When will naltrexone start working

[Rusty]

Re: When will naltrexone start working

doodle-I was on Naltrexone and 90 msg. Of Backofen at the same time.. and they helped immensely, but, you have to really want the drugs to work, and it is not gonna be a matter of two or five or six pills a day that will make that desire to drink go away on its own. You have to change your people, places, and things. For me, it was doing my hard workouts after work, when the witching hour was the strongest at threatening my quit. Previously, I had always worked out before work, but I never drink before work so it wasn't an issue for me. My my vulnerability was two or three nights a week, and then on the weekends, when I was home alone. By the time I got done working out after work, the only thing I felt like doing was eating… I didn't think about drinking at all. Why don't you try changing your routine… You might find this to be helpful. Let us know how you're doing.

[YouKayBee]

Re: When will naltrexone start working

I have now been on Naltrexone for one month and saw very little difference in my consumption. I saw my doctor yesterday and it is his belief that the Naltrexone should have started working right away. He has double the dose to 100 mg. He wants me to try that for 2 weeks and has also perscribed baclofen 5mg 3 times a day which I am suppose to start in two weeks with the Naltrexone. I guess I shouldd be glad that I have found a doctor who is not afraid to perscribe this for me but I can't find anywhere in any posts where people have been on both drugs at the same time Any thoughts?

Doodle

How are you taking your dose, when?

Your Dr is not right, yes many do respond immediately which is a sign of long term success however some don't and find success with time. Are you tracking drinks? This can be important, many people think there's no change then look at their record and realise there has been a significant reduction in intake.

I know of at least one person who used both Naltrexone and Baclofen together, and yes it worked.

[Otter]

Re: When will naltrexone start working

I just want to make it clear that I support any approach to fighting alcoholism.

My object is to try to get people the help they need, and this requires a proper diagnosis. I posted an article about how the courts in the US look at alcohol consumption v. alcoholism in criminal cases on my Baclofenista site in my signature. United States law: Alcoholism as a defence in criminal cases – BACLOFENISTA: fighting alcoholism and addiction
The point made in a paper I refer to there is that the "diagnosis" of "alcoholism" doesn't indicate the cause of the problem and it's not universally accepted that alcoholism is a disease or illness at all.

By looking at a neurological anxiety problem, one can look at this as an illness, and then get the right treatment. Some medications don't work on this anxiety so won't help someone with an alcohol related illness which has anxiety as it's cause.

That is not to say that there are not other causes of alcoholism. It may be that someone has an alcohol problem but does not have an anxiety problem and this may be a result of some other underlying problem, such as serotonin issues, or a problem with different receptors.

Since I have come here, I have read many posts of people who say they did not start drinking because of anxiety. I'm not a neurologist and my focus has been on the anxiety illness which Ameisen isolates in his book. I can't talk about the experiences of others who don't respond to baclofen or who do respond to social counselling or other drugs, such as Naltrexone. I have no great experience of it, nor have I studied it to any extent.

It's important, in my view, to get the diagnosis of any illness right, and this starts with talking about symptoms which underlie the compulsion to drink. I used DSM 5 as a rough guide as to the seriousness of a drink problem and when to say someone may have an "illness". DSM 5 does not provide any guidance as to what the cause, or causes, of the illness, or "illnesses" is/are. It lists the consequences to people who have this problem.

I went down this road of looking at the legal aspects of this illness because the lack of proper diagnostic tools and the lack of understanding of the underlying illness has led to massive problems in dealing with alcohol related crime and the family law problems which have been associated with excessive alcohol consumption.

[YouKayBee]

Re: When will naltrexone start working

I just want to make it clear that I support any approach to fighting alcoholism.

My object is to try to get people the help they need, and this requires a proper diagnosis. I posted an article about how the courts in the US look at alcohol consumption v. alcoholism in criminal cases on my Baclofenista site in my signature. United States law: Alcoholism as a defence in criminal cases – BACLOFENISTA: fighting alcoholism and addiction
The point made in a paper I refer to there is that the "diagnosis" of "alcoholism" doesn't indicate the cause of the problem and it's not universally accepted that alcoholism is a disease or illness at all.

By looking at a neurological anxiety problem, one can look at this as an illness, and then get the right treatment. Some medications don't work on this anxiety so won't help someone with an alcohol related illness which has anxiety as it's cause.

That is not to say that there are not other causes of alcoholism. It may be that someone has an alcohol problem but does not have an anxiety problem and this may be a result of some other underlying problem, such as serotonin issues, or a problem with different receptors.

Since I have come here, I have read many posts of people who say they did not start drinking because of anxiety. I'm not a neurologist and my focus has been on the anxiety illness which Ameisen isolates in his book. I can't talk about the experiences of others who don't respond to baclofen or who do respond to social counselling or other drugs, such as Naltrexone. I have no great experience of it, nor have I studied it to any extent.

It's important, in my view, to get the diagnosis of any illness right, and this starts with talking about symptoms which underlie the compulsion to drink. I used DSM 5 as a rough guide as to the seriousness of a drink problem and when to say someone may have an "illness". DSM 5 does not provide any guidance as to what the cause, or causes, of the illness, or "illnesses" is/are. It lists the consequences to people who have this problem.

I went down this road of looking at the legal aspects of this illness because the lack of proper diagnostic tools and the lack of understanding of the underlying illness has led to massive problems in dealing with alcohol related crime and the family law problems which have been associated with excessive alcohol consumption.

Otter

I started drinking because it was seen as normal thing to do socially, I was offered it, and tried it. Having explored my own personal background in my psychotherapist training (something central to the training process), I know I have attachment injuries and issues which drive my EDs and alcoholism as was, so I could blame that (and I'm a good blame).

What I object to is being 'told' that I'm not a proper alcoholic, which has happened here and is totally bonkers - I was completely out of control and couldn't stop despite the harm it was causing.

I was shoe horned into Baclofen by forum members here, who have banged on about it ever since. When I tried to move onto TSM there was zero support, in fact I was told here to take more Baclofen. It was horrible to be bullied, a replay of much of my life. I'm glad I was strong enough to break through.

This site should be about support, one reason I find it difficult to post or even visit bar the Sunday Shout out thread in General Discussion, is that the same arguments and denigration still goes on.

I don't give a stuff about evidence - my evidence is seeing Baclofen users not particularly getting far, and TSM users doing very well. I don't slate it, if it works great.

I believe there should be a choice, lay the options out. TSM is as overlooked as Baclofen, and some believe they can work together. If there's a chance try it. If it doesn't suit or doesn't work try something different.

People in the medical system often just take what is offered, here we have a choice.

[doodle]

Re: When will naltrexone start working

Hi Rusty Thanks for the info. I have realized that I need to switch up my life! it's very hard when my way of life for 40nyears has been drinking which means my entire social life circles around that. Since I have starting to cut down intrestingly enough alot of my friends (drinkers too!) have been supportive! and when I am in a social situation they don't push me to have another!. just like you I have realized if I am doing something else at 5pm I at least cut down on my drinking!

Onwards and upwards!

Doodle!!

[doodle]

Re: When will naltrexone start working

Thank you Otter

I am just so happy I found a doctor who is willing for me to try ANYTHING to get on the right path. I don't believe i have any anxiety disorders I just like to drink! I am going to start the Baclofen tomorrow with the NAL and see how it goes. My doctor did warn me not to dry Baclofen on a normal workday as it might make me drowsy so Sunday it is!!

[Otter]

Re: When will naltrexone start working

Otter

I started drinking because it was seen as normal thing to do socially, I was offered it, and tried it. Having explored my own personal background in my psychotherapist training (something central to the training process), I know I have attachment injuries and issues which drive my EDs and alcoholism as was, so I could blame that (and I'm a good blame).

What I object to is being 'told' that I'm not a proper alcoholic, which has happened here and is totally bonkers - I was completely out of control and couldn't stop despite the harm it was causing.

I was shoe horned into Baclofen by forum members here, who have banged on about it ever since. When I tried to move onto TSM there was zero support, in fact I was told here to take more Baclofen. It was horrible to be bullied, a replay of much of my life. I'm glad I was strong enough to break through.

This site should be about support, one reason I find it difficult to post or even visit bar the Sunday Shout out thread in General Discussion, is that the same arguments and denigration still goes on.

I don't give a stuff about evidence - my evidence is seeing Baclofen users not particularly getting far, and TSM users doing very well. I don't slate it, if it works great.

I believe there should be a choice, lay the options out. TSM is as overlooked as Baclofen, and some believe they can work together. If there's a chance try it. If it doesn't suit or doesn't work try something different.

People in the medical system often just take what is offered, here we have a choice.

I agree that people should do what they want. I think you are one of many people who don't suffer from the kind of anxiety that baclofen treats, so it doesn't work for you. That doesn't mean you are not an alcoholic. What I am trying to figure out is how one would go about deciding which medicine is best. I don't think calling someone an alcoholic helps or doesn't help. It's not a medical diagnosis and what we need is more understanding of what causes this illness or whether it is actually more than one illness.

I don't think anyone would ever suggest that you are not an alcoholic in the sense that you are making up your illness. That never happened here and I am sorry that you ever got the impression that you weren't suffering the same as other people here.

I am also very aware that baclofen hasn't worked the way people thought it would, or at all. It's difficult to take a generic drug designed for some other purpose, many years ago and get it to work for an incredibly serious and complex illness. We all know the problems, they've been thrashed out here over and over. I also don't think that everyone who has an "alcoholic" illness suffered from anxiety and I certainly don't know what the effects of alcohol are on the brain and body over time.

What I would also say is that each of us has our own experience of drinking and we can't assume that everyone else is the same, so it cuts both ways, that if baclofen doesn't work for someone, then it doesn't work for other people, or that it is "hyped" to be something it isn't. None of us, at the beginning of this discovery had any idea of how or why baclofen worked or whether it works for everyone or just some people. Probably, some of us figured that this was "the answer" and maybe it isn't, at least for anyone. But, for those for whom it does work, to the extent it works, it is still a miracle.

We've always had this problem here and I just want to make the point that it is important that we figure out what drug or treatment is best for each person, and not get hung up on the term "alcoholic" because it masks, I think, the real physical problems which need to be treated, which are probably different from person to person.