Hi! Im here again. A small voice still looking for friends on their way out of this

[DragonbytheSea]

Re: Hi! I’m here again. A small voice still looking for friends on their way out of t

I'm trying to think of a good day. First, I thought of Lent, but that's pretty spectacular procrastination. We could give up procrastination at the same time! Make it double whammy, worth the wait!

Then, I thought of Monday. Mondays are notorious for their innate crappiness. If we're gonna be miserable anyway, it might as well be on a Monday. I looked up holidays for January 23, and the only thing I found that could, with imagination, be deemed as suitable. Monday is "National Report Pharmaceutical Fraud Day." Woo hoo.

If we wait until Tuesday, it is "National Belly Laugh Day," as if the universe was amused at our intentions. It is also "Change a Pet's Life Day" and "National Just Do It Day," both of which could be applicable. My pup would like more walks. It's also "Speak Up and Succeed Day," and less serendipitously it will be "National Beer Can Appreciation Day."

[Ne/Neva Eva]

Re: Hi! I’m here again. A small voice still looking for friends on their way out of t

Is it okay if I quit quoting and quit @ing people I’m having a conversation with? I don’t know the new norm. And it’s so long to type out on anything but a keyboard. Then again, I’m crankier than I can recently remember being and it’s not because I’m sober. (Full disclosure, I’m not.)If I were a cat, I’d be waiting under the couch for someone to walk by.

[Ne/Neva Eva]

Re: Hi! I’m here again. A small voice still looking for friends on their way out of t

Ugh. I’ll be back tomorrow morning.

[DragonbytheSea]

Re: Hi! I’m here again. A small voice still looking for friends on their way out of t

I'm sorry, NE. It is too much work to quote, so I will not unless there is a good reason. Also, addressing other posters, generally I would use their screen name, sans the @ which I don't use on Facebook either. But there was only two other people, so that seemed unnecessary. It just now occurred to me that the @ is why I have 40 some notifications. That was baffling, but I just assumed the software was getting soft.

It sounds like you are not into setting a date. That's cool. I don't need you, and I won't wait for you.

I hope you have a much better day.

[Ne/Neva Eva]

Re: Hi! I’m here again. A small voice still looking for friends on their way out of t

It sounds like you are not into setting a date. That's cool. I don't need you, and I won't wait for you.

Wow. Ouch. I'm not sure what I wrote that gave that impression, but I can assure you that I need people and I didn't mean to imply that I wasn't eager and willing to set a date and share the journey. Whatever it was, I apologize. Given my general angst and outright anger at everything, from the weather to the dog, I shouldn't have posted at all.

My day started out fairly miserable from the time I opened my eyes, my husband's morning radio show, which I abhor, blasting from his speaker in the bathroom, to the end, when I was laying in the backyard at midnight wondering how the fuck everything could go so wrong.

Because of the way the day started I was determined that I was just going to do something about it and took an Antabuse. That was a mistake. Or rather, just the first mistake.

We're having work done on the house and so there were workmen traipsing in and out of my study, which is my personal space and where I needed to be yesterday, without the invasion of strangers. Or anyone really. A bit of self-reflection, or meditation, or almost anything would probably have been wise. Instead I drank.

I suppose I am inclined toward self-pity these days, but I'm also pretty determined I don't want to live like this anymore and I need people and baclofen and whatever else anyone who isn't...well, me... says I need or should do to move forward.

Whatever was going on yesterday, that started pre-dawn, isn't with me today. Not that I feel great, especially physically, but at least I'm not angry with the universe.

[guardian]

Re: Hi! I’m here again. A small voice still looking for friends on their way out of t

[MENTION=12976]Ne/Neva Eva[/MENTION]

As I'm sure you know, baclofen works whether you're abstinent or continue to drink. I've done it both ways. I will say that I learned more about myself when I was abstinent prior to the baclofen helping with the allergy, craving, whatever you want to call it. I didn't necessarily learn it at the time, but having been lucid and dry, I was able to form memories that I later could learn from. My memory is shit as it is, and the drink/withdrawal cycle would have made this wisdom impossible.

Do you speak to anyone? Like a therapist? Sorry if you've covered this previously.

[Ne/Neva Eva]

Re: Hi! I’m here again. A small voice still looking for friends on their way out of

[MENTION=9868]guardian[/MENTION]
I know it worked that way for me once. I also know there aren't any guarantees. And I'm terrified of having to go up into the hundreds again. I'm also terrible, truly, about taking my medications on time and regularly. STILL. I don't know what the hell my problem is. Alarm goes off. Get pill. Take it. That should sum it up. It's not like trying to sit for meditation for an hour (or 15 minutes) or exercise, for any duration. 20 seconds and done.

There was a lot to respond to on what you wrote on your thread but I didn't want to hijack and I wrote too much anyway.

I'm excited for you about nursing school. Despite my misgivings, it was a very cool adventure. I think part of my cautionary advice is based on the fact that the community college I went to for my associates degree was so decimated by covid that they've changed the program, again, and it's even more intensive and pass/fail then it was when I was there a decade ago. I heard this from my physical therapist, whose husband was in the program a couple of years ago. He failed one exam and was out. In my first quarter, we had a skills test, or whatever they're called. And I kid you not, I practiced EVERYTHING, on my husband, my grandmother (how to use a walker! paid off a little while later), literally a doll, except how to put on a bandaid. And I would have failed out if the person I was working with hadn't ignored the fact that I touched the sterile part of the bandaid. lololol. She turned out to be a whack job, but I was 2 weeks into school and she didn't get me removed, so there's that.

No, I don't have anyone to talk to, outside of you people and a friend offline, who has been through it and knows. I do have a psychiatric PA, who dabbles in therapy (though trained in med school, not therapy) and a very sympathetic MD doctor, both of whom are willing to prescribe. The PA, Lara, is willing to listen, but the line between therapist and patient is blurry. We've known each other a long time, she was the first to prescribe baclofen for me after Levin. But she's not a trained therapist. And I can't be...totally honest with her. (As an aside, my husband and I went to see a couple's therapist, that in my world was expensive, and she rocked our world. I love Lara, she's been a godsend, and is a mentor of sorts, and would be a close friend if I'd met her some other way. But the couple's therapist? Made me realize there's a big difference between a PhD and an MD/PA and that, though I believed differently, there's HUGE value to seeing a psychologist. [Two asides. My mom is a PhD psychologist who does research about a lot of the things that have affected us and our family and fat lot of good that's done. lol. I've been seeing therapists since I was 14, after my first IQ test and subsequent wtf is wrong with her discussions. Second thing is that I believed in the AA version of psychological addiction (and religion/redemption) that was and is popular and populated the first 50+ years of the program. It didn't work for me. I thought it was a paradox to understand and believe in both. And I'm not talking about the idea that alcohol or a drug makes one an addict.] Epidemiology. Circumstances? Yes. Hard wiring, yes. Conditioning, yes. A mix of all of the above? I'm fucked. ha. funny not funny.)

I don't really even know how to go about getting someone to 'talk to'. It's overwhelming. My area, made of of hundreds of thousands of people on the east coast, is a mental-health desert. My after care coordinator couldn't find anything here, and my primary care doc, whose father is a recently relapsed, after decades of sobriety in AA, literally said, "I know. It's so fucked up." Her words.

So. going to meetings, and I'm housebound for the moment. I really need to get into that PHP program at the psych unit. That seems to be the next logical thing to do. Painful. More difficult than it should be. But necessary, I think. I'm not in a good place. Well, actually, it's not that. It's that I'm getting worse. Again.

[Ne/Neva Eva]

Re: Hi! I’m here again. A small voice still looking for friends on their way out of t

ETA. DWISNWID
Just in case there's anyone out there who is visiting or whatever. I want to be clear about Antabuse. It's not a safe medication for people with alcoholism, or even people who use other substances but might drink even if they've taken antabuse. That's fact.
Being me, and taking expired antabuse, though I have recent prescription, I figured the consequences, especially because they weren't immediate, would be okay. They're not. My insides hurt for about 30 hours. And, I've experienced this before, my depression escalated dramatically. I don't know if that's drinking and Antabuse or the antabuse itself. Just don't mess with it, if like me, you can't abstain. (Also, in my younger years, I had a profound reaction to taking Antabuse and then drinking within the first 24 hours. One that if I'd been older, and had health insurance, would have landed me in the ER.) Just needed to clarify that in case there are knuckleheads like me out there. The last couple of days have been particularly miserable.

[guardian]

Re: Hi! I’m here again. A small voice still looking for friends on their way out of t

I take it 2x a day – upon awakening and immediately before bed. If I were still drinking, I’d probably aim for taking my 2nd dose prior to starting. I’ve only ever needed to take it 2x a day, even when I was at 340mgs. I’m not taking pills though. I purchased raw powder from the manufacturer in China. I’m not sure that it makes any difference except regarding cost. I simply couldn’t afford to continue taking 340mgs from Goldpharma at the time.

Hijack away. I don’t care. It’s all community space as far as I’m concerned. If I have something to say for my own sake, I’ll say it. It makes me happy when I see that extra pages have been added to the threads, even if I’m not part of the conversation. I’ll butt right in and interrupt, change the subject, cause confusion with my ignominious and incoherent ramblings, and then not reply to comments directed towards me. Just like the good old days.

That does sound…intimidating. I’ll be attending at university, so I hope it’s more graduated. Many people going for the BSN would be doing so to get into administration or to get on the NP or PHD track, I would think, although I’m not sure that makes a difference. The basics are fundamental and I would think if something could lead to significant infection for example there isn’t really any room for a C-.

I was court-ordered to speak to someone. Fortunately, as a veteran I had access to therapists at the VA. And I got lucky with Shane. I really, truly love him. I almost don’t want him to be my therapist anymore because I could really use a friend like him, but it’s forbidden. We can go from talking about current events, politics, trading jokes, etc. to me crying about my life and back again in 15 minutes. He’s told me things about his own life that show me that he trusts me as well.

That said, at one time I was looking to add some more time with someone who specialized in CPTSD and addiction. This was before I really trusted Shane and was able to just open the gates with him at will. He’s also plenty-well versed in both, but I was just having trouble being vulnerable with another man.
I found a handful in my area (Fort Wayne) by searching on Psychology.com.

About your mom - My mom has a degree in something related to early-childhood development. I can’t remember exactly what it is, but according to her, she’s an authority. Let me tell you, she did not practice what I would call gently or emotionally available parenting lol.

My experience with a marriage counselor was very different from yours, but I was in a very bad place at the time. Still trying to forgive myself for some of that.

[Ne/Neva Eva]

Re: Hi! I’m here again. A small voice still looking for friends on their way out of t

Ne wrote: but were you in a bad place when you assumed that I'm a narcissistic automaton, which whatever, I might be, or were you just being mean and assuming the worst about people in general, especially people who don't know and can't see you?

Honestly, my mantra has nothing to do with you. It is ALL about me. I wrote about what I get out of meetings, because its all about me if I go to a meeting. If I am posting here, that is also all about me.

Thank you for the apology. Nothing went ballistic.

I do not want to argue or debate anything. I think you do, which is cool if that's how you fly. That kind of thing does not work well for me.

I think you misunderstood me, just as I misunderstood you. And I responded to your original comment on the wrong thread. Hopefully I've successfully moved it?

So to be clear, I thought you were reaching out a hand, virtual though it may be, to walk a path together. And I thought that by being flippant, I undermined that offer of camaraderie.

There was a time when I posted here when it had to be all about me. And there was a time when I posted for personal gratification. There was a time when I couldn't post, because I thought I was alone. Mostly, though, when I write here, or share in meetings, or am open to someone else, it isn't about me at all. I mean. to be clear, it's ALL about my experiences. Strengths. Hopes. And Failures.

huh. that said, instagram and my previous thread counts tell otherwise. so wtf do I know? Vulnerability is a target.

The twelfth step, fwiw, is not about self gratification or self worth. I've also grown soooo fucking tired of the 50 year olds who got sober when they were 30 through the steps. (Oh, wait, I don't know any of them.)

I've been in enough rooms to know the difference between people who give up, but show up, treading the waters, in order to stay sober. And that's what it calls for when dealing with people with addiction. We lose and gain more, by attrition, not attraction. By definition, not by success.

And there are people who don't give a shit how they're received, but they're in the rooms, or the rehab, to help others. I've been on the receiving end of both. If I get to choose, right now, I'd be the one who is, for once in their lives, not ALL about ME. Except in the best way.

And I've been on the receiving end of people who, despite their willingness, in spite of their participation, just cannot...

...get sober
...get help
...move on
Not in that order, for many of us.

So, no, DBTS, I have no reason or room to debate or argue with you. I do that enough in my own head.

[Ne/Neva Eva]

Re: Hi! I’m here again. A small voice still looking for friends on their way out of t

[MENTION=9868]guardian[/MENTION], I responded to your post via message because I wasn't keeping it all straight. The short version: it's incredibly nicto hear that you've gotten help through the VA. I live in one of the most military areas in the country, and all I know or hear about are horror stories... Nursing school is a bear. And for me, actual nursing was way worse. I just can't find the balance between empathy/compassion and a necessary disassociation. I was much more comfortable in the intensive situations than the mundane ones, but not the ER, which was a rotating door of misery for everyone who walks in, (obviously) and for me, except the exciting stuff. That said, we're all made of different stuff, thank goodness.

My baclofen journey is still in it's infancy. I don't know that it will ever get further. And I'm feeling sorta lost. The silence is deafening.
[MENTION=22203]Stevo[/MENTION], you're the reason I started posting.

[Stevo]

Re: Hi! I’m here again. A small voice still looking for friends on their way out of t

[MENTION=12976]Ne/Neva Eva[/MENTION] I didn't want to say this here but feel it's time. I have not been back through the posts in this thread, I became very uncomfortable with the platitudinal approach to cPTSD which became prevalent. As someone who has lived with it since a small child, who grew up in terrible fear and group homes I found what I was reading cookie cutter and shallow. The sort of therapy designed to work on the easily suggestible, none of the suggestions I have read from the instigator have worked for me, ever. They sound great, yet are basic oversimplifications of an extremely complex and nuanced disorder which at 47 I still have not found solace from.

I post in MWO to share my story with whoever wants to read it in the hope it may provide some resonance to those on the same path or hope to a newcomer. I stopped interacting for various reasons including medical and personal, but mostly I could not partake in the superficial approach to mitigating cPTSD I was seeing. It really turned me off.

I loved that you were back Ne, I had been posting for ages with very little interaction. I also love that when I stopped posting you and I communicated in PM's.

I apologise if what I am saying has offended anyone, I'd love to interact more but have a lot going on in my life and seriously felt Ne's thread had been somewhat transformed from its intended purpose. I even stopped posting in my own, no one really ever pays much attention anyway (other than Ne and a couple of others, occasionally).

Have a great day/night wherever you may be. Hopefully I will post a little more some time in the future, but until then, Ne please don't stop messaging me. I saw your last one and have not had a chance to respond as yet. I only posted this because I jumped on quickly to do the word association game and saw I had been mentioned.

Cheers,

Steve.

[Ne/Neva Eva]

Re: Hi! I’m here again. A small voice still looking for friends on their way out of t

I don't even know how to make this shorter.

Thanks, @Stevo. I'm always a bit conflicted about private messaging versus posting... I love developing relationships, and there are some things that are better communicated, personal information or insight, that kind of thing, in PM. Or when I'm worried about someone. But generally, I think it's better to stick to the forum, because if everything happens behind the scenes, it becomes an echo chamber in the forum.

I did that in responding to a post from several days ago, sent an endless PM, as I'm wont to do, when really I meant to write most of it here. But just wanted to know if the person was in the same place as one of my closest friends. Can't ask that on here! Especially since it's a small town...

Anyway. As I've said, I can't get into the cPTSD thing because that's not my experience. I used to think I had something like PTSD. But then I realized I just have alcoholism. An analogy would be someone who is a neat-freak labeling themselves OCD, without really knowing what that means. I have similar experiences in a very generic sense, I suppose, but not the disabling mental illness that is a symptom or result (or both) of PTSD. In other words, I can only relate to a certain point and then I have to just understand that I can't understand, and hope I'm compassionate and empathetic without judgment or pity.

I will say, the only times I felt it was all about me were when I was at my most fucked up. So that really kerfuffles me. I don't mean that in the AA way, that we're all selfish assholes. And I'm not suggesting that being selfless is any boon to ourselves, or humanity, either. Our coping mechanisms are different. One of my main ones happens to be making it all about me. (You think I jest. I don't think I have a narcissistic personality disorder, and I'm not trying to be self denigrating. I'm just being honest. I don't know when I crossed the line from caring about what everyone else thinks to not caring AT ALL about what other people think. But it wasn't a healthy line to cross, and it's not a spectrum I want to be on either end of. Me, Us, We. That might be a good meditation, if I actually fucking meditate tomorrow, dammit. ha)

I was despairing when I last posted, and not much has changed, except my mood. Things that seemed totally overwhelming had a January 31st deadline and I actually took care of them. Or started the process, anyway. Let me tell you, sober, these things wouldn't even blip on my radar. Given that 90% of my energy in the beginning of the day is spent recovering from the previous day, and swearing, once again, not again. And then compulsion and desperation kick in, and I'm back to square one.

I'm not using the bandaids I usually use to make me comfortable, which is a good thing. But I'm also not progressing. I got a kick in the teeth from a family member who thinks (knows) I'm not sober. Hmmm. Let's tell it like it is. I talk to my mom pretty regularly. She's easy...about denial, anyway. My dad? Not so much. He and I are cut from the same cloth. And he knows. So he sent me a sweet text, that he's worried I'm drinking and hiding it. That he wakes up in the middle of the night worried about me. And it broke my heart. Again. again and again and again. AA in my twenties pretty much ruined living in denial for me. And I've nowhere left to hide except in the bottle. I never have. (poor me. waaah. ugh)

Promised myself, and had Eric promise with me, that we'd go to the gd psych unit today and get the ball rolling for the PHP (outpatient, 5 days a week, 6 hours a day) program. A shower in the morning and a reason to leave the house would be a good start. Alcohol testing. Accountability. Even if it costs a bloody fortune. Even if it sucks.

Baclofen titration is not going well. I need some encouragement there. It helped reading your thread, @Stevo. Back in the day there were a dozen or so of us, including Ameisen himself for a while (tho that wasn't always a plus. ha. sorry. RIP) and now I'm like, this...is very uncomfortable. It's hard to buy in when you don't think it's the holy grail. But ffs, it's the only thing that has ever worked for me, and I watched it transform my husband into a beautiful sparkly sober human being. After he completely lost his shit by taking too much and then not taking it. It's no joke. I don't know why it scares me now, though. I have MUCH less to lose now then I did 14 years ago. It's laughable. I can't remember his name, and it's got to be annoying that I keep mentioning the past, but I'm nostalgic and also... just sad about the decimation of the meds threads before they changed ownership. Anyway. He suggested that he'd just lock himself up, with support from loved ones, and take a bunch of baclofen and be done in a couple of weeks. I'd be lying if I said I wasn't tempted. But I suspect that's the addict in me talking. Do you think?
@Stevo, where are you with your intake? And how are you feeling?
@guardian, I will be taking powder, shortly, too. I'm still nervous, despite repeated reassurances offline about it. Mostly I don't trust my scale, and it's the third one I've ordered. Whytf aren't dosages a standard measurement? (Aside, I did figure out, conclusively, that my 1000mg of fish oil, by prescription, filled by my CVS, was only 750mg. Those dirty bastards. You know how? Same prescription, same CVS. I measured 10 pills from two different bottles on three different scales. And we think it's just the drug companies that are evil. grrrr)

To both of you, thanks again. And I think you're both kinda in similar-ish places, and very different circumstances, sort of. But I only know that because I've been messaging with both of you. Please feel free to commune.

I will feel free to post on here tomorrow that I've taken 80mg of baclofen and all my other assorted meds. And, though I ABHOR the idea, will get myself to the psych unit to sign up for aftercare.

PS. I swear to all that matters, I just got a phone call from CVS. And I have their normal number blocked because they're so annoying with the 'connecting'. And I've only had 4 beers, so I'm not losing it. eta: maybe they've gotten a new number?

[Ne/Neva Eva]

Re: Hi! I’m here again. A small voice still looking for friends on their way out of t

No shock, there's a waiting list to get into the program.
Didn't take 80mg yesterday, nor will I today.

[Ne/Neva Eva]

Re: Hi! I’m here again. A small voice still looking for friends on their way out of t

Took 80mg. Looking up Allie Brosh. One of her illustrations would be my avatar, if it would come through clear. Not that my current avatar does. It was painted by a Czech artist. Can you see the hook in the bottle??? He gave me permission to use it on another website. And I have a copy of it in my study. What's at the bottom of the bottle? a hook.

Back to Allie Brosh. I suppose she's gotten tired of being reproduced without repercussion, but I'll try to past my favorite thing here. And for dog lovers, especially crazy dog lovers who love crazy dogs, her blog is especially funny. And if you're just wonky. (btw, I suppose this is way dated. Maybe y'all know all about her. or don't care. Whatever. It's my thread. I'll post country music or wonky blogs if I want. ha.)

Hyperbole and a Half