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    #16
    Colin, 65

    Baclofen dosage to date.

    I've been keeping notes since 31 July. For the previous 6 weeks I increased slowly to 112.5mg. Like many people I tried to speed things up but that was not a clever move. The only SE that has been a problem is the somnolence/doziness during the day. As long as I'm not tempted to drink I'll take plenty of time going up.

    Here are some of the more notable events during the last few months:-

    2 Aug: An almost euphoric feeling - comparable to the first couple of weeks when citalopram really began to work for me.

    3 Aug: No trace of anxiety or depression. I don't know what provoked this note. Anxiety has never been a problem as far as I can remember and depression has not been a problem since beginning with Baclofen.

    5 Aug: I was reminded of a sad event during my stay at the 12-step clinic. A counselor (like many of the employees he was an "alcoholic in recovery") asked a group of us how many people prayed during their stay in the clinic. I was surprised at something more than 50% saying that they did. When he suggested that it would show the appropriate measure of humility to pray on one's knees beside the bed I thought "I thought I was in the wrong place and now I know it." They really wanted everyone to hand over all responsibility to a higher power and make sure you were uncomfortable while doing so.

    8 Aug: Noted that I seemed to have adjusted to the Baclofen dosage and that I was feeling somber. Was there a connection?

    9 Aug: Increased the Baclofen to 125mg and noticed a significantly improved mood. Any connection?

    15 Aug: Increased to 137.5mg

    16 Aug: Played bridge (the card game) very badly due to the difficulty concentrating under the influence of Baclofen.

    18 Aug: Very hot (35 degrees) Somewhat dozy, not unpleasant, vaguely lascivious.

    22 Aug: Sleepy in the evening and wondering whether I might have reached my limit. Back down to 125mg.

    23 Aug Back to 137.5 still trying to push things along.

    25 Aug: Very positive mood. Everything seems possible. However too dozy. Decided to spread the dosage out to 4 x 25 + 3 x 12.5. I'm not giving up easily!

    27 Aug: Started looking at my blood pressure. Before beginning Baclofen it was 125/80 in a restful state. With the Baclofen it varied around 135/73 before a pill and 120/68 an hour after the pill. Nothing spectacular but confirmation about the influence on blood pressure.

    4 Sept: Still noticeable improvements at the gym. I was in terrible shape at the beginning of April but currently I'm improving my performance on at least one of the exercises every day. Later on I saw that Lo0p reported that Baclofen seemed to improve his form.

    13 Sept: The rediscovered interest in exercise continues. A significantly improved physical condition does no emotional harm.

    21 Sept: Played some bad bridge in the evening.

    22 Sept: OK, I'm too dozy at 137.5 drop down to 130.

    23 Sept: Seemed much happier at the new dosage. Around this time discovered MyWayOut and was surprised at the remarkable erudition of some of the contributors.

    29 Sept: The new dose seemed OK so increase to 135. Saw that Murphy had been rusticated from MWO. A lot of what he wrote made a lot of sense but he was too repetitive. Probably a good time for him to disengage. Still the clowns who pushed him out seem to be a humourless bunch.

    3 Oct: Blood pressure (126/62) For me there is a clear correlation between low diastolic and tiredness. New rule is (diastolic < 70) => delay the Baclofen.

    4 Oct: The Baclofen generated visual disturbances of the last few days have departed. Noted that Clearhead247 had killed herself. Cold turkey with Baclofen and a dodgy clinic can be a literally fatal combination.

    15 Oct: Increased to 140mg. I seem to be tolerating the smaller increases much better.

    17 Oct: Slept 10 hours without once wakening. It is many moons since anything like that ever happened.

    20 Oct: Woke at about 5 a.m. and found myself gnawing away at a problem. There was no way I could do anything about the problem in the next couple of days, let alone at 5 in the morning but this kind of objective logic was no good. I took another 25mg and soon went back to sleep again. Awoke feeling just fine and the problem had retreated into a more appropriate place in my grand scheme. No problem at all with the extra 25mg. Will a big increase be an option if I ever seem to be stuck?
    If for nothing else I'm glad to notice that Baclofen can prevent me from chewing on daft problems.

    21 Oct: Increase to 145mg. Seems OK at the moment.

    Comment


      #17
      Colin, 65

      Hi Colin & Welcome !

      :welcome:

      I'm very glad you're here. You've had an amazing journey.

      I really liked your poem. I understand it completely and as I have three children I am trying very hard not to extend the misery. :h

      Stay CLose,

      :l
      On My Own Way Out Since May 20, 2012
      *If you think poorly of yourself, you can fail with a clear conscience.
      https://www.mywayout.org/community/f11/tool-box-27556.html tool box
      https://www.mywayout.org/community/f19/newbies-nest-30074.html newbie nest

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        #18
        Colin, 65

        Still reading. Still enjoying and appreciating your input Colin.

        Comment


          #19
          Colin, 65

          October 22-29

          Oct. 22: Added 5 mg yesterday (140 -> 145) and noticed a change this morning after the first pill. Dozy pretty much all day but not completely absent.
          Oct. 23: Forgot a pill at 8 pm and took twice as much at 11 pm. Not the first time I've done this and it still makes no noticeable difference. If I need to be alert in the evening I might simply delay a pill until I go to bed.
          Oct. 24: Hard to say but I seem to be slightly dozier in the morning due to the double dose before bed last night. Does the active Baclofen level reduce more slowly when sleeping? Great weather and after working in the garden there was no trace of a stiff back - caused by Baclofen or the greatly increased exercise or both? Whatever the reason I'm not complaining. In bed at 11 but, unusually for me, didn't fall quickly asleep. Took an extra 25mg at 12 and slept well until 8:30.
          Oct. 25: Dozy all day. The extra pill last night should probably be treated as the first of the next day and it also seems like a bad idea. A danger of becoming addicted to Baclofen as a sleeping pill? In addition to feeling dozy all day I napped for 40 minutes in the afternoon.
          Oct. 26: Played bridge in the evening and noticed the bad effects (somnolence) after the evening pill. Next time I need to be alert I'll delay the pill until I go to bed.
          Oct. 27: Increased to 150 mg. Getting impatient with the slow increase. Will stay at this level for at least a week before another increase.
          Oct. 28: Woke in a very positive mood. Is this the Baclofen? Almost certainly. It's a fine clear autumn day and I'm in a good humour. Don't argue with success!
          Oct. 29: Woke at 7 am after 8 hours sleep, had the first pill and went back to bed bit didn't sleep. Got up at 8 and didn't notice any change due to the unusually early Baclofen. I'll be seeing the addiction doctor this week and will ask for 175 mg per day in 5mg steps. He hasn't prescribed above 150 before but I don't anticipate a problem - we shall see.

          Comment


            #20
            Colin, 65

            I have been reading your story and even though I am abstainant I was first piqued by your atheism, then got hooked on the story.

            Tough one aren't you?

            Comment


              #21
              Colin, 65

              Colin;1401483 wrote: A danger of becoming addicted to Baclofen as a sleeping pill?
              :H Not very likely, Colin. There's always a first for everything, though. Baclofen is not addictive, however.

              kuya;1401488 wrote:

              Tough one aren't you?
              Kinda seems that way, doesn't it? :H British men... I can't imagine what it's like to date over there.

              Comment


                #22
                Colin, 65

                I saw the addiction specialist this morning and he made his position clear on the purpose of Baclofen. He considers the fairly high Baclofen dose (150 mg per day) as an aid to helping me on the way to complete abstinence. He does not seem to have understood the notion of a controlling dose as described by Ameisen and others. I made a poor job of trying to explain that I wanted to try some alcohol because I wanted to know whether I was anywhere near a dose which could be considered as my limit.

                When I started this journey with Baclofen I accepted that my absence of cravings would be a problem when it came to recognising my controlling dose. I intended to continue increasing the dose until the side effects became unacceptable and since the side effects have become an increasing problem I am amenable to the suggestion that I might have reached the cutoff point. My original plan was to gauge the effectiveness of Baclofen by testing with live ammunition and if necessary continuing increasing the dosage.

                Clearly my expectations are some distance from the doctor's. In the month before our next meeting I will stop the increase and if necessary might even slightly decrease in an attempt to minimise the somnolence.

                Comment


                  #23
                  Colin, 65

                  Ne/Neva Eva;1401511 wrote:


                  Kinda seems that way, doesn't it? :H British men... I can't imagine what it's like to date over there.
                  Oi Ne, I'm British and under that very very tough exterior beats a heart ( that's all) :H:H

                  Comment


                    #24
                    Colin, 65

                    kuya;1403228 wrote: Oi Ne, I'm British and under that very very tough exterior beats a heart ( that's all) :H:H
                    Oh, I know, Kuya. Took me a while to figure it out, but I am very fond of a Brit I met here. He's not the robot I thought he was. I have finally figured out what "stiff upper lip" looks like, though. :H

                    American men, I think, are downright mushy in comparison. :H (huge generalization, and totally tongue-in cheek)

                    Oh. And hi Colin! don't mind us while we banter on.

                    Comment


                      #25
                      Colin, 65

                      Tis amazing the effect of upbringing, quite scary really how we can teach kids to suppress their emotions. Control is one thing,denial quite another.

                      Comment


                        #26
                        Colin, 65

                        Ne/Neva Eva;1403441 wrote: I have finally figured out what "stiff upper lip" looks like, though.
                        Do you also know what it feels like?

                        Comment


                          #27
                          Colin, 65

                          omg no. I cannot even begin to imagine.

                          Comment


                            #28
                            Colin, 65

                            Spititual Considerations.

                            My parents were active Presbyterians and I followed them along to church until I was about 12 years old, at which age I began slowly severing my connections with Christianity. By the age of 20 I could reasonably describe myself as an atheist. The notion of a God made no sense at all to me and although I had not replaced religion with anything else, I considered the matter to be closed.

                            Having settled the religious question it was not at all difficult for me to reject the 12-step requirement to place all responsibility and hope in a deity.

                            Voltaire's view of Confucius might be a useful starting point if I experience a need for a formal personal philosophy:-

                            Confucius has no interest in falsehood; he did not pretend to be prophet; he claimed no inspiration; he taught no new religion; he used no delusions; flattered not the emperor under whom he lived...

                            kuya: I hope this helps to explain why the science behind some pills offers me more hope than the 12-step industry.

                            Orange Papers provides additional evidence for my view.

                            Comment


                              #29
                              Colin, 65

                              For me Colin, it was more the defensiveness I encountered whenever I questioned the 'truth'. Even as a child it felt odd that something 'good' caused so much anger. Then one day I awoke to the thousands of religions that have existed throughout the ages and realised what a nonsense it was

                              Comment


                                #30
                                Colin, 65

                                I spent some time with Confucius many years ago. He wasn't one for humor either.

                                I think the Orange papers are as full of malarkey as the things they're trying to dispute. Not that I'm an apologist for the program. Or for religions in general. egad. That's not something I'd venture into here, though.
                                In general, I'm eternally grateful that I took the pill. It works. The science, what little there is, is there to back it up. And it definitely reorganized my thinking about what this thing we call alcoholism is, and how best to treat it. It ain't with prayer. At least not alone. Better luck prayin' the gay away. Ya' know? (That was a joke folks. Hope it translates. Could just be an American thing...)

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