Need Help. 12 years GBL addiction (4 years of hell). Baclofen, suplements help please

[dylesid]

Hello,

Friend of mine, from small country in Europe (forgive him his bad english), asking me about help. This is his letter:

Quote:
"I have been taking GBL since year 2007. Now it doesn't meter how often. In general long marathons 24/7 and some breakers in between. This December, I mean last December I tried to finish it and stop it in different way than usual cold turkey. So I bought from the "street" 50 x 2mg triangle Indian Xanax pills, and 40 x 1mg Etizolam to be prepare to quit GBL in benzo way. In reality I didn't prepare myself theoretically. So before (september, october) I tried some other benzos, just curiosity, bromazepam, other xanax's, temazepam, lorazepam, diazepam, so probably I had some tolerance builded. I had no withdrawalsyndromes probably because I just switched automatically on GBL (GABA receptors) and that is why I didn't noticed those first syndromes like photophobia, cramps and so on.

Anyway on 21th of December 2012 I stopped GBL and started to mix alcohol 4-8 strong 7.8% lagers every day with Xanax and etizolam in amounts above. There was no plan, no schedule. I just stupidly didn't prepare myself for what I planed to do. I finished those mixes at midnight 28/29th of December. So around 9 days of sleep attempting, mood elevating, doing stupid things. Since 29th of December I am on cold turkey, experiencing muscle twitching, cramps, cold and hot waves, cold sweat, hot sweat, feeling that your heart try very hard to work, tension, unusual heart beat 69 bpm or 72 while normally I have 85 bpm. ringing or pulsating in ears or one ear., blurred vision, voices, photophobia. Almost no sleep or short naps with horror dreams. Saturday I took 20 mg of Propranolol (beta blocker) around 10am, Sunday 10 mg of Propranolol the same time, then Monday 20mg of Propranolol around 10 am, and then 1st of January 10mg of Propranolol around 1am because symptoms above like epinephrine/adrenaline release, sweating and so on were unbearable, something like peak with blackness swirling, dancing, call it seizure maybe. Last night I didn't sleep at all or performed some kind of series of naps not even sure am I sleeping or imagining sleeping. Today I almost did not eat, just drank some soya supplement cocktail. My heart is making experimental beating, slow fast, I must lay down to avoid 150 bpm. To avoid this situation I took 20 mg of Propranolol 3 hours minutes ago and waiting. But still my chest is burning, muscle twitches, high tension...

Now the question is, apart of the stupidity of what have I done, what to do now? I have got nothing apart of betablockers, Melissa, valerian root. I might have some GBL tomorrow on Thursday. But it would be a circle another GABA switch, back to the same rails...beside my GABA is really fu**ed up."

Then he sent me some details:

Quote:
"I thought about Perazine I have it. It's Antipsychotic drug in schizophrenia treatment with sleeping properties. But it might lowers the seizure threshold. So not that way...

Maybe SSRE Mirtazapine. To help sleep. But it might create long lasting horror dreams or just do something unpredictable.

Please help. Is it just a beginning of my nightmares, a culmination, a peak? How to escape... ((( what to do.

PS. Sorry for the chaos above and poor English...

Edit:

I have just just read longecity.org/forum/topic/53981-protracted-benzo-withdrawal-and-gotu-kola-piracetam-bacopa/ and I have got Gotu Cola capsules but I am afraid to try. I have also discovered that I must avoid GABA antagonists so valerian root would be a bad choice.

Edit 2

According this, Gotu cola should be avoided as well. All GABA receptor antagonists should be avoided. I should buy l-theanine, bacopa munnieri, AFOBAZOL, lithium orate...
"After 2 days another letter:

Quote:
"I was in ER last night, the withdrawal syndromes were unbearable. They gave me 10 mg Diazepam and sent home and told me to come back at the morning to see psychiatrist.

So I came back this morning and they told me that a hospital cannot prescribe me any medications and sent me to a GP who probably cannot prescribe me Diazepam as well and some kind of drug and alcohol services (referral letter) to give me diazepam. The problem is I know this service, and they have some doctor who can prescribe Diazepam, but you must be on the long list of waiting people...
And I needs help ASAP. I understood that what I did is ridiculous, but NHS system is even more surreal...
I bought than diazepam on a well known deep hidden internet website and I wait for it now "

The same day letter from him:

Quote:
"Well, that was a Welsh medical service. They really know little or nothing about GBL abuse. I was a witness a wile ago when they described GBL as a glue and they were printed out every information from the internet. But this doesn't meter now.

I definitely increased the dose between 2007-2012. To feel normal I would take 1-1.5ml of GBL in 2007 and 2-2.3ml in 2012. For sleep 2-2.5ml in 2007 and 3 ml in 2012. But mine GABA system is in so bad shape, I believe, that I remember those rare, but still, times when I had to take 5-8ml GBL (on one time) PLUS 12ml homemade GHB to induce "normal" sleep every 3 hours. But this is another sad story.

This morning I just could not manage all those Benzodiazepine Withdrawal Symptoms (or as it might be: GABA A and GABA B dysregulation and glutamatergic syndrome) so I tried 25 mg of Baclofen pills (which came today from India and were primary mine first attempt to recover from GBL Withdrawal Symptoms, but they were somewhere between the UK and India from the beginning of the December) but they did no work so I tried GBL again 3 ml and this helped indeed. I slept deep sleep for about 3 hours (a reminder: since last Saturday I slept in total 7 hours REM only sleep) and I have no more all those BWS I had before. I know this is a bad decision but I just could not cope with all hallucinations and sweating I had this terrible information about diazepam from the psychiatrists. I said to myself, if this is what I need to do, I will do it, if I cannot get any fast help from the NHS, I need to get diazepam from the black market, but before I need to do something with all those BWS I have. Baclofen might be just bad that is all (I do not trust Indian pills, but that day it was the only way to get it). But I know it could help because of this: Erowid Experience Vaults: GBL - Severe Addiction and Effective Treatment - 91760 and originally by this http://www.drugs-forum.com/forum/sho...d.php?t=172924 and some NHS report (or some GBL Withdrawal syndrome clinic I do not remember well) which I cannot find but it looked very similar in graphic design to your PDF http://www.erowid.org/chemicals/ghb/ghb_addiction2.pdf.

So what I tried to do was (from the beginning) to get out from the GBL WS with Xanax (bad Idea, and not such a dosages but lower dosages means less Xanax taken per day) and then Baclofen and then some supplements. What did not know was how severe might be Benzodiazepines WS, especially short acting benzos like Xanax. Now I messed up (because I need to work it out alone and I do it in a panic) so I need to wait for diazepam, and some Baclofen from Spain (no need for prescription, surprisingly), Bromazepam (just in case) and some supplements like Bacopa monnieri and so on (Taurine following your advice but also need to have more information because of this http://www.longecity.org/forum/topic...60#entry528872 taurine is GABA antagonist, I am confused). I have found very interesting posts on http://www.longecity.org/forum/topic...a/#entry498458 (as I said before). But mine case is more difficult because it includes dysregulated GABA A and dysregulated GABA B and glutamatergic syndrome... "OK, an finally after 2 more days he send me this letter:





Quote:

"My right hand is numb for about 1.5 week (hospital appointment) tomorrow, I hope it is not permanent, so i write just left hand and 2 fingers (I realize how surrealistic it all sounds).

Everything is even more complex than it was on the beginning. I am buck to GBL addiction 24/7 2.5 ml every 3h. But I have strong medical help now, not in front of medical care (you just cannot count on it), but simple medicines have 45 strips of Baclofen 25 mg which is 450 pills of 25 mg Baclofen, 4 strips ofLYRICA 75 mg (56 pills), 25 pills of 10 mg Diazepam and 20 polls of 2m Clonazepaman, Betablocker Propranalol, and all sorts of supplements after withdrawal syndromes:

I must avoid GABA antagonists, so i hope i did not include examples of these in the rest of my pharma-help:

- Beta Alanine (surprisingly it completely removes almost all GBL withdrawal syndromes
- l-theanine
- bacopa munnieri
- lithium orate
- taurine
- vit B12 and B6
- Zinc
- Magnesium Malate
- Meletonin
- Garlic extract

(any others supplements might help?)


I will try also to get from somewhere (any good, trusted source???):
-Afobazole: Afobazole - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

So any help in sort it out and segregate what first, second, next, avoid, would be really help because my condition is not very good, euphemistically speaking...

Maybe some Baclofen day by day dosage (withdrawal syndromes are bad after to long Baclo as well?"

Regards,
Kapelusznik

[Colin]

Need Help. 12 years GBL addiction (4 years of hell). Baclofen, suplements help please

MyWayOut is solely intended for alcoholics however..

Suppression of Alcohol Dependence Using Baclofen: A 2-Year Observational Study of 100 Patients is good advice to doctors treating alcoholism. It includes a dosing guide which it is very important to understand. Baclofen is NOT addictive but most patients can only tolerate small changes (+- 10 mg per day) with daily dose changes at most once every 4-7 days. The most important limiting factor is the side effect of somnolence. In your friend's case this might be considered a good side effect. Everyone reacts differently to baclofen. When self-medicating your friend will need to be able to trust his own reactions to baclofen bearing in mind that the full impact of a dosage change will not be apparent for the first 4/5 days. When used for treating alcoholics LDB (low dose baclofen) 30-60 mg per day has been found helpful in reducing some patient's cravings. It might help your friend.

BACLOFEN IS NOT ADDICTIVE but when terminating baclofen you should go slowly down over a period of 10-15 days. Abrupt termination of baclofen is NOT an option - psychotic attacks are just one of the consequences of cold-turkey with baclofen.

Any advice you get from this site will be from people who are experts on themselves and their own treatment of alcohol with baclofen. Nobody, as far as I know has a medical qualification.

[Otter]

Need Help. 12 years GBL addiction (4 years of hell). Baclofen, suplements help please

Baclofen is being used now in England for GBL addiction at the Royal Maudsley Hospital in London so your friend's doctor needs to get in touch with them, or with Dr. Lingford-Hughes at the Neurology Dept. of the Imperial College in London as they are also heavily into baclofen. They all know each other.

[London Lad]

Need Help. 12 years GBL addiction (4 years of hell). Baclofen, suplements help please

Baclofen

The Club Drug Clinic in central London is direct access- your friend can get an appointment there without going through their GP.

Their website is:
www clubdrugclinic.cnwl .nhs .uk

Whilst London may be a long way to travel for treatment, they may be able to assess them and then advise their GP on what to prescribe and also provide some telephone consultations / support.

The Maudsley Hospital (who runs the 'Party Drugs Clinic') charge for their services and if your friend uses them then their local health trust will be sent a bill for a few thousand pounds and they may not authorise the referral.

Whereas, the Club Drug Clinic does not charge other parts of the NHS for their services, as they are funded by lottery money.

A comment was made above that this site is for alcoholics, which is fair enough. However, I would like to share my experiences briefly to highlight that GBL use is linked with alcoholism.

I became addicted to GBL in early 2009 and had to do some 'DIY detoxes' that involved drinking a considerable amount of alcohol. GBL withdrawal is life threatening and symptoms would start to manifest about 70 minutes after my last dose. If I didn't have any GBL I needed to get large amounts of alcohol into me as quickly as possible. At around 100 minutes after my last dose my delirium would be so bad I would be no longer conscious of what's going on. I'd be in a seizure like state, would have visual and auditory hallucinations and memory loss would kick in. On one occasion I spent 9 days in a coma and nearly from withdrawal delirium.

On many occasions after giving up G, alcohol dependence can materialise very quickly. People who were G-dependent are at significant risk of alcoholism. Whilst this site is for 'alcoholics', I hope that people can be sympathetic to people with GBL or GHB addiction because these people have very similar problems to those with alcoholism and they are likely to become the alcoholics or tomorrow.