Day 2 AF

[neophyte]

I'm using Baclofen to reduce cravings, the side effects from drinking while tritrating up were just too much. Each time i went up though i felt my alcohol cravings dial down a notch each time, like a dimmer on a light light switch. Since my SE were getting progressivly worse, in particular the anxiety the following day after drinking "the fear". People on here encouraged me to go alcohol free, im on 125mg of bac a day, and today i just went up 150 mg day . .

I have some valium to help me through, last night i sleept like a baby (first time in years!) and day 1 was pretty easy. This is my second day AF. I feel, well weird, my brain just feels all over the place, i cant concentrate on anything, my thoughts are all disjointed and strange, I have taken 20mg of valium to help relax me a bit. but i cant even look at this screen without seeing double, almost like im drunk. No halucinations or anything DT related or anything too scary. I'm Just kinda out of it. This post is pretty hard to write as it is. and im rambling while writing

I'm coming off drinking daily for about 5 years with a few small breaks in betwen, i usually drink about 350ml or less of vodka at night.

Cravings wise, im doing ok, when i came home I had a few moments where all i wanted was a tall glass of vodka to put down the hatch and feel that warm brace of alcohol from within. The thing is, now alcohol doesnt do that to me anymore. Baclofen has changed the effect alcohol has on me. Drinking just doesnt feel that great anymore and the hangovers are so bad, particularly the anxiety. These are really all good things though if they get me to stop drinking.

how bad do you guys think day 3 will be? do i need to worry? i think im taking the day off tomorrow to see a doctor.

My blood pressure hasnt really changed, so that is something to be thankful for, below are my blood pressure sys/dia/heart rate

14/05/2013 144/73/71
10/09/2013 139/75/78

Sorry for the rambling!

[skullbabyland]

Day 2 AF

Neo- good on you for choosing some AF time to let bac do its thing. If alcohol withdrawals are a concern, definitely take the necessary steps to help you through them, even and maybe especially if it means involving a doctor.

One thought- it could be that the SE's are so intense because you're titrating up quickly. How long have you been taking bac overall? Jumping up 25 mg at a time will definitely make SE's more severe. Many people find it easier to titrate up more gradually, though I know that there are others who jumped up quickly and it was worth it for them.

Best of luck.

[StuckinLA]

Day 2 AF

Neo--your diastolic b/p is pretty good and your hr is great, so in my NOT medical in ANY way opinion, you sound all right. Keep an eye on your vitals, but through day 3-5 or 6 you'll probably be out of the woods, especially with valium. One thing I've read in some of the literature is that withdrawal should be treated fairly aggressively to combat the kindling effect of withdrawal. But like I said, you look not too bad. The systolic b/p is high, but when I go into withdrawal I'm at like 170/120, so everything's relative, right?

Anyway, please keep in mind I am in no way medically trained or able to give advice, etc.

I titrated up to 150 over 30 days when I was AF, and 150 & AF was an amazing place for me. Really kind of a wonderful, eye-opening experience. Of course I fucked it up by drinking, but right up until then I felt better than I almost ever had before or since. Anyway, just try to hang in for a while.

[neophyte]

Day 2 AF

lamela - I've had problems with benzo abuse in the past as well, if alcohol withdrawal is unpleasant then benzo withdrawal is horror. So I'm being careful limiting the valium use to get me through the tough parts only and at small dosages, following this schedule per day mg : 30, 20, 20, 20, 20, 10, 10, 5, 5, 2.5 ,2.5 ,0

skullbabyland - originally i was going up in 25mg jumps but from 100mg onwards it has been 10mg jumps, i thought with the valium i could do one big last jump, but i think that was a bad idea, ill stick with 135mg today instead of the 150mg, see how that goes. Today im going to take the day off and see a doctor and try to get the rest of the week off to deal with AL WD.

StuckinLA - Yes my systolic is high, it's always been high, but my mother has high BP and well, i've been drinking for 5+ years which certinly doesnt help, im interested to see how it goes after i stop drinking for a while. im wondering if 150mg was so great then why did you decide to drink again? was it cravings?


It's strange, at night time when i would normally be drinking, thats when things just get weird, when i was asleep last night i jolted awake and saw the shadow of a person come into my room and dart under the bed. needless to say this TERRIFIED me. my partner awoke and asked me what was wrong and i told her, she assured me that no one was in the room. After i calmed down i kept having this feeling like i was sinking into the bed which i would periodically jolt out of. That part wasn't too distressing, i guess because of the valium helping me through. Needless to say i need to see a doctor about this today. this is the worst alcohol WD ive been through even with the valium and ive done cold turkey with no benzos before. I guess this is kindling...

At least today i woke up and i feel fantastic, it's so refreshing to not wake up in the haze of being hung over and hating myself and thought looping over every single bad decision ive ever made. I barely think about alcohol as well, I'm so happy i found this site and baclofen, i was a desperate alcohlolic and was looking at ANYTHING to stop this - naltrexone, cambral, glutamine and anything else to get me through, but i know this is the answer.

Thanks for the support too everyone

[Sake123]

Day 2 AF

Neo - Welcome...I'm new to this forum but wanted to let you know that each day has gotten better for me. I'm on day 6 and I feel pretty damn good! Good luck to you...you can do it! This forum has been an awesome support for me. I'm guessing the people here will be for you as well.

[kronkcarr]

Day 2 AF

neophyte,
good for you! I think it's good you're going AF. I didn't over drink when I went up on bac, but when I did have 3 drinks twice I had to nap. I agree with you. Since I've been on bac I don't believe I can get that "happy, giddy" buzz I used to get. I'm glad you're seeing a dr tomorrow. keep on!

lamella,
you may not have to titrate up to high doses of bac. I hit my switch at 80 and am now maintaining at 60 for months. Take your time.

[skullbabyland]

Day 2 AF

Neo- the scary sleep incident you describe may very well be withdrawals or something, but it sounds a lot like the descriptions I've heard of "sleep paralysis". Might be worth doing a search on that to see if it sounds like what you experienced. If so, could be a stand-alone thing, or maybe exacerbated by the bac or by al withdrawal. Either way, scary but not harmful, and should subside soon.

[StuckinLA]

Day 2 AF

If you take bac out of the equation and just go on alcohol withdrawal, it took me about 2 months to sleep soundly most nights. Just FYI.

[neophyte]

Day 2 AF

skullbabyland- I've had sleep paralysis, but it wasnt anything like that. Usually with sleep paralysis im in a dream but i cant move my body to wake up, i cant even yell out. when i slowly come to out of sleep paralysis i usually start by moaning for help and my partner rouses me awake. Sleep paralysis is also more likely for people who drink.

StuckinLA - thats good to know, i can handle 2 months. My sleep has been terrible as an alcoholic, and was made 10x worse when on baclofen. I've actually been sleeping great since cutting out the booze, but i do have the valium so it doesnt really count.

I went to the doctor today and he was pretty useless, i was in and out in 5 minutes, he basically just said go to therapy and here is more valium. So all i got for my trouble was 250mg worth of tablets of valium and a dr certificate to not have to go into work until monday. So at least i have 3 days to get through this. I am moving house at the moment, so at least i can have some physical activity to keep my mind occupied.

So far though, im not finding it too difficult. Before when i quit i just had to use EVERY ounce of mental thought to resist alcohol, my thoughts would be consumed by alcohol. all i would want is that warm hugging embrace of vodka. Everytime i quit, within a few weeks i would relent and say to myself, just one day ill have a break and just relax and have a drink. I dont feel that i need that anymore. I think its all going to work this time.

[skullbabyland]

Day 2 AF

Neo- I hear you. Well at any rate I hope your sleep evens out- it did for me, eventually. I used a combo of melatonin and benadryl to help it and that was enough. But whatever you gotta do to get some sleep-- sleep is obviously super important and something to be guarded. Though do, of course, be careful with the valium, as I understand it can be habit forming, though I admit I don't know much about it...

At any rate- glad you're on the bac treatment and I'll bet you're going to do well. Best of luck with this AF time and on the move. Do you have a minimum day-count of AF time that you're shooting for, or is it just for as long as possible going forward?

[spiritwolf333]

Day 2 AF

Neo -sounds like you are doing great. Firewater is hell -eventually. The starting-the drinking-the stopping. Never a dull peaceful moment -in my opinion. Baclofen saved and changed my life.

As far as the dreaming, I had nightmare type dreams when I quit drinking when I did not take baclofen. The dreams I have now are lucid and vivid. Some of my baclofen dreams can be off the charts. I sometimes wake up and believe everything I dreamed was real. I'm starting to get use to the dreams and even welcome them. I do have to confess that I sometimes feel exhausted after waking. I participated in my dream to the extent that I sometimes feel as though I have not slept at all.

Glad to see you are giving yourself a real chance to be af. Keep on keeping on.

[neophyte]

Day 2 AF

skullbabyland - I had an addiction to xanax a few years ago in a short sighted attempted to rid my self of alcohol. My logic was that i could switch out alcohol for xanax and not suffer the torment of being hung over everyday. Long story short, it didn't work and i simply became addicted to the xanax and it was horror, i wouldnt wish benzo addiction on my worst enemy. It took me 6 months or so to taper off and i was left with generalized anxiety disorder and i was back on the booze. I feel much better now AF. That said, im going to be very careful with the valium. No more than 2 weeks on the stuff and i will taper off.

spiritwolf333 - i cant wait for those lucid dreams, im looking forward to not being juttered awake at 5 am with the sheer dread and terror - "oh god i drank that much? i cant believe i did that yesterday when i was drunk - god i dont want to face another day at work"

My alcohol free time will be 30 days, so im taking up the 30 day AF challenge I honestly want nothing to do with booze at the moment, the idea of drinking that poison and what it has taken away from me for the past 5 years.

[skullbabyland]

Day 2 AF

Fucking awesome, Neo. Awesome to hear you're diving in to commit to 30 days. I am so glad I did it and I bet you will be too.

[lamela]

Day 2 AF

I've become content with the way my schedule is atm. 80mg has my drinking under control. As I've said in previous threads, I most likely will never get to indifference as the SEs are just to brutal. It took me 14 weeks to get here so its not as if I took a rapid taper. I just can't go any higher and believe me I've tried.

For me personally its been hard. I know some might disagree but I'd hazard a guess that percentage wise, more people have stopped using Bac than have actually carried on using it because of SEs than have actually continued. Thats just my opinion. Its just that they don't post and just move on.

I do believe like has been said on here before that if you can push through the SEs you will get there in the end but for some the SEs are just too much. I've been through hell and back on harder substances than Baclofen and have made it through.

A more balanced view is needed imo but its just that those who struggle tend to drift away from posting which is sad.

Example being.... Say you might need to get to 500mg. Thats an insane dose. Safe or not.. imo you really should be under have a GP on board.

For all good Dr L did I can't believe he didn't get hit with a lawsuit way before he did. I think the good he did was absolutely amazing but scripting HDB (never mind Xanax) to someone you don't know the whole picture about was asking for trouble imo. One of the those patients could have had serious mental problems.

Went a bit of topic there... sorry

[neophyte]

Day 2 AF

lamela - A agree with you completely. It's easy to get swept up in the forums and Dr A's book which barely mentions side effects and paints bac as some miracle cure all for booze addiction, addiction in general and anxiety, which is my dream. I suffer from all of those things. My side effects were pretty brutal. Anxiety like i had never felt before. It's early days for me, but i need this to work. There are studies that back up what he says though.

I take everything with a grain of salt. I've drank the kool aid before in regards to various treatment or that. In the end I just have to try them all. So far baclofen has been great for me. If it ends up not being the case. I plan on sticking around UNTIL i find some answers. I can't live my life as an alcoholic anymore. I wont live my life that way anymore, otherwise im going to die and i refuse to give up hope.

I toyed with the idea of making a survey where we could get some numbers happening on the following

• people who tried bac and were successful
  - how long it took, and the dosage that was required
  - how long did being AF last
• bac failed - indicate what dosage was used, and why they failedif AF what did the person use to get AF

Some good thought... i needed to get some idea of whats going on. but like you say, that being said, people move on, people stop posting either because it failed for them, they got better and stopped posting or perhaps it was something else like AA that got them trough or some kind of white knuckle abstinence.

I would love to see the numbers and get some accurate data,