How long until you can start finding maintenance dose?

[Calikime]

Hi All,
I started on Baclofen in late 2013. I have taken it very slowly since I have experienced so many side effects along the way. I started to get a glimpse of indifference when I got around 100-110 mgs of Baclofen. I kept increasing because I had not felt any relief from my anxiety. I am up to 140 mgs and definitely have indifference but still no anxiety relief. However, the side effects have gotten the best of me and I am worn out. The sleep deprivation is one of the biggest things I am dealing with, which makes it hard to cope. I had wanted to continue to increase the dose to get anxiety relief, but like I said I need a break after 4 months of dealing with the side effects. Before they would at least subside so I had a break, but for some reason the dose I am at just doesn't seem to settle down at all. Is there a risk in lowering my dose this soon in the process? The indifference has been so wonderful that I don't want to ruin all the hard work I have put in. I wasn't sure if you had to stay at your switch dose for a certain period of time before attempting to find your maintenance dose. I just feel like if I can go down a little bit and get a break from the se's my outlook will improve. I have already decreased to 120 mgs over the past week and I have slept better the last two nights. Any thoughts would be appreciated. I realize that I have already started lowering my dose and now I am asking the question after the fact....

[StuckinLA]

How long until you can start finding maintenance dose?

French prescribing guide says 3 months. But that's not carved in stone.

[Samandkatharine]

How long until you can start finding maintenance dose?

Hi Cali,

I'm sorry about the SEs. They suck for some. I struggle with insomnia and have been on baclofen since late last summer. I reached my switch, but some nights are frustrating sleep wise. My personal program varies, but I try and do the following-

Stay AL free. I can have 1-2 glasses of wine, but my sleep gets fragmented. I get anxious too.
Take magnesium glycinate before bed. Baths help too, either with Epsom salts or magnesium chloride flakes.
Eat well, and include healthy fats. Omega 3's, coconut oil ect.
Try not to nap. They are lovely but screw up your total night time amount. Exercise is great to lift your mood and your sleep will improve too.

Sam

[Ne/Neva Eva]

How long until you can start finding maintenance dose?

Seems to me that there has to be a balance in all things, even baclofen! After I reached indifference I went down way too much, and way too quickly. I've done that more than once, actually. Going back up has never been as harrowing as the first time. Plus, after way too much experimentation, I figured out that going slowly and keeping track made it much more reasonable.

My suggestion? Go down in small increments. Create some habits to help with getting a good night's sleep. (Relax about it! It will come!) Then if you find you want to drink, you can make the decision to go up in small increments. 140mg right now is not how 140mg will be if you decide to go up again. Really.

If you're drinking, then stop. (Sorry. I don't believe in abstinence as the primary indication of success, but alcohol messes up the brain and body and you'll need to get some sleep!) I can tell the difference in sleep and attitude after just one glass of wine. I think it's called normal! (But who knows?!)

Hang in there.

[Calikime]

How long until you can start finding maintenance dose?

Thanks for all the good advice. I haven't been drinking for about the past month, which is good. It is so awesome to watch other people drinking on TV shows and have no desire myself to get up and go in the kitchen and pour myself some wine.

What I am hoping is that I may have overshot my switch in the sense that I kept increasing even when the indifference was probably there already but I keep looking for the anxiety piece of the puzzle to be there, so I keep upping the dose trying to find it. I still hope that I will experience some anxiety relief from my Baclofen journey, but if it has already taken care of the indifference, maybe whatever clinical effect I am going to get is already in place. Has anyone had this happen where they achieved indifference first and then anxiety relief later? Or do you have to look to add in other medications, and if so what would compliment Baclofen? I had success with Buspirone for many years (of course I still drank), but then it stopped working. I tried several times to go back on it and for whatever reason it just didn't work. Then I found Dr. Ameisen's book and this site, etc.

I know I can experiment with increasing again after the se's settle back down and find out.
Thanks again for all the responses.
Cali

[MickeySoFine1972]

How long until you can start finding maintenance dose?

Hi

Good to hear you are indifferent!

Have you considered changing brand on the type of Baclofen? I recently switched from nueraxpharm to Baclofen AL and found the difference in side effects amazing! the neuraxpharm was making me ridiculously sleepy but when I switch that all changed and I was able to continue going up.

Just a thought as the pharma companies dont all use the same binding agents etc to make the same stuff. And certainly not at such high doses.

Mickey

[Calikime]

How long until you can start finding maintenance dose?

MickeySoFine1972;1649344 wrote: Hi

Good to hear you are indifferent!

Have you considered changing brand on the type of Baclofen? I recently switched from nueraxpharm to Baclofen AL and found the difference in side effects amazing! the neuraxpharm was making me ridiculously sleepy but when I switch that all changed and I was able to continue going up.

Just a thought as the pharma companies dont all use the same binding agents etc to make the same stuff. And certainly not at such high doses.

Mickey

I really like the online pharmacy I use and they seem to carry only one brand of Baclofen from Mylan pharmacy in New Zealand. How do you think the binding agents have an affect on side effects? I know that somnolence is such a universal side effect of baclofen that it seems like it would be coming from the drug and not fillers, but I really don't know much about all of that. Do you get your baclofen online or from a pharmacy from home?
Thanks,
Cali

[neophyte]

How long until you can start finding maintenance dose?

as to anxiety relief, i didn't experience anxiety relief from baclofen and im on 300mg. the only reduction in anxiety i have received was from losing 'the fear' every morning after i had been drinking the night before, to quell that before i needed a shot or two to steady my nerves.

I'm looking to change up my anti depresants to get the final anxiety sorted. Personally, iwoudlnt keep pushing baclofen higher in the search for anti anxiety. i actually found my anxiety went up when going up in dose. perhaps that was due to a lack of sleep due to the insomnia, the anxiety over time did subside from increasing though.

im looking into Mirtazapine, it has the bonus of helping me out with my sleep, which i have trouble getting a full night sleep, i wake up way too early. It also doesnt effect seretonin, SSRIs seem to increase my cravings for alcohol

[Fred_The_Cat]

How long until you can start finding maintenance dose?

As far as anxiety, I think staying meaningfully busy and active is the best thing to do.

Back in February I was practically losing my mind from abilify withdrawal, and one particular day stands out as to how a state of anxiety can be turned around:

I'd spent all weekend in bed being depressed, and Tuesday came with some sort of stomach bug. I couldn't tell whether anxiety was causing the stomach bug or accelerated my obsession over it- but I left work early because I was losing my composure. I was curled up in bed in a state of complete disgust and terror. Out of brute force, I did three things:

1. I meditated for 15 minutes to calm down (using the Calm meditation app).
2. I cleaned my room. The tedious repetition and attention to detail was the perfect distraction to stop panicking. A therapist once told me: "Your mode of living up to this point has been: 'I feel, therefore I don't do. It must become 'I do, therefore I feel." That small feeling of accomplishment was one of the most satisfying things I've ever done.
3. I kept my gym appointment. The endorphin rush kicked me back into gear and I slept great that night.

That was the last anxiety attack I ever remember having.

[Calikime]

How long until you can start finding maintenance dose?

Thanks Neophyte and Fred,
I guess if I had to choose if Baclofen would either give me only indifference or only anxiety relief, I would choose indifference hands down. So I am very thankful to be where I am at with that for sure. I was on a good anti anxiety medication, but I still drank of course. That particular drug, Buspirone for some reason stopped having any anti anxiety effects for me after many years of taking it.

I am with you Neophyte that I can't take SSRI's, so I would like to have some other alternatives. Do you need to be careful which other drugs you mix with baclofen? I feel like adding in another drug would change the brain chemistry again and I just don't want to mess with the good that baclofen is doing for me. But my anxiety is very real and I really want to find something to help with that. Do you think that since baclofen isn't helping with anxiety for some of us that it is due to some other neurotransmitters that are out of balance and not just the one that baclofen targets? Maybe I am way oversimplifying a complex situation. I have tried talk therapy over the years, biofeedback, and many other things to help with my anxiety naturally with only modest benefit at best.

Cali

[Samandkatharine]

How long until you can start finding maintenance dose?

Hi Cali,

Are you from CA? I am...

Bac quelled my anxiety in low doses. Once I got to my switch the anxiety came back. I think the lack of alcohol brought it back. I wake up with it and it's hell. I'd like to find an AD that doesn't mess with sleep and doesn't stop you up without using Ex-lax.:H maybe that would be the missing piece to the puzzle. Baclofen deals with GABA, and GABA calms you down. It did that for me at first, but maybe that was my "pink cloud".

Sam

[Calikime]

How long until you can start finding maintenance dose?

Samandkatharine;1649851 wrote: Hi Cali,

Are you from CA? I am...


Sam

Hi Sam,
Yes I too am from California. Do you get your Bac from a script or some other source? I am trying to find a doctor in California that will prescribe baclofen for me. I also thought there was a place on this list that has Baclofen friendly doctors, but I can't seem to locate it.

Anyone out there know where I can find it?

Thanks,
Cali

[Calikime]

How long until you can start finding maintenance dose?

Ne/Neva Eva;1649310 wrote: Seems to me that there has to be a balance in all things, even baclofen! After I reached indifference I went down way too much, and way too quickly. I've done that more than once, actually. Going back up has never been as harrowing as the first time. Plus, after way too much experimentation, I figured out that going slowly and keeping track made it much more reasonable.

My suggestion? Go down in small increments. Create some habits to help with getting a good night's sleep. (Relax about it! It will come!) Then if you find you want to drink, you can make the decision to go up in small increments. 140mg right now is not how 140mg will be if you decide to go up again. Really.

If you're drinking, then stop. (Sorry. I don't believe in abstinence as the primary indication of success, but alcohol messes up the brain and body and you'll need to get some sleep!) I can tell the difference in sleep and attitude after just one glass of wine. I think it's called normal! (But who knows?!)

Hang in there.

Ne,
Thanks for the advice. since I am now indifferent I haven't been drinking alcohol. Of course now I feel like I am flying without a safety net because I am not using alcohol to calm me, and the HDB is hard to live with and makes my anxiety worse right now.
I was looking through some old threads on anxiety and Baclofen and I saw one from you from 2011 where it sounds like you didn't experience anxiety relief at low doses. You then reached indifference while on HDB and then started lowering your dose back down. You said you did finally get relief from anxiety. Was this after you lowered your dose to a certain level? Can you give me a little more information on that experience?
Thanks,
Cali

[Samandkatharine]

How long until you can start finding maintenance dose?

Cali,
PM me and I can refer you. Unfortunately to find someone who knows baclofen intimately will cost you $$ in the SF Bay Area. I have a script for a low dose, and get the rest online.

Sam