Tried everything but Balcofen - advice?

[MisterSaunders]

Hi all, I posted this elsewhere but got nothing...

22 years old now. Rewind 3-4 years and you'll find me in my first year of university. Already a heavy drinker at this stage but no more than my peers - still predominantly social and without problems.

Second year of university - different story. I experimented with a plethora of narcotics in addition to the copious amounts of booze, and towards the end of 2nd year, I came down with MAJOR OCD and anxiety/depression.

I get put on various AD's, which sort of help me through to graduation, but my alcohol use changes - demonstrating signs of abuse and dependence - convinced that SSRI may have had a hand in this.

Graduated and got a decent job. Started to take Naltrexone and follow TSM. I did this for 6 months, and I saw some improvements, but noticed that my hangovers were filled with anxiety and depression.

I decided to revamp my lifestyle, and 101 days ago, I gave up drinking, smoking, anti depressants and all things fun.

Yippee. Now here is the rub. This was never going to be a life long thing - I'm 22, and many people will say that it's a wonderful time to get sober; perhaps so, but I am struggling. Since quitting all of the above, I haven't really improved. I've started to eat compulsively at the weekend, and diet in the week to compensate. I gamble more than I should, and spend money that I don't have. I have begged for cognitive behavioural therapy, and I have been put on a 12 week waiting list. (Gotta love the NHS - have as many SSRIs as you like, but actual treatment?!)

I am really intrigued by balcofen. I originally set out to do 100 sober days, which I have accomplished, and I will continue this for a while until my naltrexone comes in a few weeks.

The main reason for my posting is that in my abstinence, I have changed nothing but the vice I use. My two year SSRI treatment has changed nothing, and the underlying anxiety that drives my compulsive behaviour is still there.

Can balcofen really address this? I've read that it can, and I am willing to try.

Questions - do you have to take it for the rest of your life?

Does it exacerbate depression?

Any input would be hugely appreciated as I am fresh out of ideas. I have tried everything, but now I am fed up of this self perpetuating inescapable anxiety-compulsion whirlpool.

[Lostinspace]

Tried everything but Balcofen - advice?

Hi MisterSaunders. First of all, congratulations on quitting both drinking and smoking for over 100 days! That's awesome. To answer your questions, yes, baclofen may help. It's been shown to help reduce some compulsive behaviors, such as compulsive eating. As to whether you have to take it for life - that's up for debate. It seems that most people who are using it to suppress alcohol cravings do need to keep taking it, or else their cravings return. A small number of people do manage to come off completely without a return of cravings. I don't have any answers about baclofen and depression, so hopefully someone more knowledgable will come along soon. Good luck to you.

[kronkcarr]

Tried everything but Balcofen - advice?

Hi,

Welcome. Congratulations on your 100 days! That's a feat. I second what LIS says: I understand that baclofen is used for treating compulsive behaviors. It's worth a try.

I started baclofen 12/12/12 and my goal was to quit getting drunk and to stop drinking at home alone. I've been successful.

I don't know about having to stay on baclofen for life. I started running a couple months ago and plan to build to long distances. The weather is horribly hot and, for me, heat and baclofen are a bad mix. So I'm titrating down to see if there's a difference. I'm at 20 mgs (my maintenance dose was 40-50 mgs) and will drop to 10 mgs tomorrow. So far no cravings.

I'm sorry that I don't have experience with baclofen and depression. I'm sure someone will answer that.

[lorchard]

Tried everything but Balcofen - advice?

See a doctor that specializes in addiction, I'm seeing a psychiatrist who deals with addiction and have been basically dealt with depression since college. On and off different antidepressants. Baclofen has increased my depression, but I've been drinking while on it. (Mainly it's my stubbornness and unemployed, so what's do to do on a day of emptiness?)
I'm up to 80mg but from what I've read, the initial side effects fade, even faster if you're alcohol free. I would give it a try. It's working better than the other alcohol meds I've tried. Best of luck.

[Cassander]

Tried everything but Balcofen - advice?

MisterSaunders;1700073 wrote:
The main reason for my posting is that in my abstinence, I have changed nothing but the vice I use. My two year SSRI treatment has changed nothing, and the underlying anxiety that drives my compulsive behaviour is still there.

Can balcofen really address this? I've read that it can, and I am willing to try.

... I have tried everything, but now I am fed up of this self perpetuating inescapable anxiety-compulsion whirlpool.

Hello MisterS

Your story is similar to my son's. You can read a big chunk of it on Post #19 on this thread: https://www.mywayout.org/community/f2...y-2-50827.html. Pls remember that we are none of us doctors here.

There is some controversy over the effectiveness of baclofen as an anxiolytic. Many, like my son, found it relieved their anxiety and their need to drink. Others find that the relief of anxiety can come and go at different titration levels. My personal belief is that the anxiolytic nature of baclofen is substantially affected by how much one continues to drink "on the way up". As you have already quit, this may not be an issue for you.

If you read around the site you'll discover that baclofen side effects can be disconcerting and in fact so disconcerting that many who try baclofen quit. Others make peace with the side effects and find success in eliminating craving for alcohol.

Welcome to mwo and good luck in your journey.

Cassander

[Cassander]

Tried everything but Balcofen - advice?

Here's another thread which addresses the topic.

https://www.mywayout.org/community/f2...ety-84767.html

[Ne/Neva Eva]

Tried everything but Balcofen - advice?

I really hope that you explore baclofen as a viable option. Would that I could have 20 years ago. But even without my regret and remorse about the fact that I was much older, I can relate to so much of what you posted about my early attempts at sobriety...(The first time was in my early 20s. I had much the same reaction as you shared here.)

Baclofen helped curb spending I didn't know I was doing. It alleviated other compulsive behaviors. In general I've felt more comfortable than I ever have in my life.

I can't speak to depression, because I'm back in that hole of a pit of doom at the moment. BUT I titrated down significantly, I'm still not drinking against my will, but I have a return to depression that may or may not be related to baclofen. For two years, though, I was depression free. (I've been contentedly sober for more than 3.)

As to "the rest of your life"...That's a mighty long time. I would suggest (without being at all pedantic, since we all struggle with this) that Now is what matters. You can make decisions about later, later.

Whatever you decide, don't stop actively looking for solutions. Twelve weeks is a ridiculous amount of time to wait, but it will eventually happen.

[MisterSaunders]

Tried everything but Balcofen - advice?

Thank you so much everyone!

I'm really frustrated at the minute - I'm filling the alcohol void with sugar and spending at the minute - nothing has changed.

My apprehension with balcofen comes from the worry that I am yet again replacing one crutch with another. I'm really down today, because I am realising that: a. I cannot enjoy anything that like in moderation without slipping into abuse and unhealthy habits. B. I cannot stand alone and be happy without external vices. Cue the onset of anxiety and low self esteem!

I'll do some more reading, and place an order.

[Lostinspace]

Tried everything but Balcofen - advice?

Using baclofen is not a crutch at all. As you'll discover, it doesn't get you high, it doesn't function as something that will help you escape your problems, it just kills cravings and compulsive drives. You'll probably find that you are capable of moderation in many things once you get a handle on the underlying anxiety that drives you to do things to excess. Don't expect huge changes overnight; it does take time to find the right dose. But it can be enormously helpful and is worth the wait. Let us know how it goes for you.

[MisterSaunders]

Tried everything but Balcofen - advice?

Lostinspace that's the validation I needed. Thank you. I will definitely look in to this further. I want to be crutch free in the future, and not so on edge with everything I touch... Alcohol, sugar, a bet on the football, buying a new shirt!

The human brain is such a strange thing!

[MisterSaunders]

Tried everything but Balcofen - advice?

Is moderate drinking a possibility with balcofen? As I said in my original post, I am going to try drinking again anyway - I have some naltrexone from my previous drinking that I would use as a preventative measure. I have read mixed reviews on this matter - I want to go for a pint after football with my friends. I want I have a glass of wine with my family on Fridays.

[YouKayBee]

Tried everything but Balcofen - advice?

I'd like to add here that you can obtain counselling/CBT via other routes. I'll send you a pm if that's ok.

[MisterSaunders]

Tried everything but Balcofen - advice?

I suppose it's the same with achieving sobriety through other methods - a few can, most can't.

As for that being something I don't want to hear in my twenties, I am coming to terms with it, but it's also causing me massive depression and anxiety - after football at the weekend a close friend remarked that I'd lost my character. Not great from a friend point of view, but indicative of how I feel and how I am perceived - I have lost my entire social life.

Ever onwards I guess. 102 days AF now, I just thought I'd feel better at this stage, but I feel worse than when I was drinking.

[spiritwolf333]

Tried everything but Balcofen - advice?

Palladium;1700369 wrote: Hi, MisterSaunders.

It?s good to have another Brit on the forum.

Yes, eventually, some people can drink in moderation?but only very occasionally, and only after you have had some time alcohol free, and you have learned that there is more to addiction than just craving and anxiety. Baclofen will deal with those two latter symptoms by normalising the neurotransmitters in the brain that have been corrupted by long-term heavy exposure to ethanol.

Once that has happened, you have to get out of the habit of drinking, which can be even harder than overcoming your chemical addiction to alcohol. The occasional glass of wine with a meal, maybe. But joining your mates for the post-match piss-up??probably not a good idea. Neither baclofen nor naltrexone will protect you from a regular full-on assault on your sobriety. Sometimes, you just have to accept that you have to avoid situations like these. You?re in your early twenties and you probably don?t want to be hearing that kind of advice. Baclofen, if taken correctly and for long enough will give you the freedom to make a choice?it won?t help you make the right one.

This brings me on to your other questions about compulsions and depression.

I have had several episodes of severe clinical depression throughout my entire adult life. On one occasion it was so severe that I was detained under the Mental Health Act (s2). I have been prescribed quite a few antidepressants and antipsychotics and mood-stabilisers over the years. None of them helped, and many of them made me feel worse and caused terrible side-effects.

As I increased my baclofen dosage I found that ~200mg/day I started to feel an antidepressant and mood-stabilising effect from the drug, which included the remission of those intrusive thoughts, which for some people can lead to obsessive and compulsive behaviour. Baclofen has been proven to have monoaminergic properties, and could serve as a monotherapy for a wide spectrum of substance-misuse-related disorders: GAD; depression; OCD; Social Anxiety Disorder, et al. These are all conditions that people have attempted to self-medicate with alcohol and other drugs, and subsequently developed an addiction, which has protracted and compounded their suffering.

I don?t see baclofen as a crutch. We are using a medication to control the symptoms of a disease; in the same way that a psychiatrist would prescribe antipsychotics to treat the harmful symptoms of schizophrenia, or use lithium to moderate the dramatic mood vacillations of a manic depressive. Alcoholism is psychiatric illness?ICD-10 (F10). Generalized Anxiety Disorder is another?ICD-10 (F41). Baclofen treats the symptoms of both of these illnesses very successfully.

But it is not a cure. It is no more a cure for alcoholism than prescribing insulin is a cure for diabetes.

And it?s not a miracle?it?s science. Although it is still wondrous to behold!

This is a very important and informative post for anyone considering baclofen as a medication for alcoholism. In my opinion, you have very successfully shed light on the entire issue of alcoholism, co-existing problems, and medications for alcoholism. Thank you.

[Alky]

Tried everything but Balcofen - advice?

I'm glad to see some responsible advice is finally being dispensed on what baclofen is and isn't and what it does and what it doesn't.

I came here expecting to see, "YEAHHHH!!! DRINK AS MUCH AS YOU WANT AND WHEN YOU HIT THE SWITCH, YOU'LL BE A MODERATE DRINKER!!!" horseshit.

Has common sense finally come to the meds forum?