are not entitled to give "medical advice" will suffice.

But I'm just guessing that you would have to have some proof that he had claimed he was an M.D.? And perhaps he himself has not done that -- in which case, case closed.

Oh, but he has dear Beatle, on this very site.

But, given his legal education, wouldn't you guess he is aware of the minutiae of the law regarding indiscretions and illegal acts?

You must have missed the part where he is not listed on any role in the UK in that capacity. They have never heard of him. He is not an attorney/solicitor, though he certainly claims to be in his book and on his various websites.

If he is doing anything illegal, I would be more than happy that he is shown up for it made an example of what cannot be tolerated. But if he is not, I think the best route to ruining him (if that is your intention, which it appears it is), is to do it at a grassroots level. And there are endless opportunities there. If he is a true charlatan, doing more harm than good, acting out of greed for personal monetary gain, it should not be difficult to fell him.

Thanks. I will attempt to disclose enough to the right people that he can't prey on people who don't need his crap. People like Cowgal, for instance. Other people who have never been active in the Med forum are helping. Glad you are on my side in this.

[TracyA]

Everyone in the UK - Baclofen

beatle;1086981 wrote: Has anything about Cowgal and Dr. Phill been on the boards here?

Nope. It took some snooping to sort it out. If you know as much as you say you know, you know why I am concerned. I'm not going to post anything "private" here. But as a source of concern, yes, she certainly is a driving force for me! I don't particularly care if you like what I'm doing or not. I don't care who does or does not. Your disapproval is going to stop nothing. I do think people are waiting for you to respond on your thread though . . .

[beatle]

Everyone in the UK - Baclofen

TracyA;1086982 wrote: You must have missed his bio on his numerous sites where he claims to be a surgeon. He does indeed go by Dr. on all his sites, on youtube and on here.
I again refer to what I wrote. Does he just go by the name of "Dr."? Is that illegal? Or does he claim to be a medical doctor? If so, case closed, I would guess. Easy as toast. (And why hasn't somebody else managed to do that yet?)

TracyA;1086982 wrote: I'm pretty sure that claiming to be a doctor and writing a book about using a medication off-label in doses well beyond the medical max - AND neglecting to mention that you are not entitled to give "medical advice" will suffice.
Same as above. It's all very well to be "pretty sure" but I'm not sure how far that will go. towards convicting someone legally, or getting authoritative bodies to denounce him.



TracyA;1086982 wrote: Oh, but he has dear Beatle, on this very site.

Claimed that he is a medical doctor? I can't recall that he has done that, but if he has, you have him nailed, I would guess.

TracyA;1086982 wrote: You must have missed the part where he is not listed on any role in the UK in that capacity. They have never heard of him. He is not an attorney/solicitor, though he certainly claims to be in his book and on his various websites.

Yes, I did miss that. If he claims to be that which he is not in a legal capacity, I imagine you will have no problem eradicating him.

[beatle]

Everyone in the UK - Baclofen

TracyA;1086984 wrote: Nope. It took some snooping to sort it out. If you know as much as you say you know, you know why I am concerned. I'm not going to post anything "private" here. But as a source of concern, yes, she certainly is a driving force for me! I don't particularly care if you like what I'm doing or not. I don't care who does or does not. Your disapproval is going to stop nothing. I do think people are waiting for you to respond on your thread though . . .

I am appalled. (Apalled was the most civilized word I could conjure, atm).

I would never, ever share the contents of personal communications I had with individuals here, or any insinuations of the content thereof. I would always respect the privacy of those who shared private thoughts with me, dead or alive.

If i believed anyone here would ever share the contents, or any insinuations of what my contents had inferred to the person, of my personal communications publicly ever -- even after I died, I would have to lose faith in trust and human nature. Which I am coming close to doing here.

I do not think this is the place to out people after their death in public. It is not the place to pursue vendettas using hints and references to unknown sources; it is not the role of anyone to "snoop" to "sort things out" and then bring hints about what is discovered privately into the public forum.

I am very careful about with whom I exchange private communications, and I am feeling fairly confident in having made the right choices thus far.

[coalfire]

Everyone in the UK - Baclofen

Folks he has actually been struck off the UK register for misconduct. He has had his finger in a lot of pies.
Look at Tracys link to the GMC minutes. He was under huge investigation, then found guilty of misconduct and booted out of the medical profession. People can see who they choose to but between his dodgy facial injections and the rest would you really want to trust him? Docs don't get struck off for nothing. The GMC do it as a decision to protect the public. Thats how serious it is.They did it to protect the public from him. They say so in Tracy's link. That report would be enough for me. The GMC are a top notch professional body. Their word is gold in uk/ireland.GMC Minutes

[Guest]

Everyone in the UK - Baclofen

Yes. I believe other members in the non-meds section already did some digging on this guy. So it's not new, and I'm glad I've raised this. He doesn't say up front that he is an MD, but he does strongly imply this.

It is a glaring example of WHY we shouldn't believe everything on the internet. Another reason why people and MDs will be hesitant to prescribe just because we have read something on an internet forum. They are quite rightly wanting hard and fast proof, in order to protect ourselves from people like this.

[beatle]

Everyone in the UK - Baclofen

Hard and fast proof exists. Charlatans will always exist.

If you can provide hard and fast proof, what's the difference? Is a GP going to say, "but there are also dubious people making similar claims on the internet, so I'm not interested?"

The reason doctors are hesitant is because they know that the internet abounds with dubious claims and ASSUME you are making your request on dubious claims and therefore won't give you the respect and caring you deserve after looking into this for hundreds of hours, because they can't take a few minutes to look at the carefully assembled research you have brought to the doctor.

I met with 2 doctors, one in Europe and one in the U.S.

I brought my carefully research documents and the book by OA, which is by a doctor (not disbanded, but a doctor of the French Legion of Honor), chock full of references, peer-reviewed articles in highly regarded medical journals... how could a doctor write that off (if he/she bothered to spend 5 minutes looking at it?).

The two doctors I met with were very skeptical, and indeed suggested it was a fad "Get Well Quick" (make money quick) scam, but when I showed them the appendices at the back of OA's book, they were impressed enough to spend a few minutes to look at the material, and even checked into how dangerous baclofen is. At my next appts. with both doctors (separate times, separate continents), both agreed (although still with some hesitance, to prescribe me high-dose baclofen. The one in the U.S. was more hesitant because of the possibility of litigation (who would blame her?), but she looked into it and determined that based on the fact that I was taking it anyway, it was her responsibility to make sure I was safe... by giving me a legit scrip... I also think that given the nature of the "drug" --in as that it is not considered a narcotic --I think it is pretty low on the scale by which a drug is even classified as a drug, and even OTC in some European countries --that she also doubted litigation would ensue from prescribing such a "benign" medication -- one that had no track record of abuse for a half century-- and felt pretty safe about it. She actually told me as much, but without the litigation part.

So, my advice is: come well prepared with LOTs of serious literature, and don't back down. Make the MD feel ashamed for refusing to read legitimate, peer-reviewed article in publications he/she most likely reads regularly and esteems highly. Yes, you will still hit plenty of arrogant doctors who don't have the time of day for you, but it is is also likely you will find someone who will at least listen.

p.s., you may have to go outside the public health system to accomplish this. I went private in the U.S. It cost me $120. And I got the scrip the next time I went back ($70). I considered it a $190 dollars well spent.

In Europe, I went to my regular GP. We have a long relationship regarding my alcoholism, and she was just interested in anything I had found. I guess she trusted me to be able to sort out the junk from the serious.

My advice is toarm yourself with facts and a steel (but humble) will. The doctor's job is to help you get well. Never forget it. And don't give up.

[spacebebe01]

Everyone in the UK - Baclofen

OMG I read the first post on this, went with the link, and have just e-mailed this guy. I then came back to read the rest of the posts, why I didnt do that first anyway I have no idea. Is he really the
dr
baclofen on youtube? haha he is a wierdo I couldnt watch that, the thought of him with no shirt on (or worse) made me too sick.

[Guest]

Everyone in the UK - Baclofen

I emailed him when I first spotted his site last night, I've got a very interesting response indeedy. In it he says he doesn't prescribe the drug, you have to obtain it from your GP but he's happy to speak to them. Charges ?2500 for 3 months 1-2-1 treatment.

I'm better off with my counsellor, and dietician I'm hiring. They cost no more than around ?400 for that time period.

[Otter]

Everyone in the UK - Baclofen

You will find that in England a person can call themselves a doctor if they have a medical qualification. Phillip Thomas has a medical qualification. There is no such thing as an MD in England. All doctors have Bachelors degrees. Calling oneself a doctor is not illegal even if you are not a doctor. The word "doctor" is not a protected title in the UK, nor is the word "lawyer".

It is not necessary to be a doctor to counsel alcoholics so again, you should be careful what you say about people. Also, it is not necessary to be on the GMC register of doctors to call oneself a doctor. You can call yourself a doctor even if you have been removed from the GMC register.

Also, Phillip Thomas has a law degree so it is unlikely that you will find that he has set up in contravention of any legal requirements to give counselling to alcoholics. None of the alcohol rehab clinics in the UK are run by doctors.

So, if someone gets a prescription from their doctor, they are free to ask someone else how best to take the medication, as evidenced by what is being done here. If what he is doing is illegal, then so is the advice being given on this website. If people are getting their Baclofen over the internet then they are self prescribing and again they can ask a non practicing doctor what his view is on how much to take so long as there is no representation that the person giving the advice is a practicing doctor.

I don't know where you are taking this. If Phill Thomas is not prescribing Baclofen, which he is not, then I think you will find you are wasting your time going after him.

Also, why the vindictiveness. Tracy, you live in the US. What point is there to this witch hunt you are carrying on? Everyone here is giving advice about Baclofen without any medical training at all. Why don't you go after all the other people here who are giving advice on titration?

I think this thread has just become vindictive, nasty and unpleasant.

And, you should look at the reasons he was taken off the medical register. He was convicted of drink driving. He failed to take a follow up photo of a patient because he stopped practicing due to his alcoholism and he then failed to answer correspondence from the GMC because of his alcoholism. Nothing to do with his ability as a doctor at all and everything to do with being an alcoholic. There was not a major investigation into him nor were there complaints about his "facial injections"

He was a surgeon and he was employed by a major law firm in England which handled medical malpractice cases. In fact it is the most famous law firm in the UK in that field. If you actually looked into his professional qualifications you would find that he is what he says he is and his research on Baclofen and his understanding of it is second to none.

Frankly, you are wasting your time.