Skullbaby's Progress

[Mandiekinz]

Skullbaby's Progress

Yes, SR is very expensive for that specific drug, and I noticed they require an FE. Fuck that. hah. Although there is a 1 in 427 chance of death per say which seem to stem from underlying medical problems, I could understand the fear in that. Especially the unknown territory of bac with it. You would certainly want someone with a medical background to keep tabs on you during the treatment. There are a lot of professional treatment centers that use Ibogaine as well. Although, that too is very expensive.

I do hope the bac helps you for the codeine, it must be a very difficult substance to get off of. At least with alcohol it's a very short term withdrawal.

Sorry I kinda stole your thread for a minute, Skull. It's back to you, mister.

[skullbabyland]

Skullbaby's Progress

Neo- in regards to the question of Nal/codeine, I'm pretty sure it's the opposite- since it's an opoid agonist, that means it's safe to take nal as a treatment and thereby avoid withdrawals. The Nal doesn't block the drug- only the euphoria, thereby lessening the craving over time. That's why it's recommended via TSM to take the Nal, wait an hour, then drink/use. It'll feel different, like less euphoric, but you won't go into withdrawals since the drug is in your system. This repeated over time the brain gets bored with it.

I could be wrong about this but this is definitely how it works with alcohol via the TSM method, so it's worth double-checking-- if I'm right, Nal could be the answer for you to slowly reduce/eliminate the codeine habit. I'd do some reading up on this if I were you, could be valuable.... there's a vibrant NAL/TSM community over at thesinclairmethod.com • Index page

How's your AF time going my friend?

As to supplements- I take daily: Vit C, B complex, D. Also a ton of Omega 3, and I take calcium/magnesium, and fiber. All that, plus 2 protein shakes (plant-based) with creatine. I take Xtend BCAA's before workouts. I'm considering taking Himalayan sea salt supplements for healthy sodium, since my sodium is far lower now that I'm eating clean whole foods. Haha... I'm a dork. What kinda supps do you take?

Awesome to hear about our experience with Krav and BJJ. I'm interested in both and going to look into them when I get to our new city, which is Portland, OR btw. 2 weeks til moving time... Eep! I hear you about moving, meeting new people, etc... I've been on an antidepressant which makes things much easier in regards to social anxiety, I hardly feel it at all any more (it used to be really terrible for me, and alcohol sure didn't help it). It's called Effexor and it's really effective for me, though everyone responds differently, it's been a godsend for me. Though maybe someday through healthy sober living I'll venture off it.

As for ketogenic, I do it occassionally with good results, though only for a max of about 3 days before I get super tired and despondant... a bit of fruit and white rice puts the spring back in my step. So, I do these refeeds 2 or so days a week, and go keto otherwise, til I reach my goal of 180 lbs. I also do IF/leangains almost exclusively and love it.

Hope all's well with you Neo!

[skullbabyland]

Skullbaby's Progress

Mandie- nope, my recent thoughts about drinking weren't due to your comments, they were just the thoughts of celebration with my family before I leave for Portland. It would be nice, but I've already made the commitment for 60 days. I'm tired of breaking my own commitments, and in the spirit of The Four Agreements I'm really trying to honor my words and commitments, even to myself. So I'll just have to enjoy lemonade instead of beers at the going away party. They're great people so it'll still be fun... and the morning after will be much more fun than if I'm hungover.

You're so right about keeping in mind the 2 or 3 day-long depression, eating like crap, etc. that comes with a hangover... I like being reminded of it because when I often forget that when I'm entertaining ideas of drinking...

I do think bac has lessened my cravings but I don't think I've yet hit a switch. After my 60 days I'm going to do a controlled experiment and see how it feels to drink at my current bac dose and see... depending on the results, I'll titrate as needed. Til then, I'm remaining on 90 mg bac...

Best to you, my friend!

[neophyte]

Skullbaby's Progress

Mandiekinz - Looks like you've done your research and know all about SR haha, I like the people on this forum, very intelligent and in the know about things. Yes i agree with FE, i've been ripped off a few times that way. The 1/427 is quite low, and yes there are treatment centers, i remember when i looked into it, there was one place in queensland australia where it would cost about 2k, a heroin addict on a forum wanted to go up with me, but i dont feel that codeine is really that big of a problem to warrant such drastic measures.

I agree with your opinion on needing medical supervision with that one, definitely not something you want to "bro science", there just isnt enough information out there to educate one self on what to do like there is with baclofen, even with baclofen there were some surprises along the way, luckily this forum was such a great resource and helped me along the way.

Thats really interesting to hear about the Nal, i will definitely look into it again, now that it's easy to obtain via the online pharmacies i've gotten through here. I wouldn't go the normal dr route but here in Australia, it's just impossible to get good treatment with addiction, they send you from specialist to specialist and its always therapy, no one will even consider something like baclofen. Don't get me wrong, i think therapy is essential and im seeing a counselor now, but i think everyone just wants to cover their ass, it goes with the whole nanny state mentality of Australia. Definitely going to check out the sinclair method though, im sick of wasting money on codeine, its like 50-70$ a week depending oin how my addiction is going, not only that but its down right degrading walking from pharmacy to pharmacy on a route so they dont know im trying to get high on the stuff and wont sell it to me.

skull - my AF time is great, never felt better; i guess its a cliche saying but "why the hell didnt i do this sooner" well i did try but cravings and anxiety always brought me back. I have so much energy, and people are noticing at work, im more engaged and i dont clock watch to wait to get home so i can booze it up.

Good to see you take Vit D and omega 3, vit d in particular is important for us office workers who dont get enough sun light and only get a moon tan via the computer screen. I take the following: coq10, multi V, vitamin D, l-theanine, noopept, choline, sulbutiamine, zma, melatonin, creatine, glutamine. I take some protein when i work out as well

Social anxiety has really been my core anxiety that has caused most of my problems, Zoloft helps a bit but not enough. I might have to look into Effexor, i hear its hell to get off though? I've done my research and there doesnt seem to be a good solution to social anxiety medication wise. The best thing i found was working in a large corporate environment, being in meetings, dealing with managers and doing presentations. All these things terrify me, i get intimidated by people in authority which has held my career back somewhat due to SA. One of the reasons why i turned to the bottle. but ill def take another look at effoexor. but working in an office has def made my SA much better via exposure and forcing myself out of my comfort zone.

Ahh yeah keto fatigue, in my experience it does go away after a while ,but not for everyone, and hell at this stage of being AF i think tis probably low on the priorities. As to lean gains, i looked into that, i tried it for a few days but i just couldnt hack fasting. I hate being hungry. I might look into doing it again when i get my addictions firmly under control

Hope all is well with you too buddy.

Sorry to hijack your thread too !

[spiritwolf333]

Skullbaby's Progress

Skull -Hi. I hope your controlled experiment goes like mine did. After only 2 beers, I asked myself "what the hell is this for? Short buzz-then extremely tired-and just had to wait for the effects to wear off -took an entire day. This comes from a person who drank sun-up to pass-out. I do think baclofen does allow me the opportunity to think the drink all the way through -to realize that the benefits of drinking just are not there anymore. And just damn, a little bit of alcohol kicked in a few days of disconnected depression. My results and conclusions about drinking are now a fact for me.

[skullbabyland]

Skullbaby's Progress

neophyte;1557697 wrote:

Thats really interesting to hear about the Nal, i will definitely look into it again, now that it's easy to obtain via the online pharmacies i've gotten through here. I wouldn't go the normal dr route but here in Australia, it's just impossible to get good treatment with addiction, they send you from specialist to specialist and its always therapy, no one will even consider something like baclofen. Don't get me wrong, i think therapy is essential and im seeing a counselor now, but i think everyone just wants to cover their ass, it goes with the whole nanny state mentality of Australia. Definitely going to check out the sinclair method though, im sick of wasting money on codeine, its like 50-70$ a week depending oin how my addiction is going, not only that but its down right degrading walking from pharmacy to pharmacy on a route so they dont know im trying to get high on the stuff and wont sell it to me.

skull - my AF time is great, never felt better; i guess its a cliche saying but "why the hell didnt i do this sooner" well i did try but cravings and anxiety always brought me back. I have so much energy, and people are noticing at work, im more engaged and i dont clock watch to wait to get home so i can booze it up.

Good to see you take Vit D and omega 3, vit d in particular is important for us office workers who dont get enough sun light and only get a moon tan via the computer screen. I take the following: coq10, multi V, vitamin D, l-theanine, noopept, choline, sulbutiamine, zma, melatonin, creatine, glutamine. I take some protein when i work out as well

Social anxiety has really been my core anxiety that has caused most of my problems, Zoloft helps a bit but not enough. I might have to look into Effexor, i hear its hell to get off though? I've done my research and there doesnt seem to be a good solution to social anxiety medication wise. The best thing i found was working in a large corporate environment, being in meetings, dealing with managers and doing presentations. All these things terrify me, i get intimidated by people in authority which has held my career back somewhat due to SA. One of the reasons why i turned to the bottle. but ill def take another look at effoexor. but working in an office has def made my SA much better via exposure and forcing myself out of my comfort zone.

Ahh yeah keto fatigue, in my experience it does go away after a while ,but not for everyone, and hell at this stage of being AF i think tis probably low on the priorities. As to lean gains, i looked into that, i tried it for a few days but i just couldnt hack fasting. I hate being hungry. I might look into doing it again when i get my addictions firmly under control

Hope all is well with you too buddy.

Sorry to hijack your thread too !

Interesting to hear that Australia's system is so similar to the US, I hadn't known that. That's too bad. Yeah therapy is a great tool and I swear by it, but oftentimes other tools are needed, as we all know... have you looked into TSM any more? I really think it could be a good tool, check it out when you're ready to reduce the codeine habit, which sounds expensive.

How's your AF time going lately? I read from other threads that you've been experiencing the cravings and somnolence, yeah that's definitley going to happen... In my experience both get easier with time.

As for SA- yep, for years it was terrible for me, and my booze problems came as a result. Effexor really changed the dynamic for me- got me out from the almost constant shroud of paralyzing fear. It's really got a strong component of anti-anxiety which is why my doc chose it, and luckily it works well with my body. Of course everyone's body is different so Effexor may or may not work well for others, no other way to find out than to try it... ah the wonderful world of medication browsing... anyway man give it some thought. For both me and my sister too, Effexor has changed our life. I'd do an advertisement for it for free if they asked. (no, I don't work for any drug company lol)

Of course, if you're still getting hammered, the alcohol abuse still brings lots of anxiety, so AF time will be the best thing you can do for it. Also, I hear you about taking on your fears via public speaking, etc. I think it's great as a practice. One thing I try to do as practice is to truthfully compliment someone I interact with, at least once a day. It gets me out of my comfort zone and adds some brightness to the world. People don't do that enough, and you'll see people light up when you do it (provided you mean it

Anyway, good to practice social skills- just like mental or physical, they require constant training. Public speaking is a really good one. I was thinking about joining Toastmasters for that reason, I think I may look into that.

As for keto fatigue, I can't afford it lately so I've been still eating fruits and white rice for the sugar/carbs. I'd like to keep losing fat but for right now I need all the energy to pack boxes and get stuff done for my move...

Take care buddy hope all's well.

[skullbabyland]

Skullbaby's Progress

spiritwolf333;1557754 wrote: Skull -Hi. I hope your controlled experiment goes like mine did. After only 2 beers, I asked myself "what the hell is this for? Short buzz-then extremely tired-and just had to wait for the effects to wear off -took an entire day. This comes from a person who drank sun-up to pass-out. I do think baclofen does allow me the opportunity to think the drink all the way through -to realize that the benefits of drinking just are not there anymore. And just damn, a little bit of alcohol kicked in a few days of disconnected depression. My results and conclusions about drinking are now a fact for me.

Spirit- yeah man, I sure hope my controlled experiment goes very similar to yours. So glad that baclofen treatment has been so amazing for you! You seem like you have your life back, my friend! I love hearing about how different things are for you, kudos buddy

[skullbabyland]

Skullbaby's Progress

Update-

Well, today is day 150 on baclofen. Crazy, that's almost half a year! My life has changed considerably in that time. For the record, I'm at 85 mg/day at the moment and still inching my way to 80, where I'm gonna sit as my maintenance dose. Also, today is Day 47 on 125mg Antabuse and concurrently Day 47 AF.

Currently I'm in the middle of packing up all my stuff to move to a new city. Things are kinda stressful, as moves always are, but I'm thankful that I'm AF. Though I sometimes still have small fleeting thoughts about how alcohol would be a nice de-stresser, I know that I'm much more capable of handling all this without the intense hangovers/depression etc. And even though I'm able to easily dismiss thoughts before they become cravings, I do find it interesting that I salivate when having those fleeting thoughts of beer/wine. Haha...

I do find that I have to actively combat the mental emotional/obsessive thoughts such as rudeness/road rage. People can be so inconsiderate, and rude... and just plain old fuckin' dicks. I always thought of myself as such a mellow guy, but it might be more accurate to say that I was just always "mellowing out" (or drowning out any uncomfortable emotions) via alcohol. Without it, I'm surprised at how angry I can get and how much time and effort it takes to let things go. But I know that this is good practice on how to properly deal with things in life. For me, it's about growing a thicker skin and not sweating the small things. It's gonna take time and practice, though at least I handle it internally and don't let it blow up externally.

I do also find myself with a generalized sense of anxiety... I think it's just the move. It feels kinda like "whoa this move is really happening, it's really here. Hope I made the right decision..." Kinda like cold feet. But when I think about it I do know I'm making a good decision.

Anyway. I'm more than 3/4 of the way to my goal of 60 days AF, and that means I'll be AF through the next couple weeks, so that means I'll still be sober once the dust clears after we move. Depending on how I feel, I may commit to 90 but have made no promises to myself as of yet....

At any rate, not much else to say at the moment, I gotta go do more packing.

Best to all.

[spiritwolf333]

Skullbaby's Progress

Skull-if u are not careful, you are going to become a baclofen miracle. I use to say to myself -"self, you can drink all you want to tomorrow, but for today, I feel just fine sober." Sounds stupid, but it would work many times. Today, I truly realize that I just don't have the nads anymore to deal with the heightened depression and anxiety. I am at a point in sobriety that I just can't drink anymore-period. I have to find other ways to deal with the stressed out times - other than alcohol.

Good luck,with the moving-changeling. Never easy but always with it-most times. And skull, when you get to 60 days, go get good and drunk-sick, depressed, full of fear, etc. just joking cuz. I have yet to ask for a refund for my baclofen or my sober days -and I continue to thank the baclofen gods.

[neophyte]

Skullbaby's Progress

Hi Skull,

I still haven't had a chance to look into TSM, the codeine habit is expensive, im going to try and start reducing it to an amount which is at a cheaper level. I'll look into TSM probably this weekend, i did check out some online pharmacies that sold naltrexone which wasnt too expensive, its somethign im willing to give a shot.

my AF time is going ok and I'll have tappered off the Valium by tomorrow. Initially i felt really euphoric and happy, the best part of my day was waking up and realising i wasnt hung over and anxious. Going to work was awesome I am sharper and more articulate and engaged with what i do. My BJJ and weight training are much improved. A few people at BJJ commented how my wrestling was getting much better.

Over the past few days some cravings have popped their ugly head up again, nothing huge but still there. I have an empty feeling too, not outright depression but like i feel stale. I get this when going AF the other times, though this time it's much easier to deal with. I am getting some anger issues as well, i was getting really angry at work yesterday. Again anger was a big thing i had to deal with when i was AF the other times i tried to quit. It's not as bad as this time. When i coudnt drink i would get so angry at my SO, id be in a crabby mood from not drinking and she would think that it was something she did. I woudl explain that its not her its me quitting booze. So this lasts about a day and shes back to thinking shes done somehting wrong, so i have blamed her in the past for me going back to the bottle because i can't deal with her emotions and my habit. In reality it was just an excuse to go back to drinking. Again though, its easier thsi time round on Baclofen.

The main theme here is that baclofen has just made things easier but its still not easy getting clean. I still have to deal with the anger, the emptyness, boredom at night. They are things i can work on though.

I increased my baclofen dose to 175mg from 150mg yesterday. A final push to hopefully snuff out any lingering cravings. Not sure if this is a wise move.

[skullbabyland]

Skullbaby's Progress

Thanks, Spirit and Neo-- I'll return tomorrow with comments in return, in addition to a more detailed post, but for now I'll copy/paste what I wrote in the AF October forum.
...................

After a few days away from MWO, I'm back... The fifth day of "Sober October" and luckily I'm still sober indeed. Today marks day 58 AF for me. Two days away from my 60 day goal, yaaaayyyy!

Definitely been having those seductive thoughts, were my addiction lies to me about how harmless and fun it'd be for me to have "a few". I believe it for a few minutes, but luckily continue returning here to MWO for a reality check and remember how depressed and hopeless it feels to drink as an alcoholic.

Alternately, I'm trying to recognize consciously what's been happening lately-- I've been laughing and genuinely having fun lately, instead of that "sober and bored" feeling in which I've spent so many days now. I'm so glad to know that the feeling of enjoying life and being engaged in it does in fact return, albeit slowly, with sober time.

Best to all!

[kronkcarr]

Skullbaby's Progress

Wow! You've hit that sober fun! Good for you. It took me a while to get there. I'm so happy for you. Keep on. I love your posts and appreciate the time you take to make them.

[skullbabyland]

Skullbaby's Progress

kronkcarr;1564959 wrote: Wow! You've hit that sober fun! Good for you. It took me a while to get there. I'm so happy for you. Keep on. I love your posts and appreciate the time you take to make them.

Your comment made me happy Kronk! Thanks for that, I'm happy if you or anyone else gets something out of my posts... I know it helps keep me on track, even if they can be pretty long and long-winded, lol

How are you doing these days, Kronk, what's new? Do you have a progress thread at all?

[skullbabyland]

Skullbaby's Progress

spiritwolf333;1560705 wrote: Skull-if u are not careful, you are going to become a baclofen miracle. I use to say to myself -"self, you can drink all you want to tomorrow, but for today, I feel just fine sober." Sounds stupid, but it would work many times. Today, I truly realize that I just don't have the nads anymore to deal with the heightened depression and anxiety. I am at a point in sobriety that I just can't drink anymore-period. I have to find other ways to deal with the stressed out times - other than alcohol.

Good luck,with the moving-changeling. Never easy but always with it-most times. And skull, when you get to 60 days, go get good and drunk-sick, depressed, full of fear, etc. just joking cuz. I have yet to ask for a refund for my baclofen or my sober days -and I continue to thank the baclofen gods.

Thanks for the post, Spirit. I love all your wise sayings, like the "today I feel just fine sober". I especially like the one " go get good and drunk-sick, depressed, full of fear, etc.". Haha, so true. Thanks for that reminder, because my addict brain has been making some convincing arguments about how "just a few" could be harmless and fun. That fucking guy is such a convincing liar.

And I sure agree about being honest with ourselves that it takes unbelievable energy to deal with all that depression and anxiety, and it's just not worth using all our strength just to keep on living another day in that mess, when we could be healthy, and channeling all that energy and strength to go forth and conquer.

As for dealing with stresses in another manner, have you found any good tools/methods to do this?

Super glad that the gods continue to bless you with baclofen sobriety, Spirit. Keep it going brother!

[skullbabyland]

Skullbaby's Progress

neophyte;1560740 wrote: Hi Skull,

I still haven't had a chance to look into TSM, the codeine habit is expensive, im going to try and start reducing it to an amount which is at a cheaper level. I'll look into TSM probably this weekend, i did check out some online pharmacies that sold naltrexone which wasnt too expensive, its somethign im willing to give a shot.

my AF time is going ok and I'll have tappered off the Valium by tomorrow. Initially i felt really euphoric and happy, the best part of my day was waking up and realising i wasnt hung over and anxious. Going to work was awesome I am sharper and more articulate and engaged with what i do. My BJJ and weight training are much improved. A few people at BJJ commented how my wrestling was getting much better.

Over the past few days some cravings have popped their ugly head up again, nothing huge but still there. I have an empty feeling too, not outright depression but like i feel stale. I get this when going AF the other times, though this time it's much easier to deal with. I am getting some anger issues as well, i was getting really angry at work yesterday. Again anger was a big thing i had to deal with when i was AF the other times i tried to quit. It's not as bad as this time. When i coudnt drink i would get so angry at my SO, id be in a crabby mood from not drinking and she would think that it was something she did. I woudl explain that its not her its me quitting booze. So this lasts about a day and shes back to thinking shes done somehting wrong, so i have blamed her in the past for me going back to the bottle because i can't deal with her emotions and my habit. In reality it was just an excuse to go back to drinking. Again though, its easier thsi time round on Baclofen.

The main theme here is that baclofen has just made things easier but its still not easy getting clean. I still have to deal with the anger, the emptyness, boredom at night. They are things i can work on though.

I increased my baclofen dose to 175mg from 150mg yesterday. A final push to hopefully snuff out any lingering cravings. Not sure if this is a wise move.

Hey Neo, how you been the last few days? You still rocking the AF time? Sorry it took a while for my response.

Did you ever look into TSM for the codeine habit? I'll stop bugging you about it if you want, but I really think it may be just the thing.

Your experience sounds a lot like mine- Initial euphoria, getting sharper at work and improving physically, but after that, a dullness/grayness comes, where things seem boring, frustrating. I feel like I'm finally getting on the other side of that a bit. You will too, my friend.

I relate to what you're saying about your relationship with your GF... Hope that's going better for you. A partner who's on board with the ongoing struggle of getting clean is a real asset.

Hope that going to 175 mg made a difference for ya and helped with the cravings. Be well my friend!