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    My baclofen journey

    Hello all. I learned a lot about baclofen from forums like this, and baclofenman in particular. I also learned a lot from baclofene.com - a French site. France is a place where baclofen for alcoholism is widely used.

    I thought I'd make this thread even if I'm the only person posting on it, just as a record for others looking to explore this option. I was a long-term lurker on forums before I took the plunge.

    I started taking baclofen about 6 weeks ago. You can find a good summary of almost everything you need to know here Baclofen Treatment for Alcoholism.

    Over 6 weeks, I've titrated up to 100mg a day, in the following doses: 8am - 30mg. 12.00 - 30mg. 4pm - 40mg.

    While titrating up, I got hit by waves - crashing, overwhelming - waves of tiredness. I still get these in the evening - I fell asleep mid-sentence while reading to my little girl at bedtime.

    I also had bouts of diarrhoea when I went up a dose - short, sharp bouts of diarrhoea. That caused some hairy situations - but now I know, and I prep for it. It actually only really happened going from 60->70->80mg a day.

    I found two reliable places to buy it online - for about 16p a pill (10mg) (That's about 22 US cents, 18 euro cents). That's a lot - BUT, it's cheaper than booze. Baclofenman got his doctor to prescribe it - but that's rare in the UK - rare anywhere outside France. From what I see, that's quite cheap. I can post where I got it if the forum is cool with that.

    I feel 100mg is too low a dose to reach indifference BUT the all-consuming thirst come 5pm has ebbed. So - something is happening. It remains to be seen what.

    Also, the waves of tiredness have ebbed - except in the evening. I think that's because I'm still drinking, and apparently that can lead to shocking tiredness. I mean by this: can't keep your head upright, slouching mid sentence tired. Like a sort of 'comedy' narcolepsy - except I know that disease is no laughing matter.

    I kept drinking out of habit - and out of a sort of panic, that it was 5pm, and I could, so I should, cos I always do, and it made me a nicer, better person. (I'm not an angry drunk. I'm actually much more relaxed and agreeable when drunk.)

    This evening, I had 2 drinks around 530pm - I'm on my own, looking after my girl. I could hardly hold my head up for tiredness (not drunkenness - apparently drinking while on bac can lead to shocking tiredness). So... I stopped refilling at 6.30pm. I've been in a sort of panic since - I mean, what on earth is sober me supposed to do with himself? I'm so damn thirsty - not booze thirsty, proper old-fashioned dry mouth thirsty. It's 9pm, and I haven't drunk since 630pm - except tea.

    This is remarkable - but I don't think I could face the tiredness. But I'm sober at 9pm on a Saturday (well - two drinks three hours ago. Sober for me!).

    I'll keep the universe posted on how it goes. Early days, but this is interesting.
    Last edited by georgesmiley; October 23, 2020, 03:27 PM.

    #2
    Re: My baclofen journey

    Just FYI I'm an after-work drinker. Not off the scale, not fall down drunk - but staggering around the house at 11pm. Never needed to go up from about a bottle of wine or five large gin'n'tonics/rum'n'cokes a night. Sometimes a bottle of wine AND a couple of spirits. Sometimes 6 large measures of spirit.

    So - I know I'm a lightweight compared to some. But I'm getting fat, and I've been drinking that much for years, and I get drunk when I'm looking after my kid, and ricochet of the walls in the hallway when I go to tuck her in at my bedtime. This is bad. And I can't stop. I've been to moderation management meetings, I've tried 'pulling myself together.' So - I'm a drunk.

    We'll see where this goes.

    My biggest fear is ... well, that I love, love, love drinking - the flavour, the feeling, the sense of calm. What can I do in its place? Drinking is what I do, it's who I am. I love what it does to me and for me.

    One of the things baclofen has done for me is extinguish, or at least dampen, that panic or anxiety or questing, searching, yearning feeling that has plagued me all my life. I've had a few moments where I've thought, 'Well... I wonder if this is what normal people feel like?"

    It's not like taking a clonazepam calm - that's lovely (and never been addicted to benzos - just had them odd times). It's not that 'swimming', warm feeling. It's something else - it's like the burning inside me has quietened down.
    Last edited by georgesmiley; October 23, 2020, 03:35 PM.

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      #3
      Re: My baclofen journey

      For those curious about the science behind baclofen, albeit from a French doctor who is committed to using it (which is controversial), then:

      Here is a discussion of the clinical experience/evidence: Frontiers | The Use of Baclofen as a Treatment for Alcohol Use Disorder: A Clinical Practice Perspective | Psychiatry

      Here he analyses how it might work: Frontiers | A Review of the Potential Mechanisms of Action of Baclofen in Alcohol Use Disorder | Psychiatry

      Both of these are substantial reads, and quite geeky - but some people like that level of depth (I'm one such). Many people don't, so if you aren't into reading science, then just stick to Baclofen Treatment for Alcoholism

      Comment


        #4
        Re: My baclofen journey

        Oh - and baclofen makes me snore. This is a common side effect. I've never really been a snorer before. It does this for two reasons, according to a bit of googling (again, France leads the way in research on this):

        1. It's a muscle relaxant, so the 'tone' in your neck muscles when you're sleeping can make tissues in your neck and jaw softer.

        2. It's also capable of provoking sleep apnoea of cerebral (ie, your brain) origin. I don't think I have this, but it can be a consequence of taking the drug.
        Last edited by georgesmiley; October 23, 2020, 04:23 PM.

        Comment


          #5
          Re: My baclofen journey

          Hi [MENTION=24582]georgesmiley[/MENTION]! Thank you so much for sharing your experience. It sounds like you are heading towards "the switch" - a major tipping point! I found it utterly miraculous. And you're experiencing the wondrous anxiety relief as well.

          I know what you mean about loving the drinking, but it's good that you recognize how problematic it can be. My experience with baclofen (10 years) and with watching others on this board has been that the people who are the most successful are those who really work to distance themselves from the drink, and who build up a good amount of sober time. I've seen a lot of people on here and other forums who took bac, kept drinking and ended up right back where they started.

          I have really missed seeing people sharing their bac journies on here!
          Last edited by _serenity_; October 23, 2020, 07:33 PM.

          Comment


            #6
            Re: My baclofen journey

            Hey, [MENTION=24582]georgesmiley[/MENTION]

            Thanks for sharing your story to date, as [MENTION=14524]_serenity_[/MENTION] says, it is nice to read new users stories. It, sort of, reminds us all of our own journeys, none of which are the same. There is no story the same, some make it some don't. This precious site is littered with stories and anecdotal writings, some of which are most inspirational.

            Originally posted by georgesmiley View Post
            Hello all. I learned a lot about baclofen from forums like this, and baclofenman in particular. I also learned a lot from baclofene.com - a French site. France is a place where baclofen for alcoholism is widely used.

            I thought I'd make this thread even if I'm the only person posting on it, just as a record for others looking to explore this option. I was a long-term lurker on forums before I took the plunge.

            I started taking baclofen about 6 weeks ago. You can find a good summary of almost everything you need to know here Baclofen Treatment for Alcoholism.
            The French site is a great site, I am a member and although I don't post a lot (my French is "Merde") but google translate is helpful. Incidentally a member of this forum is credited with translating the Prescribing Guide from French into an English version.

            Amanda's site is also a very hands on. She is committed to voicing Baclofen throughout Western Australia and beyond. I know she gained a lot of inspiration from this site and eoma.

            Originally posted by georgesmiley View Post

            Over 6 weeks, I've titrated up to 100mg a day, in the following doses: 8am - 30mg. 12.00 - 30mg. 4pm - 40mg.

            While titrating up, I got hit by waves - crashing, overwhelming - waves of tiredness. I still get these in the evening - I fell asleep mid-sentence while reading to my little girl at bedtime.

            I also had bouts of diarrhoea when I went up a dose - short, sharp bouts of diarrhoea. That caused some hairy situations - but now I know, and I prep for it. It actually only really happened going from 60->70->80mg a day.
            I think that seems a good titration regime. You are pretty full up when the cravings start around the 3pm to 5pm mark. Personally, I would keep the 8am and noon as they are and increase as needed the 4pm intake up to maybe 60mg and then add another slightly later, maybe 6pm or 7pm.

            I never had diarrhoea, I had awful constipation. Without being too graphic, I thought I was shitting a melon but the resultant product was nothing larger than usual. I guess Baclofen had in fact worked as a relaxant and I was unable to muscle out a small shit.

            Originally posted by georgesmiley View Post

            I fell asleep mid-sentence while reading to my little girl at bedtime.
            I assume you would have done that while drinking, pre Baclofen. That's fucking sad buddie but trust me, we have all been there. Watching my kids grow up with a fuckwit of a father, on reflection will hurt me to my grave. You have the future, let the past inspire you into it.............

            Originally posted by georgesmiley View Post

            I found two reliable places to buy it online - for about 16p a pill (10mg) (That's about 22 US cents, 18 euro cents). That's a lot - BUT, it's cheaper than booze. Baclofenman got his doctor to prescribe it - but that's rare in the UK - rare anywhere outside France. From what I see, that's quite cheap. I can post where I got it if the forum is cool with that.

            I feel 100mg is too low a dose to reach indifference BUT the all-consuming thirst come 5pm has ebbed. So - something is happening. It remains to be seen what.
            Indeed I did. I would refer you to this post. Anecdotal writings and recommendations are essential to this site so yes, name your source.

            Certainly from what I have read, 100mg qd is not enough to reach a switch.

            Originally posted by georgesmiley View Post

            I kept drinking out of habit - and out of a sort of panic, that it was 5pm, and I could, so I should, cos I always do, and it made me a nicer, better person. (I'm not an angry drunk. I'm actually much more relaxed and agreeable when drunk.)
            Mmm, this is a very interesting area. Is a habit an addiction? I was a right cunt when I was drunk.

            Originally posted by georgesmiley View Post

            This evening, I had 2 drinks around 530pm - I'm on my own, looking after my girl. I could hardly hold my head up for tiredness (not drunkenness - apparently drinking while on bac can lead to shocking tiredness). So... I stopped refilling at 6.30pm. I've been in a sort of panic since - I mean, what on earth is sober me supposed to do with himself? I'm so damn thirsty - not booze thirsty, proper old-fashioned dry mouth thirsty. It's 9pm, and I haven't drunk since 630pm - except tea.

            This is remarkable - but I don't think I could face the tiredness. But I'm sober at 9pm on a Saturday (well - two drinks three hours ago. Sober for me!).

            I'll keep the universe posted on how it goes. Early days, but this is interesting.
            Please do, I recommend cuddling your girl on the sofa and watching something decent on tv. I drank fizzy water with lime cordial (god forbid i would have chundered on that when I was "drinking") and maxed out on Netflix and Sky to take my mind off stuff - Curb you Enthusiasm is what I watched and the wife still calls me Larry! You don't have to be American or Jewish to love Larry David.

            Curb Your Enthusiasm Past Away - YouTube
            Larry David vs Susie Greene - YouTube " I thought she had a speech impediment" - Classic
            Enjoy the videos and music that you love, upload original content and share it all with friends, family and the world on YouTube.


            Enjoy,

            Regards,


            Bacman.
            I am not a Doctor - I am an alcoholic.
            Thoughts expressed here are my own, often poorly put together and littered with atrocious grammar and spelling.

            Comment


              #7
              Re: My baclofen journey

              Thank you [MENTION=14524]_serenity_[/MENTION] and [MENTION=22732]Baclofenman[/MENTION].

              It's been so helpful reading your stuff. Encouraged me to have a go.

              You asked me to name my sources: I'm happy to. Some sites piss their knickers at anything so useful. Both of these do affordable baclofen, and I've found them reliable as I built up my stock (so if it all goes tits up, I can titrate back down...)

              Extrapharmacy Online Store - this guy takes his time, but it's tracked, free postage, and I think it'd suitable for the US as he packages it as some industrial product in a vacuum-packed silver box.

              Welcome to United Pharmacies (UK) have also been brilliant. They work out about the same, costwise. These guys send Mylan products (New Zealand) out of India/HK/Singapore. They've just added the US to their list of destinations, so I guess they must send differently there. (To Britain, it's just got exactly what it is written on the box). Generally here in about a week.

              It's Saturday evening - it's 6pm and I'm sober. This has not happened since... years and years. We'll see how this pans out.

              It's as if without drinking, I'm just bored. I think it was my hobby!

              Comment


                #8
                Re: My baclofen journey

                Originally posted by _serenity_ View Post
                Hi [MENTION=24582]georgesmiley[/MENTION]! Thank you so much for sharing your experience. It sounds like you are heading towards "the switch" - a major tipping point! I found it utterly miraculous. And you're experiencing the wondrous anxiety relief as well.

                I know what you mean about loving the drinking, but it's good that you recognize how problematic it can be. My experience with baclofen (10 years) and with watching others on this board has been that the people who are the most successful are those who really work to distance themselves from the drink, and who build up a good amount of sober time. I've seen a lot of people on here and other forums who took bac, kept drinking and ended up right back where they started.

                I have really missed seeing people sharing their bac journies on here!
                I think you're right. In my head, I'm going to be just this 'normal guy' who has the odd drink when out with friends. I've never been one of those drinkers who gets 'the thirst' and can't stop. It's just, I have the odd drink 3 (or 6) times a day every damn day for years. (I'm 48, and first saw an alcohol counsellor aged about 28...) I sneak out of Moanna with my girl to 'refresh the glass.'

                I just can't really think of what I'd do to fill my time if I wasn't drinking, and I can't figure out who on earth I'd be.

                But I think ultimately, giving it up needs to be the end point. I just struggle to 'own' that right now. That said, a couple of drinks while taking baclofen, and I'm basically drifting randomly in and out of narcolepsy. The two substances clearly don't mix.
                Last edited by georgesmiley; October 24, 2020, 12:32 PM.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Re: My baclofen journey

                  Originally posted by Baclofenman View Post
                  Hey, [MENTION=24582]georgesmiley[/MENTION]

                  Thanks for sharing your story to date, as [MENTION=14524]_serenity_[/MENTION]


                  I think that seems a good titration regime. You are pretty full up when the cravings start around the 3pm to 5pm mark. Personally, I would keep the 8am and noon as they are and increase as needed the 4pm intake up to maybe 60mg and then add another slightly later, maybe 6pm or 7pm.
                  Noted. Will action this. And get some imodium... Constipation looks like a distant dream, right now...
                  Last edited by georgesmiley; October 24, 2020, 12:35 PM.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Re: My baclofen journey

                    Originally posted by georgesmiley View Post
                    Some sites piss their knickers at anything so useful.
                    From my view, this site uses very limited moderation, especially with anecdotal opinion, which is essentially the life blood of the forum.

                    Bullshit and flaming is stamped on, opinion and poor fact is questioned.

                    Regards.


                    Bacman
                    I am not a Doctor - I am an alcoholic.
                    Thoughts expressed here are my own, often poorly put together and littered with atrocious grammar and spelling.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Re: My baclofen journey

                      Originally posted by georgesmiley View Post
                      Noted. Will action this. And get some imodium... Constipation looks like a distant dream, right now...
                      lol, I am not sure what is worse......

                      Interesting Username BTW......

                      Regards,



                      Bacman
                      Last edited by Baclofenman; October 25, 2020, 07:24 AM.
                      I am not a Doctor - I am an alcoholic.
                      Thoughts expressed here are my own, often poorly put together and littered with atrocious grammar and spelling.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Re: My baclofen journey

                        Originally posted by Baclofenman View Post
                        Interesting Username BTW......
                        Implies more purpose to my life than there is...
                        Last edited by georgesmiley; December 31, 2020, 05:40 PM.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Re: My baclofen journey

                          Yesterday (Saturday) I didn't have a single drink, for the first time in years. It felt weird - but easy.

                          Today (Sunday) a friend bought me a pint with a Sunday lunch - I bottled refusing it. But that's it. I should have just had a Coke.

                          I still have no idea who I'll be if I stay sober, and that's a worry. Also, I'm a short-tempered, irritable over-thinker when sober, and bloomin' lovely when a bit pissed. So that's also a worry. Maybe I'm short tempered because I'm anxious and that will go?

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Re: My baclofen journey

                            So, a week later - and I haven't drunk anything for a week. I have managed two weeks before (once), so I'm not reading too much into it - but I'm still pleased.

                            I followed [MENTION=22732]Baclofenman[/MENTION] 's recommendation, and went up to 125 - though no GI problems with this increase.

                            I couldn't say I'm indifferent, because actually I fear starting drinking again. I like not drinking, but worry I'll restart - clearly, not quite indifference. Also, this week is something of an exception - I'm a teacher, and it's half term. We'll have to see how that fares.

                            Finally (for this week) I'd say that baclofen is not a drug to be messed with: its anxiolytic effects are remarkable, but I notice now if I forget a dose - there's a sort of rising feeling of being 'out of sorts' with yourself. I think I also worry that it'll be addictive in the sense of needing more of it. Most claim that this does not happen - it will be good to hear others' views of this.
                            Last edited by georgesmiley; October 31, 2020, 03:21 PM.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Re: My baclofen journey

                              Originally posted by georgesmiley View Post
                              I think I also worry that it'll be addictive in the sense of needing more of it.
                              It is only "addictive" in the sense you will (probably) need to taper off it. It is not "addictive" in the way, say crack is, in so far as you can taper off Baclofen without side effects but I doubt crack will allow you that ease. The use of the word addictive is being used wrongly in this sense.

                              You may need a higher dose to get to a state when you feel "indifferent" , higher than at 125mg q.d As a medication, Baclofen is NOT addictive, using the word addictive in the way it is designed and interpreted in the correct sense.

                              Heroin, Crack and long term Cocaine use is addictive, without other medications I would expect these are difficult to kick. Baclofen is not addictive but needs a titration and tapering regime. There is a solid difference, both Medically, Ethically and Physically.

                              I get the commitment to Baclofen and your yearning to achieve your goal, necessitating the need for a higher dose. this is not uncommon, I was content around the 160mg q.d (daily) but many have been far more 300+ mg q.d and some less. it is a bit hit and miss and I believe effected by your consumption.

                              My congrats as to not drinking for a week or so, we have all been there and know this is a bloody hard effort - I always get "itchy" around the 3 o clock mark.....Get yourself a Netfix subscription or if you have one watch a good comedy series to take you up to bed time.

                              I am sure I have mentioned several series in the past but if you missed them.......

                              Curb Your Enthusiasm - Wikipedia

                              Fauda - Wikipedia

                              The End of the F***ing World - Wikipedia

                              Of course Game of Thrones and Breaking Bad.

                              This will last you a month or so by which time you will be a month ahead.

                              Regards,


                              Bacman
                              Last edited by Baclofenman; November 2, 2020, 02:09 PM.
                              I am not a Doctor - I am an alcoholic.
                              Thoughts expressed here are my own, often poorly put together and littered with atrocious grammar and spelling.

                              Comment

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