Indifference

[Ne/Neva Eva]

Indifference

bleep, if it were only that easy.

X, I think you're right. Spirit HAS to keep posting the same thing over and over again for some reason that has nothing to do with reality. It's pathological. Maybe because he isn't and never has been abstinent, feels like a failure, and now insists that other people do what he could not (or would not) do. But what do I know? Last thing we need around here is someone making stuff up out of thin air when they don't really know the whole story.

I had an epiphany last night. This is simply a game of whack-a-mole! (Whack-a-troll?) It makes me feel sorry for poor Spirit, and I'd suggest just leaving him alone, except the whole premise behind his opinions, which he bases all his theories on, are just fubar. They're factually wrong, Spirit. And rather than actually learning from anything anyone has said, or even doing some reading on your own (other than basic google searches) you just keep spewing the same nonsense. It's sad. And maddening.

Attached files [img]/converted_files/2351141=7774-attachment.jpg[/img]

[Fred_The_Cat]

Indifference

Given the fact that he's talked to several people on the phone I'd be hard pressed to say he's a fake. I've had several fake characters destroy message boards before, but never with THAT level of devastation. I have a hard time believing this was not intentional, but by all indications, it seems so.

Just, wow. I know the board is dead but I can't help but keep coming back to the troll cave, lol.

[Fred_The_Cat]

Indifference

An Ne, I've had suspicions he's gone on a few benders myself.

For one thing, he obsesses over the same very vague point and directs blame towards others.

For another thing, every other member on here who's gotten turned around has had specific things to say about how life has improved or unexpectedly gotten difficult. None of that from him, just peaches and sunshine on repeat.

Remember Jimmy Swaggart, and how his congregation was starting to get put off by his preoccupation with sexual immorality to the point of discussing nothing else? Yeah, I think I get the picture now.

[kronkcarr]

Indifference

Ok. I'll join the party. Ne, I love your photo. Here's an old favorite song of mine:

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=G7hzGtmPb6M

I do agree with spirit on one thing. But I disagree that only alcoholics (true ones) "need to follow through with the necessary tools". Isn't the topic of how to live after crazy drinking on almost everyone's thread? Certainly we are more comfortable if we learn to live in the world. spirit, if this is what you've been saying all along perhaps we can drop it now.

[spiritwolf333]

Indifference

If you take time to read this post, I thank you in advance.

I would respectfully ask that my fellow MWO members stop and consider a few points:

First -I try and be helpful to others who are experiencing our common disease

Second -For the most part, I try to be respectful to those who comment -regardless of their message or opinion.

I have been personally attacked for the misspelling of words, names, improper grammar usage. A few of you have gone on to call me a "troll" or even someone who brings harm to potential newcomers wanting to experience "baclofen" as a solution. And still others, have even decided to attack my character and mental shortcomings. Perhaps, the "group" or "gang" that keeps making these accusations feel better about themselves after responding with their personal attacks and negative opinions. Who knows?

If I were a betting person, I would almost certainly bet that some of the issues I have brought forth have hit home with many of you? I would go on to guess that perhaps you "naysayers" still have issues yourselves regarding these topics. Instead of offering insight or experience (for the most part), you attack me.

Let me give one example. Repeatedly, I have suggested -as fact, that the only reason that majority of people who drink alcohol do so to change the way that they feel or think at any given moment -about anything. I personally think that this is critically important to accept and acknowledge -of only to ourselves. Baclofen does not override this basic thought pattern. It only helps us to deal with it more effectively. Those of us who consider our selves alcoholics or addicts, realize that we have a some form of short circuit when it comes to rationalizing the need to change our thoughts or feelings using chemicals. This simple but complex problem is what delivered us into the hell of addiction begin with.

It appears to me that many of the posts in the med section deal with titration dosages and schedules regarding baclofen. If this is all you want to speak about, then great. Keep doing so -many of you are experts in this area. But I would suggest that if you want to try and help others outside the arena of baclofen, then bring up subjects that help people think beyond their first week or two of sobriety and potentially how they can stay that way. (Or just continue with some of your binge stories and how baclofen helped you to quickly overcome the consequences)

[Ne/Neva Eva]

Indifference

Fred, I know Spirit. He's not trolling. He's trying to help. Who or what, and how, is what is so confusing.

Kronk, I totally dig that song. Omg. LOVE it. hahahaha. I'm having a really lovely day on my patio with my puppy, reading and hanging out without agenda or guilt. That song...is not my mood, but fits where I'm at. Thanks.

And I agree that we all need to learn how to live after we stop drinking against our will. It was a weird new world. Still is sometimes. But indubitably better.

[Ne/Neva Eva]

Indifference

We cross-posted, Spirit. I think you forget that there is no-one who has been bullied more, and more consistently, and by anonymous trolls as well as other members whose names I know and phone numbers are in my phone, than I have. So step off. I'm still here. Take the message, forget the rest, and move on.

THIS:

spiritwolf333;1683428 wrote: Repeatedly, I have suggested -as fact, that the only reason that majority of people who drink alcohol do so to change the way that they feel or think at any given moment -about anything.

IS NOT MY EXPERIENCE. Not only that, it's not what the entire medical definition of alcoholism/addiction is.

That FACT, more than anything else, is what is so incredibly maddening.

That is not what addiction is, Spirit. Not by any definition, anywhere. Please for the love of all good things, educate yourself.

[Xadrian]

Indifference

Ne/Neva Eva;1683430 wrote: Fred, I know Spirit. He's not trolling. He's trying to help. Who or what, and how, is what is so confusing.

As a matter of fact, he is trolling, because he is derailing the forum and common knowledge.
The only problem is that he seems to be the only one who doesn't see it.

From his point of view, he indeed tries to help and, like you, I'm still convinced he doesn't want to do harm deliberately. But obviously, unintentionally, he does not help at all and possibly does harm to especially newcomers with his thoughts and opinions, his screaming bold and CAPITAL titles, with asterisks ******, underscores, ___ etc., as well as his constant drawing of attention.

Because he posts so often about the same crap he believes to be the truth and his constant attempts to convince everybody of his personal truth, he always works himself to the top of the list, possibly scaring away newcomers that need help so badly and possibly deny themself from a cure to their disease.

He can't help himself, so it's not even fucking fair to get angry at him, but people could loose their lives when they are scared away from baclofen because of him publishing his non-typical thoughts and opinions.
It's so frustrating that he doesn't seem to give a damn, because he's so convinced he's doing the right thing that he doesn't see people could loose their lifes because of his preaching.
That makes him a very dangerous person, mentally ill or not.

"Just my thoughts and opinion and with all the respect to the one concerned". NOT!

[spiritwolf333]

Indifference

kronkcarr;1683417 wrote: I do agree with spirit on one thing. But I disagree that only alcoholics (true ones) "need to follow through with the necessary tools". Isn't the topic of how to live after crazy drinking on almost everyone's thread? Certainly we are more comfortable if we learn to live in the world. spirit, if this is what you've been saying all along perhaps we can drop it now.

Yes Kronk, you are spot on. All people -and not just abusers of alcohol, need to use these "tools" to move forward. I think one thing for alcoholics like me is that it took time and persistence to even learn how to live without alcohol and incorporate new healthy ways of living -exercise, nutrition, etc.

[spiritwolf333]

Indifference

Ne/Neva Eva;1683432 wrote: We cross-posted, Spirit. I think you forget that there is no-one who has been bullied more, and more consistently, and by anonymous trolls as well as other members whose names I know and phone numbers are in my phone, than I have. So step off. I'm still here. Take the message, forget the rest, and move on.

IS NOT MY EXPERIENCE. Not only that, it's not what the entire medical definition of alcoholism/addiction is.

That FACT, more than anything else, is what is so incredibly maddening.

That is not what addiction is, Spirit. Not by any definition, anywhere. Please for the love of all good things, educate yourself.

Ne -I have seen you shot at and missed and shart on and hit in some of your posts. I understand your point.

But NE, please help me understand your response to:

Almost all people drink alcohol to change the way they feel or think at any given moment.

In this statement, I am not trying define alcoholism -technically or otherwise. I am simply stating my experience and the experience of every other drinker of alcohol that I know (except for wine tasters -and I know none)

The point that I am trying to make with this statement is that many of us so called alcoholics get into trouble with alcohol because we really do like to change the way that we feel or think -and at a certain point in time, it truly does become problematic. Baclofen does help take away the physical craving and the obsessive mental craving for alcohol, but it does not take away the need to change the way we feel or think at certain times. Full of baclofen, and no real desire to consume alcohol, this issue has presented challenges to me -how to change my thinking without medications. How about you? How about others?

[Fred_The_Cat]

Indifference

TubeChop - GG Allin's Last Interview - June '93 (00:11)

[spiritwolf333]

Indifference

Fred_The_Cat;1683896 wrote: TubeChop - GG Allin's Last Interview - June '93 (00:11)

Hi Fred -17 of your last 18 most recent posts have been to defame me and my posts. Why am I so deserving of your attention? As I have suggested to Stuck, life really is awesome once you put the plug in the jug. Does it help you to belittle me? If so, please keep doing so.

[Fred_The_Cat]

Indifference

spiritwolf333;1683899 wrote: Hi Fred -17 of your last 18 most recent posts have been to defame me and my posts. Why am I so deserving of your attention? As I have suggested to Stuck, life really is awesome once you put the plug in the jug. Does it help you to belittle me? If so, please keep doing so.

The forum is dead, you think you lead it with delusions of grandeur, and it's gotten really REALLY funny. I can't resist it. You keep me coming back for more like Springer. Keep it up.

[spiritwolf333]

Indifference

Fred_The_Cat;1683902 wrote: The forum is dead, you think you lead it with delusions of grandeur, and it's gotten really REALLY funny. I can't resist it. You keep me coming back for more like Springer. Keep it up.

Fred -The Cat. Cat, sounds like we are both bored?

In my boredom, I had to read the following Cat quote:

"The Cat: Who, Me? Why I'm The Cat in the Hat, there's no doubt about that. I'm a super fundiferous feline, who's here to make sure that you're..."meline"..."key lime"..."turpentine". I got nothing! I'm not so good with the rhyming, not really, no. Look, I'm a cat that can talk that should be enough for you people!"

Dr. Seuss

[Cassander]

Indifference

If our experience on this board is any indication, surely it is true that 'familiarity breeds contempt'. There was a time, not so long ago, when we all got along, basking in the miracle of a treatment discovered by Dr Olivier Ameisen which results in indifference to alcohol.

Lets not forget that 'baclofen works' and, given the suffering of humankind at the hands of alcohol, this is...a miracle. In some ways, hardly anything else we say here matters.

Cass