Diphenhydramine (Benedryl) as AL withdrwal Aid

[mg_789]

Its been a while since I've posted here, in the interim unfortunately my alcohol dependence has continued. I tried Bac a while back, and it wasn't right for me.

This post has nothing to do with counter indications of using Bac + Diphenhydramine. Rather, it is about an interesting discovery I made, and I'm curious if anybody else has found similar...

A bit of background; in the past, sometimes my AL dependence got so bad that if I got a full night sleep (i.e. 8 hours lets say) I would wake up feeling really sick, with shaky hands, and would have to force down 1.5-2.0 drinks just not to feel really crap. I would still end up feeling not great, but at least not aweful. There have been times where I would set my alarm for 2-4 hour intervals, so to wake up have a beer or two and go back to sleep again for another 2-4 hours.

I imagine the cause of such distress is AL withdrawal. In the past I have used Gravol (Dramamine) to counter nausea due to withdrawal (active ingredient is diphenhydramine plus a caffeine-like drug to counter the sedative effect of the diphenhydramine).

It occurred to me at some point that since withdrawal is mostly an anxiety type reaction, that any drug that has a sedating effect might be helpful. (Aside from Benedryl, diphenhydramine is the sleep agent in non-prescription sleep aids like Tylenol PM, Nyquil, Nytol...).

When I discovered that Gravol is a sedative, I started taking 1-2 pills before bed to help me get to sleep and maybe combat potential nausea.

What happened was I sleep 12 hours and woke up feeling quite well. The same experience was noticed if taking pure diphenhydramine (25-50mg) before bed. This has been the case for about 2 months.

Although I have not stopped drinking yet, waking up feeling good and not having to force down booze first thing upon waking makes me optimistic that when I'm ready to "dry-out" it might be less difficult than previous attempts.

[Bminor]

Diphenhydramine (Benedryl) as AL withdrwal Aid

Lucky you then, I was in a similar situation in the past and Benadryl (diphenhydramine) and those others did nothing to help me... only benzos ever helped withdrawal for me. Or more booze :H

[BetterAndBetter]

Diphenhydramine (Benedryl) as AL withdrwal Aid

Personally, I've found diphenhydramine really helpful in terms of negating a lot of the withdrawal effects of alcohol addiction. Sort of a "poor man's" benzo. Definitely, not enough if you are really jonesing, but it can help and from what I've looked into... it's fairly safe at sane dosages.

[mg_789]

Diphenhydramine (Benedryl) as AL withdrwal Aid

I like that "poor man's benzo". I do have benzos if I ever get into a dangerous state, but I'm more scared of getting hooked on that than the alcohol... lots of horror stories people people getting hooked on both AL and benzos! So I'm glad I found something safer that helps.

I have read that people who have taken 25-50mg diphenhydramine for years do end up suffering withdrawal symptoms if they stop, but a gradual tappering off should do alright in such a case, and since it doesn't really cause cravings hopefully should not be too hard. (I should note that there is a potential for diphenhydramine abuse; some people take like 10x the normal dose to get high... but if we're not doing that! It should be pretty safe).

[ryrye]

Diphenhydramine (Benedryl) as AL withdrwal Aid

Ive heard glutamate can help, also atenolol has helped me tremendously at times (can be ordered from river pharmacy) for the high blood pressure and anxiety that comes from withdrawls. I am personally taking Baclofen, atenolol as needed, and working on cutting back my alcohol consumption. I am actually leaving for a backpacking trip today to force me to have a few alcohol free days at this point. Have you tried tapering your consumption and moving your alcohol use to a specific time of the night? I have, while cutting back dramatically on my intake, have moved it to where I am only drinking at night.

Anyway, just some thoughts from another alcoholic ... Good Luck to you!

[COSGringo]

Diphenhydramine (Benedryl) as AL withdrwal Aid

Ouch, benzos and AL is what did it for me. That was my wake up call. I had no recollection of anything when I did that mess. That was time for me to really get straight.

I use Diphen now and then to sleep. Nothing wrong with that. I take Bac and I will use dip to help sleep. I am not throwing them back but really I don't think that would matter that much if I am taking it to sleep.

Bac is not for everyone but I would not tie it to the Benadryl being the issue. A lot more SE's when you are drinking hard, trying to quit, and taking the bac. It's tough to quit. If it wasn't we would not have to resort to meds. If you can just watch the drink a little bit and you might feel a bit better. It's a tough call.

I wish you luck either way you go and let us know.

[mg_789]

Diphenhydramine (Benedryl) as AL withdrwal Aid

So I am about 36 hours AL free at the moment, 1st time in about 6 months. Took my typical dose of 50mg Diphen before going to sleep and after finishing my case of beer. As usual, I woke up after about 10 hours sleep with no shakes, sweats or desperation to down a few drinks. I decided since I had no more beer in the house and I am hoping to receive a job offer in the near future, it would be a good time to get things back under relative control. I took 3 dramamine tablets (gravol 50mg - equivalent to 25mg Diphen) 1 every 5-6 hours, and experienced no tremors/shakes/cold sweats/racing pulse as I would typically have had if did not take anything. I did experience some mild anxiety (very mild) and insomnia, but eventually fell asleep for a good 8 hours.

In the past, my first 12 hours were always the worst, and if I could get past 24 hrs then negative side effects of withdrawal would greatly diminish.

The best part, is that this time I used no benzos. Benzos helped with the withdrawal in the past, but would knock me on my ass for a few days (Ativan / Lorazapam to be specific). Today I am feeling fairly awake and clear headed and don't think I will take anymore Diphen until before bed.

[MusiciansMallet]

Diphenhydramine (Benedryl) as AL withdrwal Aid

Yes well, diphenhydramine (Benadryl) & dimenhydrinate (Dramamine & Gravol trade names) are first generation antihistamines which also have efficacy in treating nausea. 50 mg of diphenhydramine is roughly equivalent to ~24 mg of dimenhydrinate. Both will help with nausea (and at least in the US, where I live, dipehn is much cheaper than dimenhydrinate; at least if you buy the generic version. Less than $4 per 100 pills in my area)

Anyway, your experience w/ diphenhydramine or dimenhydrinate (no real difference there, both plug into the H1 receptors as "inverse agonists".. meaning it blocks histamine) is not really surprising to me... my background in this area & my many of my posts espouse this (on pharmacology, neurology, pharmacodynamics, & neuropharmacology). I really don't think it is an interaction dependent upon concurrent use of both alcohol & diphenhydramine--aside from added sedation, but at completely different receptor sites; diphen doesn't even touch the GABA complex, which is mostly likely for alcohol's euphoric effects and/or high.

Once you get used to diphenhydramine, you'll find less sedation though. So you can use half your typical dose prior to planning on drinking to reduce nausea, without risk of sedation. I know this b/c during extreme opiate withdrawal (heroin), I used diphenhydramine; and got up to doses as high as 800 mg per day. After starting baclofen (for dependency upon a GABAergic drug, not alcohol by the way), i've gone down to roughly 50-200mg per day! And granted, I was on these high doses (4 pills a time, roughly 4 times a day; ever since getting on buprenorphine/Suboxone after getting clean from heroin & fentanyl & methadone, 12/22/07)... so, every time I tried to wean or stop diphen at these high doses, I would either get EXTREME rebound nausea (if I stopped quickly) or I would experience severely reduced efficacy of buprenorphine/Suboxone if i'd even wean slowly! So point being: now after baclofen, in under 30 days, i've somehow or someway been able to be fine at 50mg-250mg of diphen a day (or 1-5 pills per day) while also reducing my suboxone use from 4mg a day to 2-3mg a day (even though that wasn't even my intent) without ANY discomfort in either cases.

Anyway! Sorry to get off topic there.. I tend to do that.... heh

[Greg]

Diphenhydramine (Benedryl) as AL withdrwal Aid

Something like mirtazapine (Remeron) could help some people get off anti-histamines, due to its very long half-life (20-40 hours) and enormous anti-histamine power.

[MusiciansMallet]

Diphenhydramine (Benedryl) as AL withdrwal Aid

Mirtazapine is a later generation antihistamine drug; & isn't as selective for H1 receptors as diphenhydramine nor dimenhydrinate is--mirtazapine affects adrenaline (the adenosine receptors) and has other potent side effects at 5-HT receptors (where serotonin binds to). Antidepressants were actually developed from 2nd generation antidepressants like mirtazapine. I would most certainly not recommend this for those actively using alcohol, but that is just my personal opinion from past experienecs.

I mean, I guess if someone is having that huge of an issue with antihistamine dependency (which is very rare), I guess it could be an option. But really, a slow wean is preferable if one chooses to get off of diphenhydramine or dimenhydrinate (assuming the adverse effects are becoming that horrible & dependency is causing severe disruption in the user's life). It isn't like it is heroin or alcohol where maintenance drugs are needed, ya know? In my case, I just didn't find any odd/adverse side effects & it assisted with the potency of buprenorphine (4mg) I am prescribed for past opiate addiction (when I was still using diphenhydramine at high doses, which I am no longer doing; tot be honest; I use 3 pills a day OR 75 mg per day.. usually; but i can and HAVE stopped my use of diphen for several days at any time, w/ no withdrawal effects... but that's just me and my experience tough).

[Ptolemy323]

Diphenhydramine (Benedryl) as AL withdrwal Aid

Sleep and Alcohol Consumption

First, to those of you who can muster 8-10 hours of sleep - kudos, that sounds like an unimaginable goal! I'm typically in the 3 1/2 to 4 hour range, and then I wake and typically begin working.

Withdrawal starts at around the 10-12 hour mark after the last drink, and typically is the mild type - which is to say terrible in and of itself, with markedly elevated blood pressure and that feeling that you're being hung by your ankles from the top of a 100-story building.

I've had two pretty bad episodes, one requiring hospitalization, and I managed to follow that with 61 days of sobriety back in Jan-Feb 2011. In any event, there are times when to continue being productive (I sell high technology capital equipment on 3 continents) I need a nip at around lunch time. This inevitably gives me a boost, and this boost can be relaibly administered over the next 8-10 hours as needed. Just the wrong type of reaction - negative reinforcement I believe its called.

I'll then typically get to sleep at around 11:00 p.m. and wake at 3:00 a.m. sharp, which is just in time to catch Asia at the end their day and Europe near their start. I've frankly never found consuming any alcohol at that hour helps me sleep - it perks me up and off we go toward a more worrisome withdrawal stint - so I try my darndest to avoid violating that covenant. Not always successfully, as is the nature of the beast.

Anyway - I have found dramamine to help, especially if combined with very seriously metered ethanol consumption. I still have to white knuckle it for about 48 hours, but the anxiety is a bit relieved and the amount of alcohol required to eliminate the worst of the withdrawal seems rather reduced. Haven't tried benedryl - but as a kid that used to jack me up too.

Good luck to everyone.

Ptol