Here we go again

[dundrinkn]

Stuck. I was thinking about what you said about your g-friend and how you felt like she was going to abandon you when you didn't know you were going to have an income. And how you took care of stuff for her when she first moved there. I'm not great at this so I'm no expert, but it seems you should probably clear the air before she moves out. It sounds like you're waiting to see what happens and getting ready to sort of give her a big wake up call about your space and her space. I understand that you're pissed, but from experience, I can drink over this kind of stuff really easily. Might be worth it to just tell her you're hurt about it and that you're angry she is getting her own space and see what she says. Maybe you're more of a grown up than I am and you've already done that. Just a thought. Hope your weekend went well and the AF time is bringing you some relief.

Me, sorry you had a rough time on your trip. The baclofen will offer you a window of relief at some point. Or a door. Just walk through it (changed the metaphor so I didn't have to tell you to jump out the window! Ha!!) In the meantime, try not to beat yourself up. What's done is done.

Stevo. So sorry about your mom. That is really hard. Hang in there.

Lis -- not to leave you out since this is your thread... how're you doing? How was the weekend? Hope your job is settling down. You work very, very hard. Is the AF time getting any more pleasant for you?

Hope everyone else is having a super cheery Monday. Or at least a moderately OK start to the week.

[Lostinspace]

Stuck - I’m glad you’re going to set some boundaries to make the arrangement with your girlfriend more fair. There’s no reason your apartment should be a common ground when she has her very own hideaway. I hope she’s receptive to what you have to say. And that’s so awesome that you’re still abstinent! It’s great to see

MJM - Others have already said it, but it bears repeating. Don’t beat yourself up over things you regret doing in Europe. I’m sure we could all write a book (or a series!) about our embarrassing or shameful behavior while intoxicated. It’s the nature of the beast and it happens. And don’t give up hope. 125 mg is still pretty low. Many, if not most, of us have found that we need to go higher to find indifference. You will get there.

dun - I’m doing alright. My weekend with my friend was really great, but also really sad, because I know I’ll never see her again face to face (outside of Skype). I’m not sure what to say about being AF. It’s definitely a hell of a lot easier now that I haven’t drank in over two months, and am simultaneously slowly going up on bac. Actually, it’s pretty rare these days that I have any serious thoughts of stopping at the liquor store, so I might already be there as far as indifference goes. But not drinking has also made me very much aware of both a) how very boring my life is, and b) how little motivation I have to really get out and do anything to change it. I know that spending all of my (limited) time outside of work watching tv and reading makes for a boring, and very lonely, life, but I just can’t seem to get myself interested in anything enough to go out and try new things, and where I might actually meet people. It really sucks. I always used to think that drinking made me a boring homebody, but the truth of the matter is that I’m the only one to blame. Drunk or dry, I just can’t get interested in anything. Sorry. I went on and on when you just asked a simple question. How are you doing? Are you having any pain yet from going up on bac? Any benefit? How’s life outside of bac?

[treetops]

Hi Lis. It's good to see you posting but don't beat yourself up. You know many people think they are boring - drunk or sober. Or they are bored. Exercise can really help - or finding something that really intrigues you. But TV is a huge sponge that many of us just collapse into especially when having a tiring regular job.
Anyway I am not here to rabbit on but just to wave a big hello. The motivation to change things in your life a bit might come in time. have you chewed this over with your partner or do you have some friends you can toss some ideas around with?
take care.

[Ne/Neva Eva]

But not drinking has also made me very much aware of both a) how very boring my life is, and b) how little motivation I have to really get out and do anything to change it. I know that spending all of my (limited) time outside of work watching tv and reading makes for a boring, and very lonely, life, but I just can??t seem to get myself interested in anything enough to go out and try new things, and where I might actually meet people. It really sucks. I always used to think that drinking made me a boring homebody, but the truth of the matter is that I??m the only one to blame. Drunk or dry, I just can??t get interested in anything. Sorry. I went on and on when you just asked a simple question. How are you doing? Are you having any pain yet from going up on bac? Any benefit? How??s life outside of bac?

It takes a good long while for the brain and body to readjust. Watching mindless tv and reading is a great way to reset those neurons that are used to freaking out at every little thing, you know? It's very good to relax, and to feel good about relaxing.



Stuck, amazing progress. Thanks so much for sharing all that. It actually sounds like things are pretty rational, in terms of your GF and her decisions, and your decisions related to creating your own healthy space.



Stevo, I hope your mom is recovering and that she will continue to recover from all that ails her.



MJM, Oh, man. That is a really unproductive refrain you've got running through your mind. I understand it all too well, of course, having said the same things to myself about a bazillion times. But maybe you can reframe it and remind yourself that you are actually taking steps to get better. Really profound, really positive, really productive steps. You have your eyes on the goal, right? And the rest, the drinking and struggling with not to drink, is just a part of the process. Unfortunately.



Dun, I would ask the same questions that Lost asked but I'm outta here and not checking back in. I don't think you have my email address, but I'll send you a PM. Ditto Kronk.



I know I've forgotten people, and I'm sorry about that. I will check back, and check my PMs to see if anyone responds to the other thread I started.



Cheers, people. Have no doubt I'll be thinking about you and sending very good vibes your way, regardless.



Much, much love.

[dundrinkn]

Lis -- I so understand what you are talking about. I get so bored with myself! Yet I can't seem to bring myself to socialize. I do spend a ton of time at soccer events for my kids, carpooling, and spending time with my extended family. I went to a wedding a few weeks ago where I only knew a few people. I socialized some and danced some and actually had a good time. Wasn't drinking either. I tend to not drink when I'm going out. Not my thing. Go figure. It's hard to get out the door, however. I love the couch and TV and while I don't read often, when I do, it's like I disappear into the book until it is over. And then I'm so sad it's over.

I spent a ton of time on this site yesterday going through old threads. Wow. There be some crazy shit that's gone down on MWO med threads. Really tragic stuff too. Seems that some folks have died when they quit drinking -- suicide/issues with medications. I combed through my old posts as well and was SHOCKED to see that in the last two and half years since I've been on baclofen I have been AF a lot. Big chunks of time -- 3 months, 6 months, 4 months. Well over half of the 30 months I've been sober. That's good news for my liver! I was also shocked that my switch is higher than I ever remember -- one time 160, the next closer to 180. And I always start down because I am so uncomfortable on that high a dose and then I get itchy, or maybe bored, and so I drink and so it goes...

So, I am trying to go back up on the Gabapentin. The weight has already been gained, so why not? I'm hoping that like Ne suggested, if I go up on the Gaba and the Bac, I might find a good place that is lower (less leg pain/discomfort) and the Gaba is also prescribed for nerve pain. The nerve pain is currently much less, but still there. I notice it a lot less right after the B12 shot and it gets worse as the week wears on. I'm currently at 500 mg of Gaba and 90mg of baclofen. In the last 2 weeks I've had 3 beers on 3 separate occasions. I will keep stretching the time in between and see how that it goes. Hoping to not have to go higher that 120mg of Baclofen. 100 would be even better.

I am going to still post on MWO in case it helps anyone. I will also be moving to whatever place where we can have more open and honest discussions without the constant apprehension/fear of the big, angry alcoholic stomping in the room and throwing things. Cuz that's what it feels like here. Like Dad is on a big dry drunk (or maybe not so dry, I found references and links to erased posts about at least 5 big drunks last year) and is making everyone else miserable. I'm sure if I were in therapy right now this would be a big, juicy topic. My alcoholic father was a volatile narcissist -- he was that way when he drank, and for the 20 years he was sober in AA before he died. I had a much younger brother, and I would always get in my dad's face and provoke him so he'd focus his rage on me rather than my sibling. (Ne, if you're still reading, I'm a counter-phobic 6 on the enneagram so this behavior completely makes sense). Being attacked and belittled by some anonymous poster is really nothing compared to that. And maybe I can keep him busy enough so he'll leave other people alone.

Otter, I very much appreciate what you said on Ne's thread about acting out your anger about this disease where you could (on this forum). Thank you for stopping by. I was just posting about missing you the other day!

[Lostinspace]

Thanks, treetops. I have brought it up with my husband but, unfortunately, he’s even less motivated than I am. We both enjoy the same couch hobbies.

Thanks, Ne. It is good to relax. I just wish I didn’t do it all the time. We will miss you here, but certainly understand why you’re leaving. See you in the new forum.

dun - I’m sorry you share my preference for the couch. But at least you have family stuff getting you out here and there. I really hope the gabapentin works out for you. You shouldn’t have to be in pain to maintain indifference.

[Mom21961]

Could someone PM me about this safe place you're going to? I've been looking for another place to post where people can discuss a difference of opinion without being abused. Love your description DD.

Edit: Never mind... saw Ne's post, sent a message. :thanks:

[dundrinkn]

Mom2. Email Ne at the address she gave on the "Leaving MWO" thread. PM me here on MWO and I will be sure you get included. I know you're struggling and we will all find a way out. Without fear, intimidation or bullying. Here we go!

[MeJustMe]

Firstly I want to apologise to Stuck for saying leaving his girlfriend might be a good thing. What a stupid thing to write. I'm sorry Stuck, my intentions were good, my words -- just awful. I just meant... oh never mind, I still can't seem to elucidate my thoughts. I don't ever wish to offend people, but sometimes my words manage to do such a fantastic job of exactly that. I guess I am not all that good at providing feedback or support.

I've been reading through a few threads here. Wow. A revolution has started. My take on trolls is I am too old and grumpy most of the time to put up with their malfeasance. Yet, in a moment where I feel weak and need support? Yes, that might really hit me hard. I was a member of a secular recovery forum, where I was really struggling to get sober. Someone posted to the effect that, 'what is it with a lot of posts lately where people just don't get it? I got sober, why the hell can't they?' I took it pretty hard. In some ways, I tried to think it was the shock I needed to get sober, but in reality, all it did was make me leave that forum. I did not get sober as a result of that comment. In fact, that is something I noticed generally in that rational recovery type forum, versus this one. Some people over there seemed pissed off that they were sober, at least judging by their grumpy posts. I don't see a lot of that here at all.

I have hit the switch. I titrated up to 150mg a night ago and yesterday my wife had a friend over for dinner and both were drinking. I thought to myself, 'why don't I have one?' but just couldn't bring myself to. Not because of a hang-over, rather that I simply could not see the point of drinking. That's what I want! I am getting really tired though; I titrated up a little too quickly from 125 to 150mg, really doing one day of 135mg then 150mg the next. I am not sure if I should step down to 135mg again or not; I'll see how I feel today. Now I have a choice; ride the Bac wave and see where it dumps me when I have no other resources for a crisis, or develop the skills to cope with any impending crisis. Exercise, meditation, here I come -- whether I like it or not!

LIS - I wanted to say, maybe the switching off is a really good thing - for now, maybe? I kind of relate to it, where I would spend ages looking at old cars to buy in the early days of not drinking, and spending hours every evening on Netflix. It is like a comfort food, if that makes sense. Maybe it just takes time to acclimate to the new sober way of life?

[Lostinspace]

Wooooohooooo!!! That’s so great to hear, MJM I bet a year (or even less) ago you never dreamed there would be a time when you couldn’t care less about drinking. If I were you, I would stick with 150 mg from here on out. The side effects will diminish and eventually disappear over time, and in the mean time you get to enjoy freedom from obsession and cravings. And thanks for your comment. Couch time in the evenings, and on the weekends, does feel a lot like comfort food, and it probably does take a while to acclimate. We’ll figure out how to navigate this whole sober living thing together.

[StuckinLA]

MJM, congratulations! And please do not worry about offending me. You didn't. I don't know if it would be good or not to have our own apartments. It might be, or it might be very bad. Either way I guess I don't have to worry about it for a while. She gave me her share of October rent today. I told her she could hold onto it until the end of the month of she wanted. I don't know if she's still looking at apartments.

I'm just tired of thinking about it.

I haven't posted much lately and I won't be posting much over the weekend. School started this week at both places, and I'm heading home for the weekend to celebrate my dad's birthday. It will be nice to get out of town for a couple days, but then I will have to catch up with work next week.

Have a good one, everybody.

[MeJustMe]

So now I'm worried. Really worried. This afternoon, a blackness came over me. I had the kids shipped off (it is school holidays) and could work. And yet I could not. I felt depressed, and nothing could lift my mood. I tried to do whatever I could to get moving on my writing, and even gave myself the out of trawling the net for cars, motorcycles, whatever. Nothing worked. I had this last time I was sober on Bac at 75mg, but then I thought my mum was about to die. This time there was no crisis. So I've been drinking for a couple of hours now. I don't know what to do. If Bac doesn't work, I'm back to the abyss of unfettered active drunkedness. AA has a 5 per cent success rate; Naltrexone and Campral about 30 per cent; the latest results give Bac about 60 per cent. If that does not work for me, what do I do???

[StuckinLA]

So sorry, MJM! Hang in there!

I used to really obsess over success rates and what 'worked' and what didn't work and for how many people. That kind of thinking got me through a lot of the time I was on bac and drinking more or less regularly. For some reason I relished the knowledge that AA's success rate is about equal to the rate of alcoholics who self-recover with no outside intervention whatsoever. Aha! I said, AA doesn't do shit!

The times I have been sober it hasn't been with bac and it hasn't been with AA. And I don't worry about how other people get clean or how they manage to stay drunk daily without anxiety. I just focus on the things I need to do - like right now I need to teach these 3 classes and that means I need to drive for my commute and I need to be sober so that I don't have terrible anxiety.

Having other things to do and to think about really helps. Having writing to do, though, is a motherf**ker and you have all of my sympathy and commiseration there.

Just remember that nothing is inevitable. Drinking today does not have to mean drinking tomorrow. And when the black hole of depression opens up, you can do literally anything you want to feel better. Eat a tub of ice cream, watch a favorite movie, go for a walk, put the writing aside and worry about it later. You can give yourself permission to do whatever and still feel fine about it.

Last week I came home after a bad day and I ate ice cream, then had a box of mac and cheese for dinner, and then snacked on chips while watching stupid comedy shows on Netflix. At the end of the night I felt like a fatass and like a pretty worthless person. But I was still able to look in the mirror and say it was all OK because I didn't drink. Didn't help much, but it did help a little.

Don't beat yourself up. That's the one rule. Dust yourself off in the morning, it'll be OK. And we'll all be here.

[treetops]

Thats a great post Stuck. It makes a lot of sense and resonates with me.
Writing is such a lonely business and when it goes well, its beautiful but when there is other stuff going on, it can choke us. The teaching will be exhausting but there is also some wee reward from this.

[MeJustMe]

Thank-you Stuck. I read your post this morning and it gives me hope. I am still of the AA mentality, where a drunk is a 'bust', and that doesn't do me any good. I have to get that idea out of my head. Drinking again does make it hard when I stop -- the withdrawal from AL, being vague for a few weeks.

I have noticed that in the main when I drink on Bac, my drinking is more contained. I don't stay up until the early hours, I don't decide to drive to the pub, I don't have as bad hangovers. It still isn't what I want; I don't just have a few drinks and leave it -- more like a bottle or two. That's why I want to get sober, because I don't see any other way at the moment.

I'll continue on the 150mg and maybe go up again if I keep drinking.

Hope everyone is going well out there. I really feel as though I have stumbled upon a nice bunch of people here.