A LONG AND PAINFUL JEARNEY

[Bluebell]

A LONG AND PAINFUL JEARNEY

Anyway!

Echome here's wishing you strength to carry on with your life-changing journey.

You are doing great.

[KateH1]

A LONG AND PAINFUL JEARNEY

Wait!!! So....you are involved with men that cannot and will not own up to their wrong doings...so..you elevate ECKO...to a hero??? He But headed his wife and put her in the hospital...less than three weaks ago!!! Help him!!!! Do not excuse his behavior!

[tawnyfrog]

A LONG AND PAINFUL JEARNEY

Echome - whilst you are making enormous changes to your life you will have my total support. It will not be easy. Stay strong. You have a lot at stake.

[Bluebell]

A LONG AND PAINFUL JEARNEY

Oh shut up Kate.

This man is not perfect, no-one is. He is someone who knows the error of his ways and is committed to changing those ways.

People come on these boards for lots of reasons and they do not come here to be judged.

[bootcampbarbie]

A LONG AND PAINFUL JEARNEY

are you kidding me? you are cracking me up. error of his ways? years of emotional, physical abuse and now it's okay? oy veh. well, i'm glad that you guys are so amazingly kind. i'm not that kind my ex who learned the error of his ways after beating the wholly hell out of me more than a few times, wiring my jaw shut etc echome. i'm afraid i'm with your wifey on this one. after awhile you just can't forget. you just can't. there just comes a point when you've been down that road so many times you just have to say you heal your pain cuz i have to heal my own. so i'd say these people here are very kind to you because they do not have a history of having you in their life. your wife does. and probably they don't have a history of having a lot emotional and physical and mental abuse because if they had a lot of it as i have they wouldn't be as forgiving after 15 days. you'd have had to have about 3 years under your belt before they would say a word. see 15 days isn't much after a whole lotta years of what you have been up to. so good that you have them on your team. and kate i don't think you should shut up at all. maybe you and i should leave echo to his team of well wishers. we are just going to have to agree to disagree on this one. and since my jaw isn't wired shut anymore i'm going to have to agree not to have to go there. cheers

[Bluebell]

A LONG AND PAINFUL JEARNEY

If someone is trying to help themselves, regardless of their past, should they not get unjudgemental support on this site?

[betty boop]

A LONG AND PAINFUL JEARNEY

Bluebell I agree .......

Echome, I admire your strength in doing your best to change .....

We all have a past that we are not proud of, or why would we be here .........

[Cinders]

A LONG AND PAINFUL JEARNEY

Echome,

Please keep forging ahead. You are doing brilliantly and making a huge effort to learn from your mistakes and not make them ever again.

Also, use Kate and Bootsie's posts to your advantage. They will give you a view to your wife's state of mind. Hopefully, now you can understand her fear and trepidation. It will take much work on your part to help erase those fears and make a life better for both of you. It sounds like she still loves you, which is amazing, so you can do it but ony if you keep working on it.

YOU CANNOT AND MUST NOT DRINK AGAIN.

Cindi

[maxman]

A LONG AND PAINFUL JEARNEY

Echome,


I agree with kate and boot, you are lucky that you are not posting from a prison cell. stay away from the grog and if you are lucky things may turn around

[satori]

A LONG AND PAINFUL JEARNEY

Hmm!

My own reading of echo's posts was - a history of alcohol and drug abuse culminating in a single occurrence of physical abuse - which acted as a major wake-up call and his subsequent appearance here.

Now, while physical violence is always totally and utterly unacceptable, - if this is the situation - this man needs our support - he IS trying to sort this situation out.

If on the other hand - if there is a history of repeated violence, - that is a whole different thing.
But - that was NOT my reading of the history here, and we do not KNOW that to be the true situation.....(unless I missed something???)

We surely have to accept and go with what people here tell us happened when they come here asking for help.

Kate, BCB - surely we should not assume this man's history based on our own personal past experiences - traumatic and unnacceptable as they obviously were in your own cases.

I do agree with Kate on one point however - ECHO - if you want our unconditional support here - posting in "feeling sorry for yourself" mode won't do you any favours after what you have done!
We have all done very stupid things while under the influence - but yours was just about as bad as it ever gets.

So - Show us you REALLY mean it!
Post factually to advertise and reinforce your successes and ask for advice by all means but tone down the self pity.

I'll help you in any way I can to kick the booze - but sorry - I wont be dishing out sympathy to you coz of how you are suffering in all this.
All my sympathy has already been allocated to your wife.

Love

Satori

XXX

[bootcampbarbie]

A LONG AND PAINFUL JEARNEY

drinking my morning tea, i thought i'd be generous enough to give you a sense of this. and i actually think i can after not only spending several years in a toxic relationship that involve a very abusive spouse that used but also involved children. and then to have spent 8 years once a week in counseling that also included me spending a year as an experimental studying as a victim group with the perpetrator group (god i cringe at those names now) but that is the names they used then. so my therapist would say i've logged in more hours then most therapists sadly enough.
while i have empathy, i have absolutely no sympathy for where you are. your drinking and using did not land you here. your behavior was only magnified by the choice of your substance abuse. i doubt very sincerely that physical abuse happened only once. it is however what you have chose to disclose. and my long term observations in such matters tells me that people in such situations rarely tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth. they disclose what they need to, to enroll sympathy towards their cause. let me know if i am off. perpetrators generally have a very strong disposition for needing and attracting those in which not only rally to their cause but to them. thus the level of narcissim is magnified by 1000%. that is why i notice a very large percentage of you running threads and having to run new threads. you have a constant need to be seen. as in i would recommend at your treatment center they do a lot of work with you in that regard as we are not set up as a support group to help you with that.
as the spouse of someone that is a time bomb ticking waiting to go off, she is highly sensitive and yes very afraid of you. while you speak of reconciliation. ... one should consider that she has a restraining order out on you, you have 15 days sober, and she is very scared of you. it does not consider her well being at all to even think of reconciliation just between you and i after what has been going on. think about it. here's what it is like to be the spouse of a time bomb, you are a very jealous man, you can go off she looks sideways at some one, dinner is cold, you throw the meal at the wall, children are constantly in fear, you throw the food at her, the child (ren) are always crying, she never knows if she will be hit, beaten, yelled at, slapped. the point that she was scared of you in public and didn't come up to see you tells me you have hit her more than once. otherwise, she wouldn't scared to see you in public. and you can say i'm out of line but i think the two of us know i'm not. how's this you are driving down the street, kid in the back of the car, you pass a driver, you start yelling cuz you don't like the way she looked out the window, then you just start on her, how pathetic she is, and then you throw her against the window, kid is yelling, you threaten to beat the child. she's in fear for the child. you know i can name any number of situations. the point is they aren't safe with you even if you aren't drinking or using. because that isn't the issue. the issue is that you have problems and you need to work on them. and she needs to build her self esteem. and reconciliation is about you being able to be with your family because you have blown it. they don't need you half as much as you need them. she may be hurting. but i'm more concerned that you just may cross that line and not come back and then she will or that child (ren) will be so harmed that there is no going back. and since i've been a counselor for the battered women's shelter for years i've seen way too many people like you. so, i may come off as hard and uncaring but i know the otherside of your story and i belive she needs a break. so, many relationships come back together if they are worth it in the first place and it takes more than a few months of sobriety to fix years worth of abuse. so i'd say work on your issues. and recommend your wife get some counseling by a really great therapist while you are away.

[bootcampbarbie]

A LONG AND PAINFUL JEARNEY

and satori, i don't always write clearly cuz i'm at topa dopa 225 stage. nice. but i am just basing today's ramble on what i've seen as a counselor for shelter in speaking with men and women. victim's perpetrators. not my own personal experience at the moment. so, i'm not going to come back to these threads anymore for echo. you have all the support you need from the treatment facility. i would however support your wife and child. but no, you haven't earned my support. just because you've had a drinking problem as i does not earn my support. i draw the line at physical, emotional and mental abuse and destructive behaviors such as yours.

[BabyGirl]

A LONG AND PAINFUL JEARNEY

I am too new to really express an opinion -- but I can draw from personal experience.

I have unfortunatelty been with men that have verbally / mentally abused me -- I have finally left ... and as a result my self esteem was zero & I developed a drinking habit that is very difficult to kick.

Echo needs to work on his issues & I heard that loud and clear from everyones post.
Echo, for the sake of your wife let her breathe for a while...she needs to recover as well.

Good luck to everyone as we all have some matter that must be addressed.
I chose the name BabyGirl because I realized at age 40 just how much I have to learn. So far I have learned so much from all of you. Thank you!

[trixietrack]

A LONG AND PAINFUL JEARNEY

bootcampbarbie;206915 wrote: and satori, i don't always write clearly cuz i'm at topa dopa 225 stage. nice. but i am just basing today's ramble on what i've seen as a counselor for shelter in speaking with men and women. victim's perpetrators. not my own personal experience at the moment. so, i'm not going to come back to these threads anymore for echo. you have all the support you need from the treatment facility. i would however support your wife and child. but no, you haven't earned my support. just because you've had a drinking problem as i does not earn my support. i draw the line at physical, emotional and mental abuse and destructive behaviors such as yours.

I completely agree with you bootcamp. domestic violence is a crime punishable by law.
once a man or woman breaks the physical abuse barrier it is extremely difficult to control or stop it or change it.
I am concerned for your wife echo. and you need more than just treatment for drug and alcohol abuse.

[Accountable for Me]

A LONG AND PAINFUL JEARNEY

Cummon people.... lets not judge

OK - this thread is starting to buuuuug me. AND I tend to have a big mouth when something is bothering me.

I do not approve in any way, shape or form of any sort of abuse. I think people who abuse people are cowards and need to control others in order to feel 'empowered'. However......

We do not know what has gone on in Echome's marriage. All we do know is that he admittedly hit his wife, he has substance abuse problems and he is left to figure it all out. I think it takes a BRAVE person to come onto a board and dump out his wrong-doings. This means he has taken the first step in admitting he has these problems.

He is taking the appropriate steps in finding ways to deal with his anger issues and substance abuse problems. Have we all forgotten about what hitting rock bottom is? He has hit his rock bottom.
'
If he had NO remorse for his actions he wouldn't of sought out the help from here, outpatient rehab program, counselling etc. He is feeling the pain from his horrific behaviour and is now trying to understand why he did what he did and is facing the consequences of his actions.

Every single one of us here knows that 1, 2, 15, 16, 18, 20, 100 days of being clean takes a lot of hard work and IT feels like a life time. No one here who has just come off of the alcohol can honestly say that a day doesn't feel like forever. We need to cut him some slack here people.

From what I am reading in his posts is he wants to help himself, he wants to try to fix the mess. Being hard on him about being impatient is a low blow. Sure... maybe he might be trying too hard to put the pieces back together in his marriage and maybe he might be pressuring her to forgive him, but I do think if any one of us were in his shoes we would be doing the same.

I read in many of the posts from others on this board about how 'impatient' they are in trying to kick the alcohol to the curb and we don't judge and say..... 'well how can you expect to be cured in 15 days? Are you f'n nuts man? Give your head a shake there buddy!' No we don't say those things because it is disregarding the feelings of others.

I agree he should give her space as I have said to him before. People do stoopid shit when they are desperate and this is a desperate man - who has hit his rock bottom.

I don't think we have any right to chase him off the boards, or say he is anything less than a person seeking help and being honest about it. Everyone DESERVES a second chance in life. He won't get away with what he did because he is going to court for it as he should. So let the law deal with that part

OK.... off my soapbox now.