Another note from Dr Ameisen

[Cinders]

Another note from Dr Ameisen

Hey, Winks,

We got it. Baclofen has seriously horrible SEs.

Cindi

[terryk]

Another note from Dr Ameisen

Winks;1098908 wrote:

Re: aggression. The post from God (and some that could have come from Charlie Sheen) show that aggressiveness is one thing affected. In one study (not that one study means much), people who were normally aggressive tended to become less so on relatively low-dose baclofen. People who were not normally aggressive tended to become more aggressive:

touch

[Florieanne]

Another note from Dr Ameisen

Winks;1098908 wrote: No doubt frustrating but par for the course. Hence, my problem with the word "cure." If it was a game of golf: Birdies, eagles and albatrosses are out there, but there aren't many. Tiger Woods is not the common man. There are many more pars for most people. Many, many more bogeys. It's all "normal" and to be expected. Or, it should be expected given everything we know about the game and can see from past performances. IMO.

Re: aggression. The post from God (and some that could have come from Charlie Sheen) show that aggressiveness is one thing affected. In one study (not that one study means much), people who were normally aggressive tended to become less so on relatively low-dose baclofen. People who were not normally aggressive tended to become more aggressive:

Acute effects of baclofen, a gamma-aminobutyric ac... [Psychopharmacology (Berl). 2002] - PubMed result

Who knows what that all means with high-dose baclofen.

But, regarding the baclofen thing overall, it would be nice the see the norm recognized as the norm, IMO.

Great find Winks :goodjob:
Echoes something my psycho-analyst told me this morning..that powerful med like bac, neuroleptics, ads, etc. are not appropriate for nevrotic people, only borderline & others.

I'm not the aggressive type. The worst I've done/said was here. "Slandering" (?) on a public forum.
Followed by vanishing from all forums out of guilt. And therefore asking myself more questions about the cognitive SE of bac. Well aware there was something going wrong in many ways on the cognitive/mental side as far as I was concerned.

Would this explain OA's behaviour?

I'm quite sure we've got a lot more to learn on SE.
A great many thanks
Florie

[Florieanne]

Another note from Dr Ameisen

Murphyx;1098926 wrote: Stop pretending that maths question is easy. It's not and your answers make no sense. It's impossible and my head hurts. :upset:

could that be a SE ??
:lol3:
Florie

[bleep]

Another note from Dr Ameisen

Florie, really sorry to hear that you are finding the SE's untenable. Perhaps, having reached indifference, there will be a residual effect? No idea really, just hoping.

All the best in your ongoing fight.

Regarding aggression - I've completely lost my road rage on baclofen. I used to get to work every morning apoplectic with fury at the drivers I was forced to share the roads with. Now, I melt through traffic with a smile on my face.

[Murphyx]

Another note from Dr Ameisen

Nooooooooo, you're both wrong. It's not 25+2+3=30. It's 27+5-2=30.

The women paid $27. $5 refunded and $2 pocketed.

I spent an hour before the alarm went off worrying about this riddle. :H

[Ne/Neva Eva]

Another note from Dr Ameisen

Zen, Thank you.
Florie, hmmm. I'm really bummed to hear about that. I have gone down significantly over the last week and found it to be pretty great. Is that an option? I'll update my own thread this morning.

I didn't even bother with the riddle. I got 22 points out of 100 on my math placement test for school last week. Granted it wasn't addition, (seriously people, WTF is "x" anyway???) but still...
xo

[Lo0p]

Another note from Dr Ameisen

That waiter should be fired.

[mmerlot]

Another note from Dr Ameisen

I have to say I just finished trying acamprol and naltrex with zero results. Both only delayed my desire and did little for me. I am back to the natural stuff now and going to give it a much harder and longer try.

[missyabby1]

Another note from Dr Ameisen

Hey Loop, just had to come back at you before i go to bed............don't much like "being put in my place" by anyone. Did my due diligence and read all the papers posted on this site re Bac. I would love to say that I hadn't read them all and that you had come up with something I hadn't read. I counted the number of people involved in trials of baclofen used for "etc etc etc"

The first thing I always remember being told by my professor during my studies was to look at the number of subjects being used in these trials (not including rats, unfortunately!} s

She also said, that although studies may look impressive to the unitiated , as they are sometimes made out to be, that we, as scientists should watch our p and qs. and remain true to our findings. Much as we would like to prove our hypothesis.

I honestly thought, because of your ABSOLUTE disgust with me that you had discovered some new trial about bac that involved at least 1,000 subjects and i was totally out of my depth and due for your total disregard. I could have worn that.. I am a scientist void of ego.

Look at your studies carefully and don;t ever accuse me of lacking humility...for whatever reason.

I am also going to state that I have never been against Baclofen as a treatment for alcoholism. Never. I just could not stand the blanket statements that it is a "cure" and therefore beyond question , especially based on the "scientific" studies that you put forth.

Missy













ll

[Otter]

Another note from Dr Ameisen

mmerlot;1099319 wrote: I have to say I just finished trying acamprol and naltrex with zero results. Both only delayed my desire and did little for me. I am back to the natural stuff now and going to give it a much harder and longer try.

Try Baclofen, it actually works!

[Murphyx]

Another note from Dr Ameisen

Otter;1099449 wrote: Try Baclofen, it actually works!

Yeah it does!

[Lo0p]

Another note from Dr Ameisen

missyabby1;1099445 wrote: Hey Loop,[Blah blah blahblah, blah blah blahblahblah. Blah blah blahblah blahblah blah. Blah!]

You basically said all kinds of stuff that I agree with. The only thing I don't understand is why you were telling this to these things to me. It sounds like you're a little miffed at me because you were offended by some things I wrote in my third or so post in this thread, which wasn't even directed at you. It was more or less directed at everyone on the entire meds forum.

This is the first time I've actually read your username and committed it to memory. I quoted a person (you apparently) before claiming that Karen just read a book, took a pill and started to walk toward a cliff like a lemming. You might have veiled it as a question. Either way, I'm sorry if you've been feeling upset lately but you won't ever feel that way if you don't start it in the first place.

[Cinders]

Another note from Dr Ameisen

Murphyx;1099216 wrote: Nooooooooo, you're both wrong. It's not 25+2+3=30. It's 27+5-2=30.

The women paid $27. $5 refunded and $2 pocketed.

I spent an hour before the alarm went off worrying about this riddle. :H

Murphy,

Different ways to look at the problem, they are both right mathematically:

30 given
25 required
2 pocketed
3 refunded
27 paid

25 Required + 2 pocketed + 3 returned = 30 given

is equivalent to:

27 paid = 25 required + (2 pocketed + 3 returned) total refund - 2 pocketed

Cindi

[Lo0p]

Another note from Dr Ameisen

In any case, he should be fired. Who cares where this mystery dollar went? We know damn well where two of them did.