Baclofen and Bipolar we are desperate for answers

[MusicCreationer]

My sister is struggling with addiction and bipolar. She is now 5 months sober through AA and is depressed and anxious in a hard way. I have been on Baclofen for 3 years now to great success.
We are both music industry professionals. She has had to completely leave the scene due to its natural environment of drinking and drugging. Even living in the City is too much for her "temptation" right now. Which I understand and respect.

She is so afraid of a mental relapse its keeping her locked away from a life she needs.

If she uses "pot, drugs or alcohol" she is at risk for becoming manic. She has fallen so hard and was Hypo Manic and Manic for almost 3 years until now when she sought rehab and now AA for sobriety. She is miserable and has to isolate from her career and friends.

I can be a strong hold for her and even give her a creative place to live but she feels she is still at risk for relapse just being in an around the city and others who might drink or use pot. Even if its not at our home. Which could mean her insanity would return.

AA doesn't give her any leeway. I am very familiar with the program. It will keep her sober for now but at the cost of her not having a life that is her true soul. I am trying to find a middle ground for her. If she doesn't use addictively should could potentially live a normal life.

If anyone has any insight that would be a great help. If anyone knows anyone on Baclofen that is Bipolar please reach out. I of course understand that she could not be on medications that would conflict with Bac. Also Baclofen does not help with all addictions. For me it did.

Any and all thoughts. Thank you so much!

[spiritwolf333]

Baclofen and Bipolar we are desperate for answers

Hi Music. Thanks for this post. Back in the day when I was doing the AA thing, I was simply afraid to to return to most of the things things that I was doing, and for the the most part, did not return to my activities except the daily grind. Hell, almost everything I did involved alcohol. I stopped playing golf, stopped writing software, and I stopped writing music lyrics -the three things I loved doing more than anything else in the world. -----but I related them too closely to alcohol.

Fast forward to several years later, I went to rehab, started taking baclofen, and have now realized a new life. I am now back writing lyrics, I have some singing artists singing my words, I am playing golf with my sons, and I feel more gratitude for life than ever before. And yes, I still have problems with occasional thoughts about using alcohol to cure some resentments and change some thoughts, but Baclofen/Gabapentin has helped me to give me time to find calmness to evaluate the outcomes.

Music, I somehow have to believe that one must be Bi-Polar to create music or to be an artist. I do not believe that one can create from a perspective that he or she has never experienced nor do I believe that new creative ideas can come from a place of doing the same ole same ole. Perhaps this might seem crazy as hell to many, but truly, the creative side of humans typically only come the highs or the lows, not the inbetweens. In my opinion, this is the huge challenge for artists, for creators.

You state that you have been on Baclofen for several years and yet your sister is not. I am not quite sure I understand why your Baclofen success would not be meaningful to her but perhaps that is not so important right now.

Initially, Baclofen allowed me to return quickly to the things that I loved doing before -I just did not have to Alcohol to do so.

I wish you and your sister the greatest outcome possible and thanks for the whiteboard space.

[MusicCreationer]

Baclofen and Bipolar we are desperate for answers

spiritwolf333;1694953 wrote: Hi Music. Thanks for this post. Back in the day when I was doing the AA thing, I was simply afraid to to return to most of the things things that I was doing, and for the the most part, did not return to my activities except the daily grind. Hell, almost everything I did involved alcohol. I stopped playing golf, stopped writing software, and I stopped writing music lyrics -the three things I loved doing more than anything else in the world. -----but I related them too closely to alcohol.

Fast forward to several years later, I went to rehab, started taking baclofen, and have now realized a new life. I am now back writing lyrics, I have some singing artists singing my words, I am playing golf with my sons, and I feel more gratitude for life than ever before. And yes, I still have problems with occasional thoughts about using alcohol to cure some resentments and change some thoughts, but Baclofen/Gabapentin has helped me to give me time to find calmness to evaluate the outcomes.

Music, I somehow have to believe that one must be Bi-Polar to create music or to be an artist. I do not believe that one can create from a perspective that he or she has never experienced nor do I believe that new creative ideas can come from a place of doing the same ole same ole. Perhaps this might seem crazy as hell to many, but truly, the creative side of humans typically only come the highs or the lows, not the inbetweens. In my opinion, this is the huge challenge for artists, for creators.

You state that you have been on Baclofen for several years and yet your sister is not. I am not quite sure I understand why your Baclofen success would not be meaningful to her but perhaps that is not so important right now.

Initially, Baclofen allowed me to return quickly to the things that I loved doing before -I just did not have to Alcohol to do so.

I wish you and your sister the greatest outcome possible and thanks for the whiteboard space.

She is Bipolar. I am very worried about her reaction to the baclofen.

I agree on all points. I have stopped dyeing from alcohol. I still drink, I still create for a living.

I am wondering if anyone knows anyone who is on baclofen and Bipolar?

[terryk]

Baclofen and Bipolar we are desperate for answers

MusicCreationer;1695023 wrote: She is Bipolar. I am very worried about her reaction to the baclofen.

I agree on all points. I have stopped dyeing from alcohol. I still drink, I still create for a living.

I am wondering if anyone knows anyone who is on baclofen and Bipolar?

Cut and pasted from a prior post:

Baclofen can provoke/exacerbate severe neuropsychiatric side-effects in patients with concomitant psychiatric conditions.

I have mentioned it before, from https://www.mywayout.org/community/f2...ml#post1223158:

Phenylethylamine-like properties of baclofen[Neuropsychobiology. 1983] - PubMed - NCBI

Neuropsychobiology. 1983;9(4):219-22.
Phenylethylamine-like properties of baclofen.
Wolf ME, Keener S, Mathis P, Mosnaim AD.
Abstract

Baclofen therapy resulted in improvement of dyskinesias only in patients with trunkal tardive dyskinesia. However, the appearance of undesirable side effects did not warrant continuation of treatment with this drug. Baclofen did not have any therapeutic effect in schizophrenia and moreover a trend towards a worsening of the psychiatric conditions with irritability, assaultiveness and prominent auditory hallucinations was observed. The effects of baclofen on tardive dyskinesia and schizophrenia can be explained in terms of its phenylethylamine-like properties.

PMID:
6646393
[PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]


From the full-text: Baclofen is postulated to inhibit dopamine transmission, be an antagonist of Substance P, and an agonist of PEA. Of 10 patients in the study 5 were schizophrenic, 4 were bipolar, 1 organic mental disorder. Baclofen caused mania and irritability in 2 of the bipolar patients (each respectively), and varied amounts of irritability, assaultiveness, and hallucinations in 4 of the schizophrenic patients.

-tk

Edit: there are several reports here (my own included) of hypomania/mania as a side-effect of high-dose baclofen in people with no history of either. I also spoke to an addiction specialist MD who had a bipolar patient who has also experienced this.

[Samandkatharine]

Baclofen and Bipolar we are desperate for answers

Hi Music,

I can relate to your predicament. Although my family history does not have a firm diagnosis of bipolar in writing, we do have mood disorder, suicide and and medications for BP in the notes. I have no issues with mania or BP in writing, but I have had horrible depression and post part em depression that has been severe enough to grant me a 2 day in hospital stay. Granted it was my choice but I know how it feels to be " loony".

I have been mostly on baclofen for a year with a 2 month off period I which I titrated down in order to wean an myself off of diazapam. I never experienced a bad period, which maybe means I'm not truly bipolar -ish. I have no mania or mood swings.

If your sister has a true diagnosis, I would only try baclofen with psychiatrists blessing. BP in it's true form is nothing to mess with.

Sam

[Ne/Neva Eva]

Baclofen and Bipolar we are desperate for answers

Hi, MC.

It's really great to hear that you are doing well. I'm sorry that your sister is not. I experienced hypomania and don't have bipolar disorder. Terryk's post is the only study I have read that is specifically related to bipolar, baclofen and addiction. I think it's enough to be very wary of self-prescribing baclofen. I know that there are doctors who prescribe HDB in northern California, surely it's spread to the southern part of the state?

[Lostinspace]

Baclofen and Bipolar we are desperate for answers

Hi Music. This may be a total shot in the dark and I apologize in advance if it's not helpful. I googled "baclofen and bipolar disorder" and came across an old MWO thread where a member here, Otter, described how his wife was diagnosed bipolar and is now doing much better on baclofen. Here's the thread:

https://www.mywayout.org/community/f2...ers-47835.html

You have to go down a bit to where Otter, and then seeking_serenity, talk about their experiences. I'm not sure how often Otter checks in here these days, but he does pop up every now and again, so you could try sending him a PM. I wish I had better answers for you. I'm sorry your sister is suffering so much. I hope that, one way or another, she can come to find the peace in life, and joy in pursuing her life's passion, that you have.

[spiritwolf333]

Baclofen and Bipolar we are desperate for answers

There is no reasonable circumstance that one would not seek the advice and direction from a medical doctor concerning the taking of these medications if deadly side effects may occur. I think that I have read opinions and articles from several professionals that clearly contradict each other. I truly wish that we all had more definitive answers to rely on.

Gabapentin Side Effects - The People's Pharmacy®

Gabapentin (Neurontin) was originally developed as an anti-seizure drug. It was approved by the FDA as an "add-on" treatment for patients with epilepsy in 1993. Although researchers do not completely understand how gabapentin works to control seizures, they think it affects production of a neurochemical in the brain called GABA (gamma-aminobutyric acid).

Pfizer, the manufacturer of the brand name Neurontin, got into major trouble when it marketed this drug for off-label uses. A company is not allowed to promote a medicine for things that the FDA has not approved. In Pfizer's case, these unofficial uses for Neurontin included bipolar disorder, alcohol withdrawal, migraines and pain. The company eventually paid $430 million in penalties and admitted to fraudulent promotion.
We mention this because Neurontin is currently available generically as gabapentin. In addition to treating epilepsy, the drug now has official FDA approval for alleviating nerve pain caused by shingles (postherpetic neuralgia).

[bleep]

Baclofen and Bipolar we are desperate for answers

I also experienced mania, and as far as I know am not bipolar. It seems that most of the symptoms that the non schizophrenics experienced are pretty standard SEs from baclofen.

You will be very unlikely to find a study that says it is a good idea. The choice is yours, or rather hers. Seems an obvious choice to me, given what you describe.