Here we go again

[StuckInCA]

This is Lis's thread. This is a safe space for her to post.

This is Lis's thread. This is a safe space for her to post.

This is Lis's thread. This is a safe space for her to post.

GO FUCK OFF AND DIE HORRIBLE DEATHS AND POST ELSEWHERE. I fucking hate you, Spirit, because you are trying to poison a space that has been helpful for Lis, and for BK, and now for Kronk and Dun. So go fuck off and die, dude. You are not welcome here and you are toxic because you are actively trying to harm people.

[Ne/Neva Eva]

I love Anne Lamott. I haven't read her essays. My brother, who is not at all engaged with my life, sent me Bird by Bird when I was in rehab. Holy cow. He didn't even know that she's one of us, he just knew that I loved to write and he liked to read what I wrote. The sweetest gesture from someone so far removed...It is a warm feeling.



It took me forever to get on board with my kindle. Now? So much to love. I sorely miss pages, though. A well loved book is a treasurable thing. Which is not at all the point.



I love the fact that I can read some Lamott tonight, somehow. Either the well loved books I have, or something from the kindle.



Thanks for the reminder, Dun. If you haven't read her, Lis, it's all nonfiction. I think you would enjoy her writing, too, Kronk. It's fun and funny and pertinent. Not just to recovering from this disease (which isn't her focus at all) but to life in general. So much wisdom and wry humor from that cool hippy chick. I wonder if I can be like her when I grow up?

[StuckInCA]

Stuck you can't use a real name here. Against the rules.

It's in his goddamned signature.

I edited. All gone.

[spiritwolf333]

I will, Spirit. I'm having another drink right now, actually, and enjoying it. In about 20 minutes or a half hour or so my girlfriend will get home from work, and then I will have sex with her. Depending on how I'm feeling, it will most likely be kinky sex. Then I will go to the bar and hang out and then I'll come back home when I've gotten my fill of socializing. I'll slip into bed, and probably finger my girl to orgasm while she sleeps. I don't know, that's just how I roll.

And all this time? You, sir, will still be an ignorant asshole.

Stuck -this is a painful read. I am very -very sorry that I read this and I hope that wife and and our sons don't log in for a while.

[spiritwolf333]

I hope you sober up, friend. Alcohol doesn't seem to be treating you very well.

ok stuck. I will try to stop drinking.

[anne1232]

2nd that about Anne Lamott's "Bird By Bird." Amazing. Got her latest right here- "Small Victories" but she's repeating herself; although still inspiring. http://www.drweil.com/drw/u/QAA40039...-Ails-You.html
^This supplement has really helped me, as has upping the fish oil re the book "The Cure for Depression"

[Ne/Neva Eva]

Hi Ann. It's been so long since I've read Bird by Bird, I don't think I'd mind a repeat. I'll check out Small Victories. Thanks for the recommendation. I'm one of the ones who is very reluctant to try herbal remedies, but fish oil is tried and true. Of course, I need to remember to take it. The doctor I saw last week suggested taking CoEQ (??) to combat the muscle and joint aches I get when I take a statin for my cholesterol. It surprised me! He also said he would put statins in water...That they are that beneficial for circulatory health. (He was exaggerating, of course. What's interesting is that I've read a bunch of stuff online about how they're ineffective and what-not. I've learned so much about discernment since I started school. Not enough, but more than I knew! Anyway...)

Man, I really felt like we were on to something for about a minute there. Do you think we can get back to where we were before the commercial interruption? I'm going to read back and then post another post.

[Ne/Neva Eva]

Ok. The exercise thing. There are situps and pushups and squats and lunges. Those are things that the trainer made me do when I saw one a couple of months ago. Can be done for free, braless, in the comfort of one's living room. With reality tv on in the background! Inspiration for achieving one's dreams! woot! I'm in, minus the reality tv, if you guys are. (Unless one of you has a better suggestion, which I'm all for, and really hope you do. I think the only thing that will get me to do those exercises, or anything similar, on my own, is peer pressure.)



As for the bra thing, those are the reasons they'd need to be reduced, Lis. I envy you, Dun. Mine are...in the way. When I was really pretty hard core about working out and eating well, in late 2010 into 2011 (thanks, again, Lo0p!) I lost enough mammary to wear some really, really cute little dresses and halter tops. Completely age-inappropriate, but who cares? I'm not setting myself up with a weight loss goal, but that would be nice.



I'm still angry with and about Evan, so it's hard for me to talk about him, especially when it comes to liquid bac. I know he helped a lot of people. He was just a super-knucklehead about how he went about it and it cost him dearly, even before he died.



Lis, you'll just have to practice after you get your license. It's going to be rotten driving conditions anyway, so maybe plan on taking it slow and easy for a while. I vividly remember driving around a parking lot by myself and it was pretty awesome. So another thing to look forward to doing...Freedom. I think there's a country song somewhere in there.



The money...It IS expensive. I sorely miss the days of my $10 copay! But well worth it. It is impossible to predict it, and undermines the process to stress about it before it happens. (The added anxiety of self-medicating may even contribute to the side effects we experience here. It's a theory that makes sense to me.) Slow and easy, then Freedom.



We drink because we have a brain chemistry dysfunction. Not because it makes us high, or happy, or social. Those are the perks. It temporarily eases the whatever that is doing whatever that makes us need alcohol (or something) to fix it. That barely makes sense. I'm trying to make the point that we drink regardless of whether it feels good, or it's appropriate, or jeopardizes things that are very important to us. Revisit that video. Here's a screen shot I took from it:







I'm going to get my hairs done this morning by a fabulous man who lavishes me with gossip and praise. He is one of the people that I try very hard to engage with in a very superficial, non-judgmental way. We want to adore each other. It works for us. Don't judge. I hope your mornings start off almost as happy as mine will. If not, I hope it will soon.



:hug: my real friends

[kronkcarr]

I didn't miss all of this fighting when I wasn't logged on. I work on my judgemental attitude daily. I surely have no idea what someone must do or should do.

Spirit, I'm saying this in the kindest manner I know. I think it would help me if you would post about your experience with baclofen. It would help me see where you've been and what events lead you to post the things you do.

Lis, hopefully I'll be running again soon. It was a groin tear and I've been patient with it.

As to bras: I hate them. I wear one to work and it's 16 years old!

dun, yes, I had success drinking here and there with friends. I think I started to fall when I brought it into my home. I also think that I'm sensitive to others' emotions and take them all in. That's what I think happened with my friend.

[dundrinkn]

Alright Ne, I'm in on the exercise. I will start slowly. And it will be with the TV on -- though not reality TV.

Oh that damn brain chemistry thing. I have to admit that I am always seeking a chemical to make me feel better. I guess I've just accepted that really isn't alcohol. I don't know. Maybe I haven't totally accepted that. Because it does actually make me feel better. And then worse.

Speaking of altering brain chemistry... Stuck, I did try oxcytocin. Though not for anxiety. I read it is good for enhancing sex/intimacy. I didn't notice anything the times I took it.

Evan... I don't want to discuss him too much here because it would open him up to the sort of hell fire and damnation scrutiny we all face every time we write something on this forum, and since he can't defend himself, that seems unfair. I will only say that I was not close enough to him to be angry -- either when he was alive or now. He was a voice on the phone and a presence on the board. He was quirky and passionate and I was charmed and amused. All from a safe distance. Ne I know and understand enough to have compassion for where you are with all of it.

Compassion. That is one thing I love about Anne Lamott's writing. It is chock full of it -- for herself, for others. It is a softness that I try and access when what I really want to do is respond from that hard, judgmental, self-righteous place. Thanks Kronk, for coming from that place in your post. I woke up on a rip tear and was going to post something like you had, only not so kind.

I absolutely love running. I can get that high thing going. It is just so hard on my aging body. But maybe if I get into a bit of shape doing other things (like sit ups and lunges etc) I can run enough without injury to pump up the endorphins.

For whatever reason I am feeling better. Might be because I have my kids and they do add structure and a sense of purpose to my days. Though it also feels like something has lifted a bit. I am actually hopeful that if I can take advantage of the lightening and start to move my body before "it" descends again, that I can get some momentum going for feeling better. Either way, it's worth a try.

Hope everyone else is surviving ok. Let's try and keep it going. Agree with Ne that it seemed like we were on to something.

[Ne/Neva Eva]

For whatever reason I am feeling better. ...Though it also feels like something has lifted a bit.

Maybe it's writing?

Kronk, I have always admired you. Even when you weren't (or aren't) so sure about me. (For very understandable reasons, I suppose.) In no small part because you seemed to glomm on to sobriety and really recreate your life, too. I can definitely empathize with taking other people's feelings on board. That is a thing I think I have effectively conquered, for the time being. Not that my parents don't bring that out in me in full capacity. And lots of other stuff, too.

I also refuse to run with a goal of more than a 5k, because I'm scared of injury. Basically, I try to refuse to do anything that I can attach more meaning to than needs be. Goals need to be very reasonable or I get really kerfuffled. Losing the 4.0 GPA was really a gift, as painful as it was.

oops. I am cooking dinner in the other room. Or should be.

'til later.

[Lostinspace]

Wow. I missed a lot after I signed off last night. I thought it was just a normal post, but I guess drama can lurk behind any corner. But in the spirit of getting things back to the normally supportive environment this thread is, let’s just move on. There’s so much to comment on, I don’t even know where to begin, and I’m sure I won’t touch half of the stuff that’s been mentioned.

Thanks for the reading recommendations dun, Ne and anne - I’ve never heard of Anne Lamott. I’ll have to check her out. That is, if my terrible, goldfish-like memory can retain the idea long enough to take it to the library. I wrote it down, though, so hopefully my sticky note will serve me well. And thanks for the quotes, dun. Those are thoughts I need to keep in mind more often, for sure.

I’ll try my best not to overthink things, Ne, and just wait to see what happens with the dose I end up needing. I appreciate the reminder of that talk. Even though that slide didn’t show it, I need to remind myself that there are physical (neurochemical) reasons why I am the way I am. I hate to say it, but there are still times when I get down on myself for not just sucking it up and doing what I *should* do. I was against AA for so many (what I think are) legitimate reasons, that I threw the baby out with the bathwater, and for a long time refused to see alcoholism as a disease. I knew that physical dependence was real - I’ve suffered severe withdrawal too many times to deny that, but I figured that once I had broken the physical dependence, going back to drinking was simply an indication that I’m a weakling. I’m changing my mind about that, but I still revert to hating on myself.


That’s great that you’re gonna start doing some exercise, dun. But I guess that means I have no excuse now, either. I really could do sit-ups, lunges, etc. in front of the tv. I don’t have to wait until I join a gym, or just lament about the cold weather, or not having fancy equipment at home. Sigh. I better get on that. And I’m so glad to hear that you’re feeling lighter now. I would agree with Ne that writing, and reaching out to others, could be part of it, in addition to having your kids.

I’m glad you’ll be running again soon, kronk. Groin tears are really painful. I had that once back in my teenage years (as a ballet dancer), and I hope to never experience it again. I hope you get back on the road/trails/wherever you run soon. And god, I hate all the fighting, too. Believe it or not, it was actually pretty peaceful around these parts until just a couple days ago, which is when you came back. Maybe it’s a full moon or something? Who knows. In any event, don’t let it discourage you from posting. It happens for sure, and that’s very frustrating, but it doesn’t seem to be the norm.

Anyway, I think this new dose is making it harder for me to tolerate alcohol. I woke up with a holy hangover from hell this morning, even though I didn’t drink any more than what I’m used to these last few months. I actually threw up about an hour after I got to work - that was really classy. At least I felt it coming and I made it to the bathroom in time. Ugh!

I hate, yet at moments like these, like the fact that I’m experienced in alcohol-induced nausea. When I was drinking a liter and a half of vodka/bourbon a day, I used to throw up almost daily (maybe because my body was trying to tell me it was being f**king poisoned!!). Anyway, it pays to know the difference between “my stomach feels off” and “oh my god, I’m gonna blow chunks any second now, I better get me to a bathroom.”

The bathroom at work is a good minute walk down the hall. If I had already started salivating excessively, I would have swallowed my pride, puked in the garbage can, blamed it on food poisoning, then gone home. But because I know the exact feeling in my stomach when I’m about to go from nausea, to “stand back everyone, I’m about to blow,” I was able to get to a bathroom in time.

It’s actually a useful skill. Can I put that on that my resume? “Will never throw up in unintended places.” Just kidding. I have to find some humor in all this. Anyway, I drank again tonight, because apparently I’m a glutton for punishment. Well, I hope you’re all having a good night :hug:

[Spiritfree]

Oh, man. I came back on to delete my post because an angry confrontation is exactly what Spirit has been looking for with all of these posts.

(I don't have kids, so that doesn't resonate with the Disney flick. I just wanted to point that fact out. ha.)

Ne -you have a real opportunity to help a few folks who are in real trouble relative to alcohol. These people need real 'offline' help before it is too late. Please consider helping them the way that you can and stop worrying about....
Just a thought! (And thank you for deleting your 'angry' post)

[dundrinkn]

Hey Lis. You can do a search on Anne Lamott online and it will pull up a number of essays that you can read for free, or without having to go to the library. She has been published in a lot of different places. Also, I'm glad you liked the quote, but I actually wasn't thinking of you when I posted it.

I suppose that writing, connecting as it were, might be lifting my mood. Anyway... will write more tomorrow. I have a 14 year old who is throwing a lovely hissy fit in my house. Not unlike the fit being thrown here. And in both places, the tantrum thrower will have the last word -- a universal law. So no need to say. In fact I may just go to bed really early and read a book.

[StuckInCA]

Hi everybody. The semester is almost over - just. One. More. Day.

So I don't know why I haven't been paying closer attention to this before, but the last couple days I've been reading about climate change and I have to say, I am basically devastated right now. Officially super depressed. And no - this isn't simply a pre-existing depression latching onto something. Yesterday all I could do was sit in my bedroom, drinking a bottle of whiskey, and playing Xbox. Today I'm trying to rehydrate and all I want to do is get in bed and hold the girl and try to find some meaning in life and some reason that anything is worth doing. That's probably sounding a little melodramatic and over the top, but it is how I'm feeling at the moment.

I have a lot of issues with mortality in general, and this is a soul-crushing addition to that. Guess all I'm saying is that today I did not drink, I'm going to curl up with a person I love, and then... Finish this goddamned dissertation so I can work on things that I love and try to hold onto some thread of hope.

Ugh. I can't even stand how whiny I sound. Have a good night everyone. Talk to you all tomorrow.