Baclofen and the man on mars

[Juan BH]

Baclofen and the man on mars

Hang in there Mars! This thing will work, just give it time. Your relationship with alcohol is changing and that's tough, but good. I think they say jkttdp- just keep taking the dam pills or whatever it is you are taking

[skullbabyland]

Baclofen and the man on mars

Hang in there and keep taking the pills Mars... the SE's do suck but I do believe the oldtimers on MWO that assure us that they do subside... and that it's worth it to keep the faith and keep with the proticol. Good luck and strength to you....

[MaryGoRound]

Baclofen and the man on mars

man on mars;1515641 wrote: I am holding at 200 mg for now. My plan has been to titrate up rapidly until the SEs became too much...


The good news is that I'm drinking slowly. The bad news is that I feel depressed. A coworker called me at about 9 PM and I couldn't bear to answer it, a wave of anxiety washed over me. Last night, I also got pretty depressed about six drinks into my nine-drink evening. I think part of it is shame over not having the willpower to make this work. I know this is a mental illness, but I still feel so guilty. Like I am failing.

Don't get too worried. I also got the anxiety and the depression at doses over 200. Part of it is the medicine. There is some real changes happening to the chemicals in your brain. I also started seeing my behavior for the first time...it was not a good sight.

On my way up, 200-210 did not work. I wanted to be mostly abstinent but I could not. This dose level dimmed my cravings but not enough. I was still drinking. When I got to 230-240 it worked. Just the slight difference did the trick. Who knows, your switch may be at 240, 250, 260, 280+.

I could only tolerate my switch dose for about 10 days and came down. I found the depression, somnolence, and general zonkiness to be too much at the switch. The interesting part is on the way down a dose of 200-210 worked just fine. I am at 170 six weeks after the switch and still good.

[Sticky]

Baclofen and the man on mars

Hi MoM

You are doing well. I too felt envious of people who switched at lower doses and/or had fewer SE's. Until a counsellor said of life in general - "It's not a race and don't compare yourself with other people." Some people here don't work or have kids so they can titrate up much faster. I so wanted to be like Mr A in Amiesen's book who hit the switch at 140. He then took 100 and 40 extra if required and was able to drink socially for work without having more than 3 on any one day. No such luck!

Bac has made me depressed at 140/150 before Xmas, then at 170, 190, 180 and 210 this year. Then I had a few people telling me bac does not make you feel depressed, which didn't help! I wasn't drinking every day either. It makes sense that a drug that makes you feel really tired and takes pleasure away from drinking will make everything else in life less pleasurable.

Keep up the good work.
Cheers
Sticky

[man on mars]

Baclofen and the man on mars

I appreciate the support. Thanks, folks.

Still holding at 200 mg. I am now taking 50 mg 4 times per day, which is wonderfully convenient compared to the constant pill-splitting that I had to do when I was taking 5 doses. The SE's are mostly getting better. I am experiencing a lot less somnolence, and the unpleasant "stoned" feeling is steadily fading away. Still not sleeping well, but every night is a little bit better. The fact that I have kept my drinking in the single digits for the last several days has helped a lot.

One SE that is bothering me a lot right now is a feeling of dryness in my throat that won't go away. I'm having coughing fits several times throughout the day. I try to sip on water to relieve it with little success. This has quickly become the most bothersome SE during the daytime.

A positive SE is my continued lack of need for caffeine. I guess it must be the "bac buzz" that's keeping me alert and motivated during the day. I get into work, fire up the computer, and start plugging away, and I don't need to chug a cup of coffee to fuel myself. It's only a couple hours after lunch, when I've still got a couple of hours left on my shift, and the baclofen-induced somnolence reaches its high point, that I finally decide to have a cup.

On the pill supply front...I still haven't called Dr. L yet. 7 PM CST rolls around and I never work up the nerve to actually step out of the office and make the call. Knowing that option is available is nice to have in my back pocket, though. The liquid baclofen option is a second fallback. I have enough pills left to last almost two weeks at 200 mg/day. Tonight, I was happy to see that my latest shipment is now inbound into customs, and as long as it clears, I should have it within the next week. By that point, I expect my tolerance to the 200 mg level will be very good, and I will feel comfortable resuming my titration upward. If 300 mg is what it takes, so be it.

[skullbabyland]

Baclofen and the man on mars

Mars,

Great to hear that the SE's are becoming more manageable and less intrusive... That's fantastic, as is your keeping the alcohol units in single digits... great progress :goodjob:

Keep it up!

[man on mars]

Baclofen and the man on mars

Day 47. Shipment cleared customs this morning. Should arrive in the next two days. To celebrate, I've resumed titrating upward. I held at 200 mg for 9 days. Today I bumped my morning and evening doses up by a quarter pill, so 213 mg today. It was amazing how much the SEs increased just from bumping my morning dose from 50 to 56 mg. I got stuck in traffic on the way home and had to fight really hard to stay awake.

Drinking has been on the upswing the last few nights. Averaged 10/night for the last four days. The 200 mg level is clearly not enough.

300 mg, here I come.

[man on mars]

Baclofen and the man on mars

Day 51. I tried to titrate really aggressively. 200 to 213 was manageable. 213 to 225 was heavy but manageable. 225 to 231 knocked me on my ass. I got home from work and took my evening dose. Could not fight the sleepiness and took a 3-hour nap at 8 PM. This kept me up til 3 AM, and I had to drink heavily to knock myself out. I dropped back to 225 the next day (yesterday). 225 so far today, and I may tack on another quarter pill before bed. I would have been better off just adding a quarter pill every day like I was before.

Tried for an AF night again last night. Got through dinner, but an hour later at 8 PM the cravings were overwhelming and I opened a beer. A short while later, after two beers, I started looking at my housing situation and started panicking a bit because I have to move out in two weeks and I don't have a new place lined up yet. Couldn't stop dwelling on that. Decided to drink until I was no longer freaking out about it. It worked, eventually, and after a total of 11 drinks, I finally went to bed. This morning was not fun. But I am pretty sure I would have stopped after about four or five if I hadn't gotten so stressed out. Those first two drinks were consumed at a rate of one per hour before I switched into "drink to kill feelings" mode.

Went out to dinner with my parents, siblings, and some family friends tonight. I looked at the beer menu and spotted a strong IPA that I like. I ordered one, thinking "I want to get as much alcohol as possible while looking like I'm not drinking that much" and intending to drink two. I then proceeded to drink it very slowly. 2/3 of the way through, I decided I preferred the glass of water. I did finish the beer, but it felt difficult, and when it was gone I really did not want another.

Bought some IPA on the way home. A brand that has always been a favorite. It's not very good. I'm not really enjoying drinking it. I'm sure I'll have a few, but I'm kind of amazed at how much I'm not liking this beer that I used to love.

[Juan BH]

Baclofen and the man on mars

Sounds like it's working to me Mars.

[man on mars]

Baclofen and the man on mars

250 mg. 5x50 on 3-hour intervals. It's manageable, but the somnolence is brutal, and I only got about 3 hours of sleep last night. Only four drinks yesterday. That is the lowest I have gone since April 18. I thought about opening a fifth, but the "just go to bed" voice was louder than the "have one more" voice, which usually can't happen until at least drink #7. I am now just 20 mg shy of Ameisen's switch dose. Hopefully I don't have to go a lot higher.

I keep sending emails that make me look stupid, or were just a bad idea in general, to large groups of people at work that I regret a couple of hours later. I am going to have to be a lot more careful what I put in writing while I am at this level because this is getting out of hand. There have been three incidents in the last week. Really bad one today. This is not like me at all. Completely ruined what was otherwise an amazing start to the week. I can't stop thinking about it. I am now drinking to kill the shame.

[Ne/Neva Eva]

Baclofen and the man on mars

Hey, MoM. Could it be that you are just feeling particularly self-conscious? I definitely had that experience when I was titrating up. Especially about stuff I wrote! Maybe before you start feeling really, really badly about it you can think about it from the perspective of the person on the receiving end. The receivers might not think anything is amiss...

I guess I'm suggesting that when I was titrating up, I sort of lost touch with accurate perspective of what/how other people perceived what was going on with me. (If I actually ever really had that!) That was especially true if I wrote something via email.

And just so you know, shame has been shown in actual research to be a really compelling bad thing for positive outcomes. I think that's especially true in this disease. You are doing all the right things, in the moment, to help yourself. The day to day stuff that is happening right now will only matter later in that you are successfully treating this terrible disease. I know you might not be able to see that, but I hope you'll trust me on that one. When you look back it will likely be with a "meh. Whatever. I am more now than I ever have been and it was well worth the perceived embarrassment." Plus, if you can't grasp onto that right now there's always this thing that works/ed for me: f*ck 'em.

[man on mars]

Baclofen and the man on mars

I wish I could say it was just perception, Ne, but it's legitimate. I have been on the receiving end of stern replies from customer representatives. I have volunteered to do awful (and ultimately unnecessary) work that I now can't get out of. Today I tried to be helpful, but was instead an arrogant (and it turns out, very WRONG) asshole, and CC'ed half of my company while I was at it. I have a lot of political capital saved up at work, but I've added a lot of red marks in the last week.

I really, really have to start thinking long and hard about what I have written when I send electronic messages from here on out. I almost posted a reply in another thread on MWO a few minutes ago and had to hit the back button after I typed it out because the advice I was about to give was probably pretty irresponsible.

[Ne/Neva Eva]

Baclofen and the man on mars

Sorry, then. I've done that too. Hell, I still do it. (Now it's just unrelated to bac, and related to lapse of decent judgment in my normal mode. )

But I understand and really am sorry that it's going on. Bac can wreak havoc on judgment and perspective in both directions. Hang in there!

[joanna_d]

Baclofen and the man on mars

try not to worry too much about the drinking. though it makes life very very hard combined with the already high baclofen level, sounds like the switch is near and soon you'll be so sober you wont know what to do with yourself.
when i switched, i went from 18 or more glasses to zero in one day.
hang in there.

(EDIT) by the way: gaba affects dopamine levels. feelings of depression as an effect seems very plausible to me. and don't forget your in a titanic struggle right now (not the boat. the greeks ). that has it's effect too. so does persistent drinking.
i had them mostly pre switch. of course going down after 2 months helped a bunch with liveliness.

[man on mars]

Baclofen and the man on mars

Day 58. I am trying 25 mg taken every 1:15 hrs. Today's target is 275 mg. Now at Ameisen's highest dose.

The 250 mg level was clearly not enough. I was hopeful, as on my first day at 250, I held it to 4 drinks, got sleepy like a normal human being (didn't have to drink til I passed out like usual) and went to bed. Drink count for the following five nights was 11, 10, 13, 6, 14. I hadn't had more than 12 in a night since day 25.

Last night was bad. I went to a party and brought a flask of vodka because I was concerned that there wouldn't be enough beer to go around. I ended up doing seriously alcoholic stuff like secretly pouring vodka into my cup when people weren't looking. 14 is my best guess, but it could have been more. Amazingly, I did not say anything stupid or make an ass out of myself all evening, but I was starting to lose motor control by the end of the evening. I had intended on riding my bike home, but my friends insisted on cramming it into their tiny car and driving me.

I started drinking relatively early today. Really wanted a beer at 3:30 and caved to the impulse at 4:15. I am already two drinks in, but also 200 mg in, so the level of baclofen in my blood is getting pretty high.