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**Xadrian** · July 28, 2013, 01:06 PM

Seeking Advice

Most people here are on baclofen, which has shown a pretty high success rate.
Of course it also can have some nasty side effects.

You could check out the baclofen threads to get an idea.

**downsouth** · July 28, 2013, 01:20 PM

Seeking Advice

I have been reading through the baclofen threads and the SE are concerning. I function at a very high rate and need to work so the no driving and sleepiness would be a major concern. I was thinking of it as being step 2. First on my agenda is getting clean for my wife and girls. Second is keeping my medical records clean. I am in the healthcare profession and very familiar with baclofen. Thank you for your reply and the baclofen results are a tremendous breakthrough.

Has anyone sought treatment in Canada?

**zampa75** · July 28, 2013, 02:15 PM

Seeking Advice

downsouth;1537528 wrote: I function at a very high rate and need to work so the no driving and sleepiness would be a major concern.

The no driving again. It's the second time I have read this and it scares the hell out of me. I've just started Bac and still are at a low dosage, but I will go up slowly but steadily. I am back to work and school in a month: I will HAVE to quit if it prevents me from driving -it's a one hour commute - and only thinking about the possibility makes my heart sink.

What are people experiences with Bac and driving?? Pls tell me it only affects a small percentage of people. Is it b/c of the sleepiness?? Or what? Topamax used to make me very sleepy but I could drive fine, while I had to stop Nal exactly b/c it made driving impossible.

I think it's the third time I have written this: sorry for the redundancy...But feedback on driving pls!

**skullbabyland** · July 28, 2013, 02:27 PM

Seeking Advice

zampa75;1537551 wrote: The no driving again. It's the second time I have read this and it scares the hell out of me. I've just started Bac and still are at a low dosage, but I will go up slowly but steadily. I am back to work and school in a month: I will HAVE to quit if it prevents me from driving -it's a one hour commute - and only thinking about the possibility makes my heart sink.

What are people experiences with Bac and driving?? Pls tell me it only affects a small percentage of people. Is it b/c of the sleepiness?? Or what? Topamax used to make me very sleepy but I could drive fine, while I had to stop Nal exactly b/c it made driving impossible.

I think it's the third time I have written this: sorry for the redundancy...But feedback on driving pls!

I'm sure the old-timers will chime in here with info, but my two cents... though bac seems to affect everyone differently, it's my understanding that most people on bac drive with no problem. I myself am of the opinion that to minimize SE's such as drowsiness or insomnia, that a very slow titration schedule will help a lot. (I myself only increase by 10mg in dosage every 8 days to minimize SEs- it's definitely a snail's pace but it seems to be working well).

You're off work for a month, correct? During this time, pay close attention to how you feel. If you do feel drowsy, see if coffee, music, etc. will pick you back up. Some people have reported that a brisk walk helps them shake off the drowsiness. See what tools you can use to minimize the drowsiness if it's a problem for you.

If nothing helps and you're not feeling safe to drive, do you have other transportation options at all? Bus/train?

Another thought that might help you with driving, if it is indeed a concern, is your dosage schedule-- maybe you wait til after your morning commute to take your first dose? That may make you tired at school/work but better than sleepy on the road. Perhaps you could work around your evening commute in a similar way.

My only other comment is that I believe that the person who originally posted "those on bac shouldn't drive" was a troll trying to start trouble. I could be wrong about this, though- can anyone confirm or deny?

Either way, slow and steady, with careful consideration and smart decisions, wins the race.

**YouKayBee** · July 28, 2013, 02:29 PM

Seeking Advice

I couldn't function, nor live on Baclofen and Naltrexone gave me the break I needed. Like you I used to be pretty fit, well until the booze really took over, but got that back now and in spades.

Nal can make some people feel drowsy, but I found it nothing like the somnolence on Bac if you only drink at night that's not a problem and in fact can be used to your advantage in that it encourages you to give up and get to bed sooner.

**pixie** · July 28, 2013, 02:36 PM

Seeking Advice

zampa, sorry I can't help on the bac side effects, hopefully someone else will be along.

downsouth, why not continue the Topa since you're taking it already, and presumably(?) under a doctor's care for it? I don't know how the dosages compare re: migraines with what is recommended for alcohol abuse, but you could always supplement your doses with Topa you buy online, if necessary. It seems like it would make sense to give it a shot before trying something else.
I think the Topa SEs are less severe than Bac, though that's just based on what I've read on these forums as I have not tried Bac. I did try Topa for awhile and it did help, though I stopped it because not being under MD care was concerning to me since I have other health issues.

Good luck!

**skullbabyland** · July 28, 2013, 02:38 PM

Seeking Advice

To the OP, Downsouth- I'm not sure about treatment in Canada, but I do know that there are a significant amount of people who've found indifference to alcohol using naltrexone as described by The Sinclair Method. I myself take a mixture of daily bac and then naltrexone 1 hour before I drink, (the basic TSM method) and am finding promising results. But of course the decision of which way to go is different for everyone.

If you want more info on naltrexone with TSM, there's another forum that focuses on that treatment- thesinclairmethod.com • Index page

Best of luck!

**Colin** · July 28, 2013, 03:12 PM

Seeking Advice

zampa75;1537551 wrote:
I think it's the third time I have written this: sorry for the redundancy...But feedback on driving pls!

I've just rented a motorcycle for a few weeks. If I'm still posting in two week's time you'll know that it's probably OK.

Either way, just carry on increasing the baclofen until you feel you can't take the risk. Then reappraise your position.

**Xadrian** · July 28, 2013, 03:46 PM

Seeking Advice

skullbabyland;1537572 wrote: I myself take a mixture of daily bac and then naltrexone 1 hour before I drink.

As in: I have to take my medicines now, because in an hour I will drink?

Or as in: If I take my medicines now, I have to give it at least an hour for in case I might want to drink?

So, in other words, are you planning to drink, is it inevitable or do you expect to have to drink?

**zampa75** · July 28, 2013, 03:48 PM

Seeking Advice

Ukblonde;1537563 wrote: I

Nal can make some people feel drowsy

My problem with Nal was not drowsiness. It was dizziness: so severe it was worse than driving drunk...

I can't take Nal bc of that. I think I tried them all except for Bac and Antabuse, but the latter is not an option. I don't need any further source of fear to slip, and I could be stupid enough to drink on it anyway.

Thanks for your reply though. And the rest of you guys too. Keep them coming!

**downsouth** · July 28, 2013, 03:49 PM

Seeking Advice

My topamax dose is 150 mg/day. Can you order Nal online? Thank you for all the advice. Based on what I have read I could use the TSM in the evening and titrate myself off alcohol and overlay bac if needed.

**skullbabyland** · July 28, 2013, 04:06 PM

Seeking Advice

Xadrian;1537597 wrote: As in: I have to take my medicines now, because in an hour I will drink?

Or as in: If I take my medicines now, I have to give it at least an hour for in case I might want to drink?

So, in other words, are you planning to drink, is it inevitable or do you expect to have to drink?

I'm not sure I quite understand the question, but here's what I think the answer is-

I do my best not to plan to drink, but sometimes in spite of myself, I do make plans in my head to drink. (that pesky addict voice in my head that says things like "having drinks tonight while watching TV sounds great, I think I'll do it"). Historically, the pattern has been that this addict voice triggers cravings to drink somewhere in the evening, around every 3 or 4 days.

I take bac (currently 2 doses adding up to a daily total of 100mg) daily to lessen the cravings, which I'm finding it does help significantly. I also pair that with the naltrexone/TSM method.

The method is such that, if I know I'm going to drink that night (or I make a plan/decision to drink) I first take a naltrexone (50mg) and then delay drinking for one hour to let the nal get into my system. I then drink as "normal". Even though I'll still get intoxicated, the nal helps lessen the euphoria. Thus, it's not as enjoyable, and I lose interest sooner and instead have dinner or go to bed. I also do other things to "minimize the damage" such as make sure I won't have a reason to foolishly drive. I try to drink a pint of water between each beer, and I take a sleep aid fairly early in the evening so that I'll go to bed at a decent hour (and not stay up til dawn drinking).

On days that I will not drink, I do not take naltrexone at all. I do of course still take my bac daily whether or not I will drink.

I find that the combination of the two sort of attacks the drinking addiction thing from multiple fronts. There are obviously proponents of the baclofen/Dr. Amiesen method and there are proponents of the naltrexone/Dr. Sinclair method. There are those that tried one method and had no luck but did with the other. I've chosen to pair both. (I haven't tried other methods such as Topa or Campral).

Also, it should be noted that I'm doing this under the careful supervision of my MD. I know that is sadly not a readily available option for some people.

Did I answer the question? In re-reading your question, I believe the answer is the first scenario you asked, not the second.

For a more detailed look if you're interested, check out my progress thread.

**skullbabyland** · July 28, 2013, 04:16 PM

Seeking Advice

downsouth;1537599 wrote: My topamax dose is 150 mg/day. Can you order Nal online? Thank you for all the advice. Based on what I have read I could use the TSM in the evening and titrate myself off alcohol and overlay bac if needed.

Both the bac method and the nal method seem to have helped a lot of people.

Whichever you decide, please do a TON of reading on the forums, and I'd highly advise reading both the TSM book ("The Cure for Alcoholism" by Dr. Eskapa, based on the work of Dr. Sinclair) and the baclofen book ("The End of My Addiction" also titled "Heal Thyself" by Dr. Amiesen).

Also please know that both methods take time to work. TSM in particular seems to be a long process- people seem to have reported anywhere from 2 to 18 months before finding indifference to alcohol. The bac method can be long too, depending on how comfortable you are with titrating up.

Just once you start, don't abandon it too early unless really needed (due to SE's etc)- many people seem to want the method to work instantaneously and give up hope too soon.

Also, yes, you can order Nal online- use the search window to find threads/posts with the best pharmacies to do so. I've heard goldpharma, River Pharmacy, and All Day Chemist all mentioned as good reliable sources.

**Xadrian** · July 28, 2013, 04:19 PM

Seeking Advice

skullbabyland;1537603 wrote: For a more detailed look if you're interested, check out my progress thread.

I wanted to ask if you're also increasing the bac dose to find your switch, but I will first read your thread and probably find the answer there.

By the way, before baclofen I was also drinking every third day or so.

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