Baclofen as a treatment for cannabis dependence?
Hey folks thanks very much for the input. As you can probably tell from my last post I'm quite confused and also feeling alarmed about my current substance intake. I usually have control over everything apart from alcohol, so seeing myself take this other stuff is a bit alarming.
Hi Ne, Murph, Lo0p, 8, I'm always interested in reading your opinions, and aware not to take advice as being equivalent to a doctor's (as usual you gave me a laugh Murph the way you stated that). Ne, I have thought about drinking again many times, it is a thought I battle each day. I often think of giving in to it, and the only things stopping me are the total lack of control over it that immediately occurs and my sense of achievement in having given it up (one thing I have been able to stick to over a fairly long period). When I drink again after being AF my whole mind changes, to the extent of not even wanting to try to get sober again for months/years after busting. Actually shame at my family seeing me back on the booze is another thing stopping me. I hope that baclofen plus bupropion may be enough to halt both the depression and the drugs, so will try to stay AF and hope for indifference to these other substances aswell with increasing baclofen doses. Luckily I have not yet had severe reactions to any of this stuff but am aware of the danger, and trying to limit use as much as I can. I do tend to agree that cannabis dependence is mainly psychological, and a specific drug treatment for it doesn't really exist; fortunately I have been able to have a few periods of abstinence from it without serious withdrawals but I am going to try 8's weaning-off suggestion if it proves too difficult to just quit again.
Yes depression is an illness, one I've had since my teen years or early 20's, although mine was preceded by social anxiety/phobia and an intense loneliness that occurred because of my inability to be close to others, especially forming relationships. My particular depression seems largely a reaction to these underlying issues, and so my grabbing of every substance I can find is probably an attempt to escape these issues due to feeling that I cannot otherwise address them...but yes part of it is also wanting whatever high/hit/buzz I can get. Also part of it is due to becoming disillusioned and given-up with standard medical treatments for depression after many years of asking for help. Lo0p, I think like yourself my depression isn't a primary disorder, although it is indeed worsened overall by alcohol; my alcoholism is probably also secondary to the social issues.
I have tried counselling numerous times but found that counsellors/psychologists hardly ever listened to me properly when I'd try to explain myself...they would go off on a tangent as soon as I mentioned the depression or alcohol and would not properly take the original issues into account (although I would often not explain it very well either). I am still open to counselling, but standardised CBT using printed-off homework forms just doesn't seem effective or specific enough, and alternative counsellors are difficult to access where I am. Maybe the biggest barrier when I first sought out counselling was that shyness and other serious social problems did not seem to be recognised as being very serious or worthy of direct therapy.
All this could explain why antidepressants have not worked for me; there may not be much of an underlying depression-causing chemical imbalance for them to work on. Serotonin-affecting drugs have never had much of a positive effect, and those are the usual first-line depression treatments handed out by doctors where I live. I suspect this is also the same elsewhere. Norepinephrine enhancing antidepressants could work better for me but fewer are available. I am trying to get bupropion/Wellbutrin/Zyban precisely because it works differently to the drugs I have already been prescribed (enhances norepinephrine and dopamine action), although ridiculously it is not approved as an antidepressant here in Oz, just as a stop-tobacco-smoking aid.
Anyway sorry for yet another long self-absorbed post. I have tried to explain everything better but it gets so long and complex. AA is one method I am returning to, despite not being much into the spirituality or the dogma. AA's self-searching and self-changing methods are something I think would help me a lot, and something I never gave a committed try when I attended earlier on. I still hope to find a therapist/counsellor but one who is willing and able to spend the time to listen, not just hand out standardised CBT homework forms or tell me theories from textbooks. CBT's ideas, like AA's, have merit but like AA I find that the one standard procedure does not fit all. Maybe I should just print off this post and give that to any therapist I see in future, as it would at least explain things properly!
Other things could be interests and hobbies, a better job, other new goals, other forms of self-improvement, helping other people out, trying to establish a relationship or close friendship...and becoming less self-absorbed and negative. Hopefully these things will be a lot easier to get started on if the depression can be cracked a bit.
Thanks for listening and advising me, and I hope to have better progress to report in the future. Best wishes to you all.
Hey folks thanks very much for the input. As you can probably tell from my last post I'm quite confused and also feeling alarmed about my current substance intake. I usually have control over everything apart from alcohol, so seeing myself take this other stuff is a bit alarming.
Hi Ne, Murph, Lo0p, 8, I'm always interested in reading your opinions, and aware not to take advice as being equivalent to a doctor's (as usual you gave me a laugh Murph the way you stated that). Ne, I have thought about drinking again many times, it is a thought I battle each day. I often think of giving in to it, and the only things stopping me are the total lack of control over it that immediately occurs and my sense of achievement in having given it up (one thing I have been able to stick to over a fairly long period). When I drink again after being AF my whole mind changes, to the extent of not even wanting to try to get sober again for months/years after busting. Actually shame at my family seeing me back on the booze is another thing stopping me. I hope that baclofen plus bupropion may be enough to halt both the depression and the drugs, so will try to stay AF and hope for indifference to these other substances aswell with increasing baclofen doses. Luckily I have not yet had severe reactions to any of this stuff but am aware of the danger, and trying to limit use as much as I can. I do tend to agree that cannabis dependence is mainly psychological, and a specific drug treatment for it doesn't really exist; fortunately I have been able to have a few periods of abstinence from it without serious withdrawals but I am going to try 8's weaning-off suggestion if it proves too difficult to just quit again.
Yes depression is an illness, one I've had since my teen years or early 20's, although mine was preceded by social anxiety/phobia and an intense loneliness that occurred because of my inability to be close to others, especially forming relationships. My particular depression seems largely a reaction to these underlying issues, and so my grabbing of every substance I can find is probably an attempt to escape these issues due to feeling that I cannot otherwise address them...but yes part of it is also wanting whatever high/hit/buzz I can get. Also part of it is due to becoming disillusioned and given-up with standard medical treatments for depression after many years of asking for help. Lo0p, I think like yourself my depression isn't a primary disorder, although it is indeed worsened overall by alcohol; my alcoholism is probably also secondary to the social issues.
I have tried counselling numerous times but found that counsellors/psychologists hardly ever listened to me properly when I'd try to explain myself...they would go off on a tangent as soon as I mentioned the depression or alcohol and would not properly take the original issues into account (although I would often not explain it very well either). I am still open to counselling, but standardised CBT using printed-off homework forms just doesn't seem effective or specific enough, and alternative counsellors are difficult to access where I am. Maybe the biggest barrier when I first sought out counselling was that shyness and other serious social problems did not seem to be recognised as being very serious or worthy of direct therapy.
All this could explain why antidepressants have not worked for me; there may not be much of an underlying depression-causing chemical imbalance for them to work on. Serotonin-affecting drugs have never had much of a positive effect, and those are the usual first-line depression treatments handed out by doctors where I live. I suspect this is also the same elsewhere. Norepinephrine enhancing antidepressants could work better for me but fewer are available. I am trying to get bupropion/Wellbutrin/Zyban precisely because it works differently to the drugs I have already been prescribed (enhances norepinephrine and dopamine action), although ridiculously it is not approved as an antidepressant here in Oz, just as a stop-tobacco-smoking aid.
Anyway sorry for yet another long self-absorbed post. I have tried to explain everything better but it gets so long and complex. AA is one method I am returning to, despite not being much into the spirituality or the dogma. AA's self-searching and self-changing methods are something I think would help me a lot, and something I never gave a committed try when I attended earlier on. I still hope to find a therapist/counsellor but one who is willing and able to spend the time to listen, not just hand out standardised CBT homework forms or tell me theories from textbooks. CBT's ideas, like AA's, have merit but like AA I find that the one standard procedure does not fit all. Maybe I should just print off this post and give that to any therapist I see in future, as it would at least explain things properly!
Other things could be interests and hobbies, a better job, other new goals, other forms of self-improvement, helping other people out, trying to establish a relationship or close friendship...and becoming less self-absorbed and negative. Hopefully these things will be a lot easier to get started on if the depression can be cracked a bit.
Thanks for listening and advising me, and I hope to have better progress to report in the future. Best wishes to you all.
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