Tapering Phenibut to switch to Baclofen

[bostonguy92]

Hello everyone, I am brand new to the forum and am very appreciative of any advice. Here is my short story:

I'm 28 and have an EXTREMELY additive personality. I have become addictive to phenibut and have tried quitting, a few different ways. Luckily, I have never gone above 2-3/day. I will be tapering down very slowly this time and alternating to baclofen for any withdrawls. Here is my plan:

Week 1-2: 2 grams phenibut tapering down to 300mg (increments of 100mgs/day)

Week 3: 20mg Baclofen/day

Week 4: 10mg Baclofen/day

Week 5: 5mg Baclofen/day


Any suggestions?

[terryk]

Tapering Phenibut to switch to Baclofen

bostonguy92;1212514 wrote: Hello everyone, I am brand new to the forum and am very appreciative of any advice. Here is my short story:

I'm 28 and have an EXTREMELY additive personality. I have become addictive to phenibut and have tried quitting, a few different ways. Luckily, I have never gone above 2-3/day. I will be tapering down very slowly this time and alternating to baclofen for any withdrawls. Here is my plan:

Week 1-2: 2 grams phenibut tapering down to 300mg (increments of 100mgs/day)

Week 3: 20mg Baclofen/day

Week 4: 10mg Baclofen/day

Week 5: 5mg Baclofen/day

Any suggestions?

Usual disclaimers (I'm not a doctor, we don't give medical advice here, etc.). I've seen a few folks swing around here with questions (and maybe answers) about Phenibut:

https://www.mywayout.org/community/f2...-me-49538.html

Baclofen and Phenibut are very similar chemically (+/- a chorine atom). Both are GABAb agonists, but Phenibut also has GABAa activity. Baclofen is being used experimentally to treat alcohol withdrawal - I've read a few articles that mention a dose of 30-90mg/day (with benzos available as back up). The big trick with Phenibut is figuring out the equivalent dose for the baclofen and I have no idea how to help you there. Does 300mg Phenibut = 20mg Baclofen on day 1 of Week 3 above? I don't know. I've read about tapering in/up baclofen while tapering out/down GHB/GBL to lessen GHB withdrawal, so maybe that's a model that's worth looking into. Try bluelight.ru, mindandmuscle.net, drugs-forum.com, etc.

Good luck, -tk

[Greg]

Tapering Phenibut to switch to Baclofen

I have seen several different equivalence values between phenibut and baclofen, ranging from 15x to 100x (i.e. baclofen has been said to be 15-100 times stronger dose-wise compared to phenibut). These are only forum posts, either drugs or bodybuilding forums from memory. If there is actual medical literature on phenibut then I have not yet read any of it. Since it is apparently not used medically in Western countries, there may not be much official English-language literature on it.

I have done a few experiments with both drugs, at times when I should not have had any tolerance to GABA-B agonists (I had taken breaks from both baclofen and phenibut when doing these experiments and was also not drinking at the time). For me, about 12.5 mg baclofen (1/2 of a 25 mg pill) was the dose where some relaxation became noticeable, while with phenibut a dose of about 1.0 grams was needed for a similar effect. The comparison was made more difficult due to baclofen's effect being noticeable to me in under an hour, while phenibut for some reason seemed to take 2-3 hours to be noticeable. Anyway my tests would indicate that, for me, baclofen is about 80-100 times stronger. I used to assume the old 15x figure was correct, but now don't think so.

Good luck with your taper and switch to baclofen. Since my above experiments cannot be relied on as an official withdrawal guide, I also suggest that you monitor your own withdrawal reactions when switching to baclofen, and take it as necessary to ward off the phenibut withdrawal. This is how alcohol withdrawal is often managed using benzodiazepines, with the withdrawal being monitored every couple of hours and benzos being administered any time it is becoming too troublesome.

Also follow Terry's advice on checking out those forums, as the people there are likely to have way more experience with this drug than I do.

P.S. Due to phenibut's GABA-A effect, a small dose of a benzodiazepine like diazepam/Valium could be useful too, but I have no idea how to suggest an equivalent dose other than maybe using a small amount like 5-10 mg per day if baclofen doesn't seem to be helping ease some symptoms. At least that small benzo dose should be fairly safe, as people here have been instructed by a doctor to take another benzo alprazolam/Xanax for sleep (in small doses) while they are on baclofen. I have also combined small doses of both Xanax and baclofen without ill effect. But I'll say it again, even though it's in my signature...I am not a doctor and this is not official medical advice!!

[bostonguy92]

Tapering Phenibut to switch to Baclofen

Thank you for your replys. I will keep a day to day log and give feedback on my progress to pass on. Much appreciated.

[Greg]

Tapering Phenibut to switch to Baclofen

Please do post your results once you have had enough time to give it a decent try. I would be very interested in hearing how you go. Good luck!

[blergs]

Tapering Phenibut to switch to Baclofen

im also in the same boat... im an alcoholic... i still havent had a drink in 2.5 years (thank god) but ive been taking phenibut on a consistant basis, upwards of 7-8g a day....

any suggestions on finding an equivalent dose of baclofen?

also, are there places to purchase baclofen for cheap? or is it best to go to a doctor?

[Greg]

Tapering Phenibut to switch to Baclofen

blergs;1252683 wrote: im also in the same boat... im an alcoholic... i still havent had a drink in 2.5 years (thank god) but ive been taking phenibut on a consistant basis, upwards of 7-8g a day....

any suggestions on finding an equivalent dose of baclofen?

also, are there places to purchase baclofen for cheap? or is it best to go to a doctor?

Hi blergs and welcome! Great work not drinking for so long, that is way longer than I have gone so far!!

One of my posts above suggests that I found baclofen to be about 80 times stronger, dose-wise, than phenibut during experimental comparisons. I have also seen a figure of 15 times mentioned on another forum. I don't think there is any official figure, because phenibut is not used medically in most countries. Probably the best way is to start on lowish baclofen doses while stopping phenibut and try and see what amount you need to "fill in" for the missing phenibut. You would want to make sure you didn't let yourself go into serious withdrawal, but also not take such a large amount of baclofen that it could oversedate you or cause serious side effects. I imagine you would have to monitor yourself pretty regularly to begin with, to check for withdrawals and other complications while switching over, much like medical staff have to do when using Valium to detox people from alcohol.

I would also suggest seeing if a doctor or hospital can help you with this; you could at least ask. Keep in mind that none of us on this forum are doctors, myself included, and we cannot give official medical advice. I am not one of the high-dose baclofen users here at this stage, so hopefully one of them will give you more advice. Good luck with it.

[valo]

Tapering Phenibut to switch to Baclofen

I've been tapering off from about 4.5 grams phenibut per day now down to 2.5 grams a day.
Used recreationally I've been at 8-9 grams a day. What I've noticed that due to the long duration you can take a higher dose and a smaller dose the next day without much difference. Then take a slightly smaller high dose and a smaller lower dose etc. and you end up at a somewhat controllable level.

My wake up came when my order of phenibut is missing, luckily some friends had some to give away. So now I'm in a phase where I have to quit almost cold turkey.

BUT now that I've been tapering off as a precaution I feel I'm at a level where lowering phenibut feels actually quite good. And there seems to be no tolerance for the nootropic effects of phenibut.

I got some baclofen today and 20mg certainly feels a lot like a whole gram of phenibut. I'm quite sensitive to the effects of drugs.. except baclofen makes me a bit drowsy. Looks like a small daily dose is easy to withdraw with this stuff.

Good luck folks!

PS :new:

[valo]

Tapering Phenibut to switch to Baclofen

Oh yeah, because phenibut also releases dopamine, I've found out that doing stuff that normally releases it helps a lot. Cleaning, working out etc. Getting fresh air. Cooking.
I think it's this function of phenibut that's the achilles heel in terms of addiction.

L-tyrosine as a supplement increases dopamine levels in the brain.

Tryptophan helps with mood.

Magnesium.

As does rhodiola rosea (roseroot), which is a slight MAO-inhibitor, at a lower dose stimulating and higher dose sedating. But only the real Siberian roseroot.

[blergs]

Tapering Phenibut to switch to Baclofen

thanks all... are source sharing allowed on this forum?