What is `abrupt` ?

[joethelion]

What is `abrupt` ?

Being harsh or bossy with her never helped as she becomes aggressive, otherwise she`s soft. I was rather like `I can`t take it anymore. I love you and will be on your side forever if you choose to try and get cured, but this can`t go on like this. I`ll be around, be with the children but I won`t be with you`. Saying I`d take the children would make her hostile.

[StuckinLA]

What is `abrupt` ?

The other thing is that many (most?) rehab centers and recovery folks are actively opposed to medications for addiction. "We don't treat drugs with drugs" and "Your fixation on a pill is standing in the way of your recovery" are the refrains I heard. So keep that in mind--that you might meet resistance.

Another thought: have you tried naltrexone or the Sinclair Method? Can't remember if I saw that or not. But if your wife is willing to take pills, if only to make you happy, it seems like nal might be easier than bac, compliance and SE-wise. Just a pill an hour before she starts drinking. Might be worth a shot.

Of course, I'm not a doctor & this is not medical advice. Best of luck & please forgive any typos. This is my first post from my phone.

[joethelion]

What is `abrupt` ?

Yes StuckinLA, we`re on nal too. In fact TSM helped me control my alcohol problem already. She`s on nal for 10 months now, but maybe because of her heavier drinking for so long, and maybe because she hasn`t been careful about the 1 hour rule, nal only helped with some issues.

[ryrye]

What is `abrupt` ?

My heart goes out to you Joe! My girlfriend and I have had issues with drinking/drugs over the past 7 years and right now I am kind of in your situation, except that my girl has no access to money or a car and this keeps her from drinking, unless i cave in and buy it for her. Now on Baclofen, I am finally able to be sober and strong for her. I am getting frustrated though with how overwhelmed she gets when confronted with even the smallest amount of responsibility. Thankfully though, she is a lot more receptive to treatment than your wife seems to be.

I wish the best of luck to you and your wife. I don't have much to say about your situation, except that it is unfair to your children for them to be around a mother who is drunk all the time. You need to be strong for your kids first and your wife second. She is an adult, and if she does not want to change, there is not a damn thing you can do about it.

[Ne/Neva Eva]

What is `abrupt` ?

Hey, Joe. Great discussion going on here. I know it's very personal to you, but I would bet there are a lot of people walking a similar path. So thanks for sharing it and keeping it alive.
I am really impressed by and grateful for the steps you're taking. For yourself, and your wife and the kids.

Not caring about anything ("depression") sounds to me like a pre-existing or underlying condition. That one in particular scares the bejesus out of me. Rehab and some constant feedback/surveillance, a regular schedule, calories from actual food, those things sound like they might be a real gift for her. They really were for me.

joethelion;1346300 wrote: Being harsh or bossy with her never helped as she becomes aggressive, otherwise she`s soft. I was rather like `I can`t take it anymore. I love you and will be on your side forever if you choose to try and get cured, but this can`t go on like this. I`ll be around, be with the children but I won`t be with you`. Saying I`d take the children would make her hostile.

Thank you, thank you, thank you for having that insight. Being backed into a corner is what got me to my last terrible place. No one works well under those conditions, and I don't believe (in my heart of hearts) that we need to come to a breaking point to decide to get well. Just the opposite, in fact. (Which does not mean, of course, that one need get sucked into the abyss or even grab a ladder and try to climb in and out. You know?)

Power on. I hope things continue to get better. (I trust they will. Believe they will and know they will.)
:l

[spacebebe01]

What is `abrupt` ?

Hi joe, how are you today, I think you said that your away for a while and your wifes parents are with her. I do think that it would be best if she where to titrate down off the baclofen, it would not be safe for her to continue up, I dont think she wants to anyway so the safest thing would probably be for here to be off it IMHO. Detox then rehab could be great for her if you can get her to go, but as has been said, detox wont be able to deal with baclofen withdrawals so she would need to be off that first and then rehabs usually dont allow you to be on any meds, so if she is on benzo's or anything else you would need to be careful about the rehab situation. But, I do think some time away from everything that has been getting her down, whatever it is, all responsibility, no drink, having company, regular meals that she doesnt have to shop and cook could well do her the world of good and give her the chance to start looking at herself and her live and also start dealing with underlying issues such as depression, bonding with her children. I dont think threatening her with leaving and taking the children will get anyone anywhere, just serve to make her feel more guilty, more crap and just worse.

[MusiciansMallet]

What is `abrupt` ?

Neva said it best:

Ne/Neva Eva;1346609 wrote:
Thank you, thank you, thank you for having that insight. Being backed into a corner is what got me to my last terrible place. No one works well under those conditions, and I don't believe (in my heart of hearts) that we need to come to a breaking point to decide to get well. Just the opposite, in fact. (Which does not mean, of course, that one need get sucked into the abyss or even grab a ladder and try to climb in and out. You know?)

In my experience; talking about contentious issues (such as this one)- works best in relationships when you're *NOT* arguing. Sitting the individual down, stating: "this is how i feel [insert words here]" ...and with only FACTS and FEELINGS, not judgements. it takes a third party as well, especially w/ relationships, be it in marriage or a close-family member. A third party (therapist, close friend, etc- just anyone who isn't apart of the drama between the individuals involved) helps in that, each side wont feel like they're being "attacked" since this individual would ideally be coming from a neutral stance. You ideally want to do this, if you choose to, when she is in a lucid state.. i.e., not drunk or overly medicated; but also, not when she's in withdrawal!

Also- writing a letter works very well too. But again, keep tone in mind.. Be careful to not offend & attack, but to just get your point across in a very neutral way; although pointing out objective problems as a result of her behavior/drinking is fair game, just not in a way that seems accusatory, vengeful, or overly blaming.

Good luck to you and your wife! I'm a supple 27-year old male & hopefully will never be married :H But, I can say you are a great husband, at least from what I've gained from your comments so far! All the best! :l

[joethelion]

What is `abrupt` ?

Many thanks again for the kind support and warm words, really, really mean a lot to me, especially from affectionate people like yourselves who know what they`re talking about.

As I mentioned the biggest problem is her closed state. If like the doctors say she can stop drinking (someway, somehow) for several weeks that could save her from depression and then she might start to want a way out like she used to maybe 6-8 months ago and we can go the bac way. We are back at 70mgs now, and I`ll go down as much as I can for now, if and until she agrees to go to rehab, hoping there they`ll not be stupid enough to force her off baclofen.

Btw I know I may have sounded like the unfortunate husband here, but she`s in fact a wonderful, funny girl with a heart of gold and a great mother. I would of course do anything to get her back although nowadays it seems very far from reality.

[joethelion]

What is `abrupt` ?

Her parents are trying to keep her away from drinking by hiding bottles, telling me to take her credit card etc. I tell them this won`t work, but I take the opportunity to get her more or less back to a functioning situation while she drinks just a couple of glasses for now. If she can bear them for a week or so, then we`ll travel to a well-known doctor who prescribes bac, which will give me a better positioning and a safer stance for titrating. Then I can take several months of more of this hell while we titrate up (if the doc gives us hope). If that doesn`t work I don`t know what next.

I left home and living at a friend`s for now, but drop by to see the kids and her.

[joethelion]

What is `abrupt` ?

She`s been AF for three days now, by her own choice. Before that she had 2-3 glasses per day for 2-3 days (after the family intervention). She says she`ll just drink a couple of glasses during weekends. Let`s see if that`ll ever work (maybe with the help of tsm and 70mgs bac ?).

It seems that her depression was a direct result of heavy drinking. She looks much much better now, only after a week away from 3 bottles a day.

We`re still traveling next week to a doc who prescribes bac. I`m very happy with the current situation but I`m by far not sure that this`ll go on like this.

[Ne/Neva Eva]

What is `abrupt` ?

joethelion;1349414 wrote: She`s been AF for three days now, by her own choice. Before that she had 2-3 glasses per day for 2-3 days (after the family intervention). She says she`ll just drink a couple of glasses during weekends. Let`s see if that`ll ever work (maybe with the help of tsm and 70mgs bac ?).

It seems that her depression was a direct result of heavy drinking. She looks much much better now, only after a week away from 3 bottles a day.

We`re still traveling next week to a doc who prescribes bac. I`m very happy with the current situation but I`m by far not sure that this`ll go on like this.

WOOOOHOOOOOOOOOO!

It's okay (really) to give yourself a little room to hope!
It's also okay too if there're some more bumps. Especially since you (she!) just crossed a HUGE line/hurdle/swampy morass of hell. That's so wonderful, JoeTL.

It might help you to remember that the idea of "not drinking forever, ever again" is absolutely terrifying. I had no idea that I didn't want to quit drinking, even when it was the only thing I wanted in the world, and I was working my backside off to get there. It wasn't until after I quit drinking against my will that I realized just how much I wanted to keep drinking forever. It was the only thing I knew. And it was hell. Now it's a distant memory kept alive for me only by the folks from MWO. So chin up, shoulders squared, you did it! Or rather you helped her do it--see that the other side isn't quite so bad...

Seriously. Wow. Rock on, Joe. :l to you both! (and the rest of the family too!)

[joethelion]

What is `abrupt` ?

Thank you very much Ne ! You`re so sweet ! I still feel like a rabbit under flashlight :H, too tense to celebrate ! But I guess you are right, at least I`ve seen that it`s possible to come from there to here. Normally people say it`s never possible to go back to moderate drinking from where she was, but then again TSM and bac are so new, maybe there`s hope.

[Ne/Neva Eva]

What is `abrupt` ?

Hey, Joe.
That stuff doesn't have to be decided right now. Right? There's a bit of a journey to cover between now and deciding what indifference (or extinction) is going to mean for either of you. But it is a HUGE thing that it doesn't have to be decided, isn't it?

You've got a double whammy, you know. Because regardless of how you felt about your drinking, the fact is (likely) that it was dysfunctional. And in dealing with her, focusing on a crisis, you are (probably) not dealing with your own stuff. (If I'm off base, please disregard! Or tell me to stuff it, if that's what you need. Trust me it's been done! :H)

And putting options in front of her right now, "Make this choice, now!" hmmm. That would've messed me up. In fact it did! There were a lot of people around here who were drinking and I could not understand it. The hell of it! Why on earth would they?!?!

Right now it might be a good idea to read, read, read. (If you haven't.) I'll be back later with some threads that helped me and some others I know that are living well, and are contented for the most part.
It also might be a good idea to get into some counseling. The reason that I did (hire a therapist) is because I studied all of the people who went before me and tried to figure out what they did right (or wrong.) I even had an excel sheet! The ones that were really happy often had therapy, or religion, or something similar (meditation practice, for instance.) And they also almost all had a support group of some sort. Even if it was extended family. Sounds to me like you all have that pretty well covered. I used MWO.
The last component seemed to be exercise. There were a lot of hard core exercisers around here back then. I'm not sure if it's a requirement, but I know that it makes me feel really good. Healthy. Strong. Honestly, I don't know that I would have made it, and continued to be so darn happy, had I not been sweating a little bit.

Sorry for long list of things-to-do advice! It's my standard, and I've got to say it at least once. Very likely that you won't have to read it again!

Keep in touch, Joe.

[spacebebe01]

What is `abrupt` ?

WOW Joe, a light at the end of the tunnel, the thing is now all you both need to think of is keeping it in sight. Ne's so right the thought of never drinking again, in fact the thought of doing/not doing anything for ever is way too much. Its just so great that your wife is doing this because of her own choice.

:l's to you and your family x

[joethelion]

What is `abrupt` ?

Although I agree that there is light at the end of the tunnel (and wow, what a relief at last, I never thought I`d feel this way again) we`re by far not there yet. She had half a bottle per day during the weekend (as she had decided), and although she didn`t hurry to get to it, she rather slurped it once she got it. Obviously not a surprise, but `she`s not over it in any way. Let`s see if she`ll keep it as a rule (1/2 bottle per day in weekends), or go back to where she was quickly. I`m trying not to comment, criticize, even ask questions, as none of this helped before. Let`s see what the bac doc will say tomorrow.