Baclofen stimulates growth!

[Otter]

There is an interesting aspect to baclofen according to this article: Epiphany: Baclofen



It is too long to reblog it here.

[Otter]

Baclofen stimulates growth!

Psychiatry Res. 1996 Feb 28;60(1):41-7.
Growth hormone response to baclofen: a comparison of 10-mg and 20-mg doses in healthy men.
Davis LL1, Trivedi M, Kramer GL, Rush AJ, Orsulak PJ, Akers L, Petty F.
Author information
Abstract

Growth hormone (GH) response and baclofen levels were measured in seven healthy adult men following a 10-mg and a 20-mg dose of oral baclofen (gamma-aminobutyric acidB agonist) to determine the preferred dose in baclofen challenge studies. Multivariate analysis of variance (ANOVA) with repeated measures revealed no differences between the doses. However, when a univariate ANOVA with repeated measures was performed for each dose, the 10-mg dose showed no significant GH response over time, whereas the 20-mg dose showed a significant GH response over time. The average delta GH (change in GH from baseline) was 7.84 ng/ml (SD = 10.17) for the 10-mg dose and 3.34 ng/ml (SD = 3.64) for the 20-mg dose. The variability in the delta GH response to the 10-mg dose was significantly greater than the response to the 20-mg dose of baclofen. This variance in GH response was not explained by the differences in serum baclofen levels. Thus, a 20-mg baclofen dose appears to be preferable to a 10 mg-dose in baclofen challenge studies.

PMID:
8852867
[PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

[Samandkatharine]

Baclofen stimulates growth!

Hi Otter,

This is good for women too? I need more muscle...

Evan noticed this too. Back in his thread when he was flexing his muscles(before and after pics) I think he found a study on this. Not to take away your findings though. Not many people go back and read the old threads.

Sam

[Otter]

Baclofen stimulates growth!

Samandkatharine;1644907 wrote: Hi Otter,

This is good for women too? I need more muscle...

Evan noticed this too. Back in his thread when he was flexing his muscles(before and after pics) I think he found a study on this. Not to take away your findings though. Not many people go back and read the old threads.

Sam

Yes, Evan posted photos of his six pack. I couldn't understand it since I thought Bac made you tired, not motivated to exercise. Now it makes sense.


I had someone on my blog who is autistic so I looked up the Arbaclofen trials again just to see what was going on and I found the Epiphany site with a lot of interesting stuff about the trial and baclofen. It is a fascinating drug. I just had this feeling that with all the hoopla about it helping autistic kids that the story just could not end there. I was following the blogs of some of the parents of the kids and it was heartbreaking. The stories of recovery were very similar to the experiences we have seen here. And then Roche pulls the plug. Bestards!

I think in time, we will all stop talking about alcoholism and autism etc and talk about treatments of this part of the brain. All of this has happened since the development of brain imaging in the 90's and by the pure chance of people like Ameisen and the people who set up Seaside Therapeutics noting the effects of baclofen on anxiety type conditions.

It's all going to come in a big "flood" over the next 18 months with France approving baclofen and this autism thing coming through...just you see. Exciting times.

[terryk]

Baclofen stimulates growth!

Not to rain on anyone's parade, but I've brought this up before - if not publicly, then definitely in PM's with some senior members, including Evan:

Different control of GH secretion by gam... [Drug Alcohol Depend. 2001] - PubMed - NCBI

Different control of GH secretion by gamma-amino- and gamma-hydroxy-butyric acid in 4-year abstinent alcoholics.
Vescovi PP1, Coiro V.
Author information
Abstract

The present study attempted to establish whether long term abstinence from alcohol restores the stimulatory effects on GH secretion of gamma-aminobutyric acid (GABA) and gamma-hydroxybutyric acid (GHB) that are absent during the first month of alcohol withdrawal. Six 4-year abstinent alcoholic subjects--already tested with GHB 4 years earlier, and seven age- and weight-matched normal controls, were tested p.o. with 800 mg sodium valproate (a drug that enhances endogenous GABA activity), 10 mg baclofen (a GABA(B) receptor agonist), 25 mg/kg body-weight GHB, or a placebo. The blood samples for growth hormone (GH) assay were taken every 30 min for the next 150 min. Placebo administration did not modify GH secretion in any subject. All drugs induced a significant increase in serum GH levels in normal controls. GH secretion in abstinent alcoholics did not change after baclofen or sodium valproate administration, whereas the GH response to GHB was similar to that observed in normal controls. The data confirm previous observations which suggest that different neuroendocrine mechanisms underlie GABA and GHB control of GH secretion. The data also indicates that the GHB--but not the GABA--stimulated pathway returns to normal in alcoholics after 4 years abstinence.

-------------------------------

Some points to consider are: Is the defective GH mechanism a product of alcohol abuse? (probably) If it is, at what point does the damage occur? Is it irreparable? Low dose baclofen appears ineffective, what about high dose baclofen - or is it broken once it's broken? GHB works, why not baclofen? Lastly, the use of the term "alcoholic" doesn't give us anyway to quantify how much alcohol abuse is responsible for the change in GH secretion. It's not like once someone goes to an AA meeting and says "hi everybody, I'm an alcoholic" that their GH production stops working.....

-tk

p.s. btw, I've been on hdb for almost 4 years - currently 200mg/day and I powerlift (Evan gave me some pointers here) - my deadlift has increased from ~345lbs to ~430lbs in the past year and a half. Clearly I've been able to build muscle.

[StuckinLA]

Baclofen stimulates growth!

Argh. Is this (lowered GH levels post alcohol cessation) why even moderate exercise (rowing, cycling, jogging) is enough to make me feel like I've just done a heavy-lifting day? I'm freakin' limping around, practically. Granted, the first few days back to the gym after little activity are always rough, but sheesh.

[skullbabyland]

Baclofen stimulates growth!

I too have read the interesting threads on baclofen and exercise. I figured that the increases in strength gains were just due to being AF and actually being consistent with exercise, as before I was always just too drunk/hungover all the time to be consistent.

But if baclofen's helping me build more muscle, then a great SE to have, I'll take it.

Terry K, awesome deadlift numbers btw.

[Jeremy78210]

Baclofen stimulates growth!

Interesting subject as I have mentioned on another post is the growth in my lower parts from Baclofen... I must have gained an inch plus a difference in girth... Anybody else experienced this??? The on SE I like from Baclofen!!!

[Otter]

Baclofen stimulates growth!

Jeremy78210;1647874 wrote: Interesting subject as I have mentioned on another post is the growth in my lower parts from Baclofen... I must have gained an inch plus a difference in girth... Anybody else experienced this??? The on SE I like from Baclofen!!!

You're going to have to buy new shoes then, I suppose? You are talking about your feet?

[spiritwolf333]

Baclofen stimulates growth!

Jeremy78210;1647874 wrote: Interesting subject as I have mentioned on another post is the growth in my lower parts from Baclofen... I must have gained an inch plus a difference in girth... Anybody else experienced this??? The on SE I like from Baclofen!!!
Otter;1648470 wrote: You're going to have to buy new shoes then, I suppose? You are talking about your feet?

Jeremy -I am with Otter. Are your feet swelling or actually growing? I've not read about this side effect. Very interesting. And Jeremy, do you think Baclofen will help with a balding head of hair?

[guardian]

Baclofen stimulates growth!

At very high doses I also had swelling in my hands and feet. I also get numbness and loss of strength in my hands; a carpel tunnel-like side effect that is also common among athletes using supraphysiological doses of HGH.

I remember researching for my now-infamous "why baclofen causes loss of libdo in men" post (thanks Terry), finding several studies suggesting that baclofen increases both amplitude and duration of HGH release.

I do know that the majority of HGH's growth-promoting and anabolic effect are due to IGF-1, which is produced in the liver. It would not surprise me that alcoholics have a blunted response to an HGH secretagogue like baclofen due to compromised liver function.

[terryk]

Baclofen stimulates growth!

guardian;1648513 wrote:
I do know that the majority of HGH's growth-promoting and anabolic effect are due to IGF-1, which is produced in the liver. It would not surprise me that alcoholics have a blunted response to an HGH secretagogue like baclofen due to compromised liver function.

Wow. Concise, rational insight - in the meds forum.... How I have missed it. Long time no see, btw. Just pulled up your last update (as JustIan) - I hope you are well. -tk

[Otter]

Baclofen stimulates growth!

guardian;1648513 wrote: At very high doses I also had swelling in my hands and feet. I also get numbness and loss of strength in my hands; a carpel tunnel-like side effect that is also common among athletes using supraphysiological doses of HGH.

I remember researching for my now-infamous "why baclofen causes loss of libdo in men" post (thanks Terry), finding several studies suggesting that baclofen increases both amplitude and duration of HGH release.

I do know that the majority of HGH's growth-promoting and anabolic effect are due to IGF-1, which is produced in the liver. It would not surprise me that alcoholics have a blunted response to an HGH secretagogue like baclofen due to compromised liver function.

Secratagogue...didn't he win the Kentucky Derby three times.