Newbie and not finding TSM success. :(

[Bodhi]

Hello, I'm Heather. I am new & feeling desperate.

I have been using TSM for a week now. I take 50mg 1 hr before drinking. Pour a glass of wine and immediately feel the same warmth and feel goods that make me want to pour another... and another... and by the end of the evening the bottle of wine is gone and I'm debating opening another. This has happened to me every time I take Naltrexone (and obviously when I don't). The medicine has had zero effect on the endorphines I receive from drinking. Has anyone else experienced this? By all accounts people say it curbs their drinking, but I honestly feel no difference. Except for maybe a little nausea. Today I'm suffering a bad hangover today after taking Naltrexone (waiting 1 hr) and drinking too much last night. Again. Any suggestions? I was really hoping that this would help me. Other attemps to stop or curb drinking have failed. Also, could it have something to do w/the fact that I take Zoloft (SSRI)? It's the only thing I can think of that might be blocking the Naltrexone from working properly. Anyhow, thank you for your forum and for listening and hopefully responding.

[empyr3al]

Re: Newbie and not finding TSM success.

Well. Thats a hard question. Apparently some types of Naltrexone you need more than an hour before based on additives and manufacturer and there is debate as to its half life. It does work on the GABA A receptors. 1 week is high expectations but you are correct for some it does not work as advertised. Naltrexone did little for me and relapsed after 6 months mind you I still take it. Regarding the hangover, there is no evidence of naltrexone causing that, but if you over drink it you definitely get a hangover. Are you eating the same amount because you may have the endorphines of pleasure of eating being blocked and that could increase you hangover (speculative). I've never used Zoloft and every persons brain chemistry is somewhat different. I use Mirtazapine (antidepressant off label studies for alcohol), Naltrexone (non TSM method), Campral (calcium ion synapse repair tool) and Gabapentin (anxiolytic, Gaba B). If you want some more direct conversation about brain chemistry there is also The End Of My Addiction | Forum Discussing Alcohol Medication which is more focused towards medications. Baclofen is another option, but I couldn't get enough to push my "switch".

[empyr3al]

Re: Newbie and not finding TSM success.

I'll expand on SSRI's, SNRI's, Tricyclics and Tetracyclics.

Zoloft shows no known interactions in drugs.com and only a few in FDA reports taking with Naltrexone

Pristiq (desvenlafaxine), a SNRI is known to increase drinking and generally not prescribed anymore in the UK. I used it and I drank like a fish
Trintellix/Brintellix, (SNRI hybrid) made me go emotionally bonkers but my addictions specialist said it works well with Mirtazapine
Cipralex (escilatopram), made me see visions during withdrawal; but I do have a prescription for it if I find myself coming to a depressed state while in sobriety
Mirtazapine (tetracyclic), this gave me dramatic relief for a very long time and I continue to use it. Many studies of efficacy on AL have been done with promise

Now my addiction specialist said Trintellix and Mirtazapine work well in concert but I didn't give it a shot as Trintellix was difficult enough to come off of.

In sobriety I had a ton of anxiety, so instead of looking simply at Naltrexone and Campral which don't directly affect that I researched Gabapentin and it took the edge off.

Do understand I did not use TSM so I cannot tell you if I noticed a change. When I decided to destroy my life I stopped Naltrexone and for the first 2 days I didn't get the endorphines while drink from using NAL daily and then was full on AL again.

[Bodhi]

Re: Newbie and not finding TSM success.

Thank you so much for your replies. Very helpful. I have much to learn from all of you. ❤️

[Mom21961]

Re: Newbie and not finding TSM success.

[MENTION=20332]Bohdi[/MENTION]. Welcome! Don't get discouraged. Extinction takes months, not weeks. Sometimes many, many months. Some people are initially strong responders, but it doesn't mean it won't work for you. I would use the search function on this forum to see if you can find more information. I know @pheonix and @ykb had success with Nal, and I'm sure others, I just know more about Baclofen.

You're probably aware of this website:About The Sinclair Method (TSM) - C Three Foundation. They are dedicated to TSM.

Good luck!

[Mom21961]

Re: Newbie and not finding TSM success.

[MENTION=20332]Bohdi[/MENTION], I was searching around for more Nal forums and I see you found thesinclairmethod. Did you also see Home | Options Save Lives? I saw a comment that this one may have more traffic. FYI... .

[Bodhi]

Re: Newbie and not finding TSM success.

[MENTION=20332]Bohdi[/MENTION], I was searching around for more Nal forums and I see you found thesinclairmethod. Did you also see Home | Options Save Lives? I saw a comment that this one may have more traffic. FYI... .

Thank you, Mom2jx3! I appreciate your input and feedback. I'm reading and following a lot. So much to learn.

[empyr3al]

Re: Newbie and not finding TSM success.

I was looking for this site for you [MENTION=20332]Bohdi[/MENTION]. Remember its all antecdotal and may not reflex everyone's experiences with SSRi's and SNRI's. It was an influence for me to look at Mirtazapine instead of Trintellix/Brintellix and Pristiq that I had used. So its in regards to your question about people's experiences on SSRI's like Zoloft. Read the comments and you'll see what I mean. Antidepressants and alcohol cravings | RxISK

[Bodhi]

Re: Newbie and not finding TSM success.

I was looking for this site for you [MENTION=20332]Bohdi[/MENTION]. Remember its all antecdotal and may not reflex everyone's experiences with SSRi's and SNRI's. It was an influence for me to look at Mirtazapine instead of Trintellix/Brintellix and Pristiq that I had used. So its in regards to your question about people's experiences on SSRI's like Zoloft. Read the comments and you'll see what I mean. Antidepressants and alcohol cravings | RxISK

Interesting read. There may be something there. 🤔

[Otter]

Re: Newbie and not finding TSM success.

What are your reasons for drinking? Different meds work in different ways. Most of the posting on this forum at one point was by baclofen users but most have now gone to a new forum, The End of my Addiction. Baclofen is good for treating alcoholics who suffer from overwhelming anxiety. Some say they don't actually enjoy alcohol at all and only drink to self medicate. Others find it doesn't work and have tried Naltrexone and TSM. There's success and failure on both drugs but there are a lot of people here and on The End of My Addiction who can talk to you about your motivation for drinking and their experiences with both of these drugs. You are in the right place.

[Bodhi]

Re: Newbie and not finding TSM success.

What are your reasons for drinking? Different meds work in different ways. Most of the posting on this forum at one point was by baclofen users but most have now gone to a new forum, The End of my Addiction. Baclofen is good for treating alcoholics who suffer from overwhelming anxiety. Some say they don't actually enjoy alcohol at all and only drink to self medicate. Others find it doesn't work and have tried Naltrexone and TSM. There's success and failure on both drugs but there are a lot of people here and on The End of My Addiction who can talk to you about your motivation for drinking and their experiences with both of these drugs. You are in the right place.

My motivation for drinking is that I absolutely love alcohol. I love the taste, I love the way it makes me feel. I love everything about it. Perhaps one would say it's self medicating. Perhaps, but I want to drink everyday and I drink too much. So I take Nal in hopes of not loving it and craving it all the time.

[empyr3al]

Re: Newbie and not finding TSM success.

Nal seems to be what would work if its love of drink and not anxiety from not drinking. The arguments can get heated over NAL vs BAC, and I see no reason why they cannot be used concurrently. I think what [MENTION=12219]Otter[/MENTION] is asking in regards to motivation (I might be wrong) is to figure out which suits you best. NAL is for what you describe as a high where as BAC is to calm anxiety if you are self medicating with AL. As I understand BAC works as a sort of relief towards the need for AL, where as NAL mutes the glorified high of AL. Looking at the fact you don't like social circles and that might mean you have some social anxiety as you indicated in your first post. Baclofen might actually assist you in that regard if you want to steer clear of the GP's traditional "Benzo if you are stressed, SSRI/SNRI if you are down, Opiate if you are in Pain" kind of methodology often plainly stated and outspoken by GP's. Mind you that tradition is changing slowly as GP's are wising up to addictions.

I chose Gabapentin as my relief towards the need for AL because I could not get Bac in quantity. So the question simply is do you feel you NEED AL for survival or are you just wanting the high. Can be a combo of the two and why I say there is no harm in combining medical therapeutic drugs unless there are health issues.

[Bodhi]

Re: Newbie and not finding TSM success.

Nal seems to be what would work if its love of drink and not anxiety from not drinking. The arguments can get heated over NAL vs BAC, and I see no reason why they cannot be used concurrently. I think what [MENTION=12219]Otter[/MENTION] is asking in regards to motivation (I might be wrong) is to figure out which suits you best. NAL is for what you describe as a high where as BAC is to calm anxiety if you are self medicating with AL. As I understand BAC works as a sort of relief towards the need for AL, where as NAL mutes the glorified high of AL. Looking at the fact you don't like social circles and that might mean you have some social anxiety as you indicated in your first post. Baclofen might actually assist you in that regard if you want to steer clear of the GP's traditional "Benzo if you are stressed, SSRI/SNRI if you are down, Opiate if you are in Pain" kind of methodology often plainly stated and outspoken by GP's. Mind you that tradition is changing slowly as GP's are wising up to addictions.

I chose Gabapentin as my relief towards the need for AL because I could not get Bac in quantity. So the question simply is do you feel you NEED AL for survival or are you just wanting the high. Can be a combo of the two and why I say there is no harm in combining medical therapeutic drugs unless there are health issues.

I actually do well in social circles. In fact, I may have to pull back from them while I get my drinking under control or comfortable w/my own amounts. I mainly just want get high, I guess. I like the good feelings from it. Just not the blackouts, hangovers and other shit.

[empyr3al]

Re: Newbie and not finding TSM success.

Okay so you do well in socializing. My ex divorced me because I can talk to anyone and she suspected I cheated. I am honorable in every sense of the word and thats why people trust me. I am convincing. Meet me outside of my den of destruction and I am perfectly fine. The question more specifically is without AL can you maintain that? So you don't want AA or CBT circles and I understand that. So Nal is your hope. Its a progressive problem that can become a monster. I do not know anything about you other than what you say, so it seems NAL is best for you in this situation. Best intentions!

[Bodhi]

Re: Newbie and not finding TSM success.

Meet me outside of my den of destruction and I am perfectly fine. The question more specifically is without AL can you maintain that? So you don't want AA or CBT circles and I understand that. So Nal is your hope. Its a progressive problem that can become a monster. I do not know anything about you other than what you say, so it seems NAL is best for you in this situation. Best intentions!

Thanks, for sharing and your input. The first line you wrote here "den of destruction" is a great sentence. In all honesty, I think I'd be ok socially being alcohol free, but I'd be even better moderating. If I could just drink socially and keep it to a couple, like the gal in "one little pill" does. Who knows if I'll some day be capable of that. I hope. If not I may need to take another route. Time will tell, I guess.