Swirling MOD Fantasies...

[Persephone1]

Hi Gang, Happy Thursday.

I am in a lot of pain today, going on a 2 day headache. The euphoria of the 'good news' is waning because of it. I have found a pain management specialist, but can't get in for at least 2 weeks (really?) and they want my medical records before they'll even make an appointment. So, busy about that today. I'm feeling down and needy, so I'm just gonna share the struggle I'm faced with and hopefully you can all throw your two~cents at me...

My daughter (she's 25) has been bugging me to visit her (she's in California, where 'we' grew up, I was 17 when she was born). I told her I HAD to get a diagnosis first as my pain level is constant and thru the roof. So, yesterday upon calling her with news, she had the ticket information in front of her and we made the reservation. I leave May 1st! It's exciting and at the same time, I'm concerned for a few reasons:

1) Chronic pain is miserable. Nothing much is helping me cope with it. I have a few pain pills that I have to use very sparingly because my doc isn't empathetic to this whole diagnosis (I almost felt I should apologize for not having something much worse!): Degenerative Disc Disease and a Bulging Disc. So I am concerned that I will be miserable much of the time, but I promised her & can't get in to see my specialist for 2 weeks anyway. Being in too much pain ALWAYS puts me at risk of self~medicating with alcohol, but that can happen anywhere, anytime.

2) California, if I'm honest, is a REAL temptation for me. Abstinence is associated with my little cabin on the lake in MI, my projects, reading, long walks, my 'older' family, the 'chill' life here. California is where I had all my fun times, the struggles with alcohol came later in Colorado, so CA is a strange association for me. I can see me by the pool, cocktail in hand, hair blowing in the wind...:H Does this sound like a booze ad yet?!?

I am super close with my daughter, so she knows I'm sober and all the struggles I've gone through and that it's almost 3 months for me ~ SHE IS FULLY SUPPORTIVE. However, if I said I wanted to try and moderate she wouldn't 'scold' me either. I don't know why I'm even entertaining this moderation possibility, but I need to be truthful with myself and you guys about it if want to make solid decisions! Clearly, I have to get my head right BEFORE my plane leaves the ground. Gulp.

ANY/ALL INPUT IS APPRECIATED! Thanks, P.

[Siren136]

Swirling MOD Fantasies...

God, if I lived near you I'd offer you some prescription pain meds I have - I can't stand them. I can't offer you any advice on the pain, but sitting in a plane for a while can't be good for your back/neck.

What do you think you would gain from drinking? Pain relief? You know that the pain would still be there, but you'd also be dealing with feeling like crap from the booze. I would give a lot to have 90 days AF - please don't throw that away. Do you really want to go back to day 1? I'm sure there is plenty to do in CA without drinking. And you can still sit by the pool with an AF cocktail in hand - why not? I suggest anything you drink should be in a wine glass or cocktail glass. Just don't put AL in the glass!!

[K9Lover]

Swirling MOD Fantasies...

Perse-
EVERY alcoholic wishes they could moderate. Let me just tell you from experience that I have YET to see it happen. I can think of people that swore up and down (and caused a few wars on the boards) that moderation was the way to go! Well...go they did...and we haven't seen them since. I always say that IF there is a successful moderator...Please, Please share it with the rest of us! A successful moderator is a normal drinker. Normal drinkers don't end up on websites like MWO. If I somehow tamed the beast and became a normal drinker, believe me, I'd be shouting it from the rooftops...and especially HERE.

Please don't fall into the "trap" of the moderation fantasy. The TRUTH Of my drinking is DUI's, handcuffs and a cellmate named Diablo. What's YOUR truth? Something brought you here....

Much love :h:h:h

[Byrdlady]

Swirling MOD Fantasies...

Perse, as you know, I am one of the 'hardliners' when it comes to moderation. Since you asked, I will give my thoughts.
I know the idea of moderation seems 'too good to be true'. There's a good reason for that. It is. Yes, we've had the discussions on it here many times. There are a couple of vocal modders who have a good story and that is lovely. BUT FOR 99% of us, that just isn't the case. Sure you can look at the couple of people and say, there's no reason why I can't do that....until you try. If you REALLY dig into the data of the whole thing, the folks who are modding are slipping left and right, suffer from anxiety and depression and are still very much in the grips of AL. If they were truly modding, they'd be sticking to 7 units per week for female and 14 for males. I don't see that happening anywhere. If you are like me, that is about one day's allotment. I've been here for over 3 years now. I've seen a lot of people come and go. I have never seen this work according 'to the book'. NEVER. And I'll tell you, I have looked. Not only that, but remember, according to the MWO plan, moderation is achieved ONLY in accordance with those potent drugs and supplements. NOT from sheer willpower alone. As a fixture in the Newbie's Nest, I can tell you from bitter experience that I've seen this post a 1000 times from people having tried it, and regretting they gave up their quit for this goose chase. It is a fantasy you will chase for the rest of your life, if you choose.
I also have degenerative disks and arthritis. I live with a good amount of physical pain. This is nothing compared to what AL did to me. It took me down from the inside out. AL is never going to be the answer for us. If you are on this site you are one of us. You can't put the Jeannie back into this bottle. Maintain your quit at all costs. It is my most precious possession. PM me anytime if you want to talk. I will do anything to help keep you sober!! Byrdie

[kuya]

Swirling MOD Fantasies...

You are visiting the land of alternative therapy.....why not book yourself some massage, cranial osteopath session( I swear by mine...... So gentle), and sauna , spa and swim.

Do everything BUT drink, unless taken at high doses it is a terrible pain reliever anyway.

[NoSugar]

Swirling MOD Fantasies...

Hi, Persephone

I am so sorry about your chronic pain. I experienced back and leg issues a few years ago to the point of being unable to walk. I think that psychologically the worst part was not knowing if or when that level of pain would end. I am glad for you that you will be able to see a pain management specialist who surely will have tools and techniques available to you. Once I started recovery with a physical therapist with a good plan, the pain was still there but the panic about the future subsided. I hope that your therapy works on all levels for you, too.

I'm not sure whether your original plan was to become a moderate drinker or to abstain. If it is the latter, perhaps you could ask your daughter, who you said wouldn't scold you if you chose to moderate, to instead knock you upside the head if you even considered taking a drink :H:H:H! Plus, MWO and your friends here are always available as long as you have internet. If that might not be the case, get the phone # of a friend who you can call or text. I used that technique last week while away from home and it really helped keep me focused! If you want my #, just send me a PM ).

Even if your plan is to be a moderate drinker, I think it is too early to give that a try. We are at the same stage and the fuss made over me a couple days ago about hitting 90 days was so gratifying (Thank you for you colorful and creative post -- hearing from people I don't "talk" to much was so nice!). However, I honestly believe we are too new at this to mess around. I was pressured last week to have just one and to participate in toasts by a friend. I'm not mad at her - she doesn't understand addiction. I told her straight out that I wouldn't - couldn't!- have just one and that I didn't want it in my life anymore and didn't want to think about it but she just doesn't get it.

I think you and I have done a pretty great thing by making it this far but we still are novices in living adult life free of AL.

You know my bias on all this so you can read my post with that in mind but really, my hope for you and everyone here is to be done with this life-wrecking chemical and I think it is just too powerful a thing to try to tame.

Love and Strength to you, Persephone

Your Quit-time buddy, NS :h

[Rusty]

Swirling MOD Fantasies...

Hi Perse,

I have two herniated discs and arthritis in my neck....and I KNOW what it's like to be in constant pain. Here's what my wonderful alternative health care doctor recommended, and I do it, because it works for me: take 4 Advil Gelcaps with food. Avoid "inflammatory" foods: dairy, and wheat...especially white potatoes, bread, rice, and the evening shade vegetables of eggplant (not a problem for me) and tomatoes. Regarding the thoughts of moderating....tread carefully there. You will have 90 DAYS tomorrow!:goodjob: Don't blow it, please.:l When my family confronted me in 2008 about my drinking, I decided to see an AL therapist....and I told her defiantly...."but I can't NOT drink when I'm with my mother....we like to have our wine together. We ALWAYS have!!! Don't take that away from me!!" And her response was, "It's not what you have in your glass that matters. It's spending time with her." I did NOT believe her for the longest time, but she was right. I love CA....but alcohol will not make it more beautiful, or more relaxing. Alcohol will just slow you down to the point that you won't be motivated to see or do anything fun with your daughter. Not drinking will make it more enjoyable because you will be able to remember EVERYTHING about your trip. Stick close to us in the Abs Thread. We love having you with us.

[K9Lover]

Swirling MOD Fantasies...

Whereabouts will you be visiting in California?

[LibraryGirl]

Swirling MOD Fantasies...

Persephone, I sympathize with you about your mod fantasies. I had them as well. I have in fact, gone on to moderate. I don't crave AL very often, but sometimes I get the odd afternoon where I think about how nice it would be to get drunk...However, every time I do indulge in a little more than moderate, it's never as nice as it once seemed to be, and I have gotten too fond of my sobriety for it now. I have a couple of drinks every now and then, but to be honest I don't often socialize with drinkers so I'm not as tempted as I could be if I did....I urge you to weigh the good and the bad before you consider giving up your hard-earned sobriety. Modding is difficult and not particularly rewarding. Good luck to you!

[Guitarista]

Swirling MOD Fantasies...

Hi Persephone,

Sorry to hear of the physical pain you're going through. I wish for you a speedy solution to that.

I understand the self medicating temptation. But, If you drink, you will be inflicting another sort of pain on yourself. Excruciating emotional pain. You'll likely feel very disappointed in yourself and your thinking will no doubt become negative overnight, and who knows where that will lead? Most likely to further drinking, and that drinking will escalate. If you have gone 3 months AF with this pain, then i'm hoping you can keep going till you find an answer. This is easy for me to say, as i'm not in pain, but 3 months AF is amazing, and you are amazing.

Whatever you choose to do, we are behind you and are always here for you friend.

G bloke.

[Persephone1]

Swirling MOD Fantasies...

You are all so Precious to me :h Each of you have invaluable input & I take it to heart. I appreciate your honesty and your gentleness with me ~ I'm super needy and vulnerable right now.

K9Lover;1497056 wrote: Whereabouts will you be visiting in California?

First few days in San Francisco and then driving to Palm Springs for the week. We grew up in Huntington & I may spend a day there.

The last three months have been the equivalent of curling up on gramma's couch sucking ice~cream from a baby bottle, I swear. I have sheltered myself So much, maybe too much. I am guessing everyone has at least one or a few real 'triggers' or challenges that they have to confront ~ this is my first one. I know I have to put my big girl panties on and DO THIS. Deep down I know that trying to moderate will end in disaster for me, but honestly this is the first time since I quit that that I really even considered it, or felt tempted, or scared, or even sorta wanted to drink.

I agree, it is The Mecca of holistic health ( Kuya), but the drinking thoughts kept popping in when I was researching, so I decided to simply acknowledge them in hopes that airing it would deflate it ~ if that makes any sense? The whole, you're only as sick as your secret (thoughts), kinda thing. I actually do feel better. Now I can go back to planning great hikes, mineral baths, yoga and fantastic food! I will ask my daughter to smack me upside the head if I get outta line, ok NSugar? She is behind me abstaining 100%, so nothing but support there.

And the pain thing, well It Sucks. I am working really hard to do the right things to heal, clearly risking it by drinking would be super stupid ~ agreed.

So, :thanks: again friends. I will have internet and I will lean on you FOR SURE when I'm there. But I am gonna focus on all the positive things I can do and enjoy in the desert, sober!

Xoxox, P.

[YouKayBee]

Swirling MOD Fantasies...

mollyka;1497204 wrote: Hi Persephone -- lots of advice there - just wanted to share this with you.
My daughter is in Canada and so far I've had 2 holidays with her. The first one I was 'moderating' -- it was fine, I stuck within some sort of limits, no disasters and had a lovely holiday - but seemed to want to 'have lunch' where there would be wine, impatient to finish up in a theme park with my teenage son - so we could go for 'a drink' etc etc.
Second holiday I went on was January just gone. No drink, no question of drink --- I had a WONDERFUL holiday --- nothing 'limited' me - nothing became 'tiresome' because I fancied a glass or two of wine. I spent time - 'real' time, physically AND emotionally with my lovely daughter --- both great holidays, don't get me wrong -- but no comparison between the two.

Even if you could 'moderate' for a time - it is soooo time consuming IN YOUR HEAD -- it occupies your mind, the 'want' for a drink all returns so it's a constant battle 'will I, can I, when will I'? Anxieties, worries all return - it's a mugs game - honestly -- very occasionally I dip into the mods threads to see how people are getting on - at best they talk about it 'being hard work' - at worst they are slipping and sliding all over the place - it's a nonsense in truth - they MAY be able to grit their teeth and stick to their 1 or 2 drinks - in reality who WANTS to do that that has gone to the bother of googling 'alcoholism'????

Moderation doesn't work for almost everyone.

I can drink but only because I found success with the Sinclair Method which uses a specific medication to remove the cravings, and you have to drink for it to succeed. I'd not recommend this to you at this point because it's not guaranteed to work, it's a bumpy ride and requires obtaining a medicine you may or may not wish to take.

If you can get AF do it!

[Snapdragon]

Swirling MOD Fantasies...

Hi Persephone - I don't really feel qualified to offer much advice to you as I am less than a month AF and way behind you and everyone else who has offered support. But it has taken me years and years to get to the point I am at right now, putting behind me the desperation, the struggle, the cravings, the hangovers, the waking up not knowing what I said or did the night before - I really don't want to have to do this all over again - and to be honest, part of me still keeps wondering 'will I slip, will I be tempted, what about that holiday, what about this party coming up etc etc'

Like others have said - I think in the beginning we all fantasize about moderating - but in reality its probably as unrealistic as all the claims for cures for baldness! If Elton John hasn't found a cure for that with all his money then I assume there isn't one. Just like he hasn't found the perfect solution for moderating and remains AF after his stint with alcoholism. There isn't one!

I know it's a totally unscientific, but I'm trying the Ostrich approach - this is simply putting my head in the sand and trying not to think about it.

It is my husband's 50th birthday at the beginning of June and we have a huge party at our house with all of our family and loads of friends coming from all over the UK to join us in celebration. Not the most sensible plan for my early sobriety, but this has been planned and organised almost forever (it has been a running joke for years that if he reached 50 we would have this amazing big party and no-one let us forget!)

Apart from the logistics of the event, I'm not even thinking about drinking or not drinking and imagining what to say to people, or what I will do when they crack open champagne and hand round flaming Sambucas. I no longer drink. I will not drink and I will worry about everything else to do with the organisation, but not the 'drinking' one until the day of the party. I will not let the horrors and whys and what ifs cloud the next month until it happens - after all, I might get run over by a bus tomorrow and then I wasted a whole day worrying for nothing!! :H

The biggest gift I can give my husband on his birthday is my sobriety. He loves the new sober me and our relationship in the last couple of weeks has been better than it has been in years. I would be so ashamed if on the night of his birthday party I took away the one thing that he has valued so much and that has given him back the hope we had for our future.

Like Molly said - maybe this holiday with your daughter will be the BEST ever because of your sobriety. It will be different, but different for the better.

I do hope that your pain gets better soon. I had whiplash earlier in the year and was in agony for weeks, so totally sympathise. :l

[K9Lover]

Swirling MOD Fantasies...

LG - HI!!! We've missed you around the boards! :l

Perse - I'm glad you've decided to go AF on your vacation...you will enjoy it so much more! And your daughter sounds like a wonderful gal...I'm sure she'll be fully supportive!! How nice for you not to have to "fight" for what you want to do. I'm sure the two of you will have a great time together!

My daughter is only 15 but she is behind me all the way in whatever I am attempting at the moment. LOL Whether it be staying AF, losing weight or quitting smoking. It's so nice to have someone that "has your back". Just think, you have ALL OF US that have YOUR back!!! :h:h:h

[Wagoneer]

Swirling MOD Fantasies...

Hey Perse - I am a 5th gen So Cal girl myself. Grew up in the beach areas - born in Palos Verdes, lived in Redondo, Hermosa and spent loads of time in Huntington Beach. Live back east now. I wish I could moderate, but I don't have an "off" switch which I have learned the hard way. I am actually going on a quick turnaround trip to San Fran for a wedding. No time to go to the vinyards thankfully! lol No worry of drinking because I will be with my sister who knows about my "switch problem"...! Anyway, best of luck and enjoy your time. WIsh I had a magic wand to make your pain go away. I have back/neck issues myself.

Take care

Love Waggy